The Great Tremaine Edmunds Debate

[TheyCallMeAndy]

I feel like there is a decent chance we Klein and Edmunds flip positions this summer, and the team drafts a SS/LB hybrid like they were so rumored to have wanted to do last summer. 

[BillMafia716ix]

Him only being 22 is not an excuse it’s just facts. Hell, he just learned how to play through injury this past season. He’s not perfect by any means but this coaching staff believes in his ability to grow as a player. I mean the kid is only 22. 

[LABILLBACKER]

1 hour ago, TheyCallMeAndy said:

I feel like there is a decent chance we Klein and Edmunds flip positions this summer, and the team drafts a SS/LB hybrid like they were so rumored to have wanted to do last summer. 

I think that's exactly what they'll do. Klein for cheap will play the MLB role. Edmunds will finally slide outside and Sean will find that fast SS/LB hybrid. 

[Straight Hucklebuck]

Edmunds just doesn't play like a guy who has great instincts for the position. 

 

He's not a London Fletcher or Zach Thomas. 

 

Occasionally, he guesses right and blows up a play. 

 

But he hasn't done anything at MLB that warrants a large 2nd contract with the Bills. 

Edited February 5, 2021 by Straight Hucklebuck

[GunnerBill]

3 hours ago, TheyCallMeAndy said:

I feel like there is a decent chance we Klein and Edmunds flip positions this summer, and the team drafts a SS/LB hybrid like they were so rumored to have wanted to do last summer. 

 

The first bit? No chance. The second bit? Extremely likely IMO.

[ghostwriter]

Tremaine Edmunds the OLB has tremendous potential. Tremaine Edmunds the MLB will never live up to what we thought he’d be. No instincts, not physical enough to take on blocks. Could do very well covering the TEs of the league. Could see him beating tackles with his speed off the edge as a blitzer. He does not have what it takes between his ears to be the QB of our defense. Still a huge talent though at OLB.

[jdonley1180]

star lotulelei opting out has more to do with Edmunds average play, than Tremaine himself

[Big Blitz]

On 2/4/2021 at 6:55 PM, JohnNord said:

Over the past few days, Bills Twitter has been split over Tremaine Edmunds.
 

The Case for Edmunds:

WGR’s Nate Geary and Cover 1’s Erik Turner

Both have defended Edmunds and believes that he isn’t the problem.  They have also said THE excuse - he’s 22!  Also feels he’s a scapegoat and suffering from having a poor DL.

 

To be fair the stuff about the DL is a good argument but I’m not sure that’s the entire issue.  

 

The case against Edmunds:

Majority of Bills Twitter
 

They will point to weakness Edmunds has shown in run support, how easily he can get fooled and lost in space, and the lack of overall impact plays.  

Maybe this group doesn’t know the X and O’s but they see a player who appears to have struggled on the field quite a bit. 

My take

I normally agree with Nate and Erik but as of February 2021, I’m skeptical that Edmunds will ever live up to his potential in the defense.  I don’t think he got much better and while the issue of the DL and injuries are valid, I just don’t think he’s shown that he’s a special player.

 

I’m really hoping we see a different player because after next year there are no more excuses.  No more....”but he’s only 22.”  Because after 4 years the excuses need to stop.  
 

Many here were not high on Josh last offseason and look what happened.  So you never know....but we need to see more.  

 

PRO EDMUNDS

 

 

Against Edmunds:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It's a great post in reasons why we need to keep Milano.   

[GunnerBill]

11 hours ago, Victory Formation said:

Tremaine Edmunds the OLB has tremendous potential. Tremaine Edmunds the MLB will never live up to what we thought he’d be. No instincts, not physical enough to take on blocks. Could do very well covering the TEs of the league. Could see him beating tackles with his speed off the edge as a blitzer. He does not have what it takes between his ears to be the QB of our defense. Still a huge talent though at OLB.

 

The problem with this theory is the evidence doesn't really back it up. 72 blitzes this season and only 3 pressures. Tight Ends have been part of his coverage issue already this year in fact teams have specifically schemed to get tight ends against him. 

 

His best football was in 2019 as an MLB. That is where he is staying IMO.

