Brandon Beane end of season press conference 1/27 11am

[DrDawkinstein]

3 minutes ago, Chandler#81 said:

Well kind of.

 

’ok’ drafters? By who’s measure? Every single player drafted last year PLUS an undrafted FA rookie made the team and contributed to a Division Championship. We’ve also drafted Allen, Edmunds, Ford, Milano, T. White, H. Phillips, Oliver, Davis, Neal & others while trading a 1st Round pick for an All Pro WR. Perhaps your standards are a bit high. I’d challenge that OL has been the best FA work. Ask fans of any team what they think of their Oline.

 

I'd remove White, Milano, and Phillips (no Dawkins?) from that list since that was Whaley's scout team. (And maybe argue that our scouting and drafting was better under Whaley's team 😳)

 

I'd say Beane struck gold on Allen, which is definitely the most important pick any GM could make. But hasnt really hit on anyone else. Edmunds, Ford, Oliver have all be a bit disappointing. Big find on Gabe Davis, I'll give him that.

 

So yeah, "ok" drafting at best.

6 minutes ago, transplantbillsfan said:

 

McDermott's LB corp is generally just 2 guys and Milano and Edmunds make up a really good LB corp.

 

 

Duck and cover on that take!

[