Edited February 6, 2021 by GunnerBill

[RochesterLifer]

19 hours ago, Nextmanup said:

The fact that there is such debate surrounding his game is all anyone needs to know about how good he is.

 

Don't recall any debate at all about how good or bad Biscuit or Talley were, for example.

 

 

And where would that debate be had? Two Bills Drive? Twitter? Facebook? If Edmunds has played in '92, there would have been no debate about him, either.

[BuffaloRebound]

1 hour ago, GunnerBill said:

 

The problem with this theory is the evidence doesn't really back it up. 72 blitzes this season and only 3 pressures. Tight Ends have been part of his coverage issue already this year in fact teams have specifically schemed to get tight ends against him. 

 

His best football was in 2019 as an MLB. That is where he is staying IMO.

Agreed.  Most of his blitzes were straight up the gut though.  Edmunds is not good at shedding blockers head on.  He might actually be a better player coming off the edge, but not enough data to support that. I will say though that any splash plays he does make are on sweeps where he can out-run his blocker.  That might be some evidence he’d be better on the edge.  

[Ethan in Cleveland]

10 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

The problem with this theory is the evidence doesn't really back it up. 72 blitzes this season and only 3 pressures. Tight Ends have been part of his coverage issue already this year in fact teams have specifically schemed to get tight ends against him. 

 

His best football was in 2019 as an MLB. That is where he is staying IMO.

Covering a TE in the zone at the MLB spot is entirely different than on the edge. It's not even comparable.  

Edmunds would be a terror at OLB. Every bit as good as KJ Wright in Seattle and probably even much better. 

[Mat68]

On 2/5/2021 at 4:27 PM, BillMafia716ix said:

Him only being 22 is not an excuse it’s just facts. Hell, he just learned how to play through injury this past season. He’s not perfect by any means but this coaching staff believes in his ability to grow as a player. I mean the kid is only 22. 

You draft a linebaker he is the same age as Edmunds.  Back 2 back Pro Bowls, played hurt.  He is a building block on defense.  

[BADOLBILZ]

On 2/6/2021 at 6:15 AM, GunnerBill said:

 

The problem with this theory is the evidence doesn't really back it up. 72 blitzes this season and only 3 pressures. Tight Ends have been part of his coverage issue already this year in fact teams have specifically schemed to get tight ends against him. 

 

His best football was in 2019 as an MLB. That is where he is staying IMO.

 

 

I think the problem with everything he does is that there is no evidence to support the notion that he is exceptional at it.

 

Case in point:  you say he changes how teams attack the Bills offense.   That's pure fiction.   There is no fear of him. 

 

Because he has PROVEN over and over and over that he simply doesn't make plays as an off-ball LB.

 

As for not blitzing well.........while that is certainly a reason to question his pass rush ability.......blitzing and pass rushing from the LOS are not the same thing.

 

I'd like to see him on the edge.    Probably won't happen here but maybe at his next team.  

  

[DrPJax]

On 2/4/2021 at 7:47 PM, JGMcD2 said:

I vote we get rid of Edmunds and replace him with a linebacker from the 1980s. We will then be able to stop all the elite running offenses in the league like the Ravens, Colts, Patriots and Rams. 
 

Our 1980s LB won’t be able to defend against the pass, but that’s ok. 

Cornelius Bennett, Darryl Talley, Chris Spielman, Spikes were all just as fast , covered backs and TEs pretty well , but they also made impact plays that were memorable. How many of those memories do we have from Edmunds?   Mine are mostly seeing him being pushed ten yards downfield by a tight end, hitting wrong gaps, rarely hitting a back for a loss or causing a fumble hitting a back just a he gets a hand off, watching  O lineman get their hands on him and he never disengages until after the whistle , dropping back in third and long coverage deeper than the first down marker and then having guys catch routes in front of him and he tackles them after they get the yardage needed for the first down.  I could go on.  He has had  a few Pbus, 3 ints so far , 5 sacks in three years for a 6 ‘ 5” supposed athletic freak. I would take any of those guys I mentioned over this “ potential”.  ( Hey Chase Young is just out of college , not quite as big , yet he plays with aggression and was the defensive rookie of the year, so maybe we are waiting to long for this potential?
 

  This coverage  LB is adequate at that but that doesn’t make up for deficiencies in run stopping and I don’t see him elevating the other players like Talley , Bennett, Spielman all did.  I think he needs to be moved to OLB , maybe take some of the defensive alignment calls off his back and see if he plays up,to his potential if he is allowed to play free, get the QB, and not have to think so much. But if you can’t separate him from this d, this scheme , then he is what he is and that’s not enough to get us to be the team we want to be , a team that can beat KC. Watch TB linebackers today. I would love white over edmunds any day. 
 

As a quick tag as I am watching the pre game Super Bowl stuff, I have to say I am so over the NFL shoving race down my throat all day. I have turned the Channel several times and when I come back , it’s still more “ woke advice “ that has be being preached all year by social justice warriors. I have seen the  worst of race being used as a qualification. Med schools I applied too ( late 70’S, early 80’s) had certain quotoas forced on them for funding; I literally saw students given places in Med school that , GOD AS MY WITNESS, could not write complete sentences in their shared note taking responsibilities.  They got  held back but not dismissed as money had been “ invested “ in them being there. Worse they took the place of More qualified people just to artificially try to solve a more complicated issues. I watched today as the yearly Goodell interview was done and he “ promised” the NFL would do better, not  just with coaches but with GMs and owners!  Really ?  What chance do I have or ever had to be an owner of an NFL franchise or get paid millions of dollars to coach a game?  70% o the nfl are minority players who are paid millions and are among some of the most “privileged” people in our country.  That’s ok cuz it’s about talent , they earned their way on the field. I doubt any player was given his position just because of his skin color , not in this time , not now in this country.   Nfl, quit lying to me, quit telling me life should be fair or made more fair based on skin color. That just creates victims, victimhood, and takes away from those who earned their success.  Today, and this season, this focus has not been a good look. Hey how many coal miners or sons of coal miners or steel workers will be getting their NFL franchise Roger?🤔😉😇

( normally i would not say anything political on here but this was football related , and all day “ experts “ on addiction have been posting on here related to the tragedy involving the reid family and the family whose car was hurt) 

[Jerboski]

Seen about 5 plays from white and already wish we could swap them

[Mango]

On 2/5/2021 at 12:13 PM, ScottLaw said:

Pretty sure Edmunds missed one game last season, and I didn’t really see a whole lot of drop off in play from the defense with him out of the lineup. 
 

I don’t think you’ll see a whole lot of drop in play from the team as long as Allen, Diggs, and Tre White are in there..... those 3 are the real difference makers on the team. 

It looks like Poyer does a lot of backing up for Edmunds in both the pass and run game.  It’s a big part of why we struggle with multi dimensional teams like KC, Indy, and Tennessee.

 

I agree with another poster that said you keep Edmunds because the chances of upgrading aren’t great. Give him his 5th year and some more time, but I wouldn’t extend him. At least not for more than 10M per year. 
 

If Milano could stay healthy (snap count, not games played), this decision would be a no brainer. 

[Norcalbillsfan]

On 2/4/2021 at 4:13 PM, Rc2catch said:

I like to think it has a lot to do with scheme and pass rush. 
You can’t expect this guy to cover the middle of the field after 3 seconds. When he’s dropping back the quarterback needs to force a decision in less than 4 seconds or basically Edmunds is hung out to dry. 
There’s not a linebacker in the league that’s gonna drop like that and have success if the pass rush isn’t getting home. 
I do still think there’s a lot of room to grow in the run game, and I can agree with a lot of people who say he plays soft. Basically if anyone touches him he’s out of the play. Not a good trait to be in the middle. 
I hope they have plans to switch things up a little. I think getting a good edge pass rusher changes an awful lot in this defense. 

Agreed, mahomes made him look bad, looked him off all game and shredded him. But its tough for a lb to cover with no pass rush. My biggest disappointment with edmunds is getting completely taken out of running plays by anyone, including pass catching TEs. How are you a pro bowl LB and your getting consistently blocked completely out of a play by a 2nd string TE?

[YoloinOhio]

 

[SCBills]

I’d like to see him rush the passer more.  I think he has a lot of potential in that role.  
 

He’s an enigma though... so young, but that doesn’t change the fact that we have to make a decision on whether to pay him soon.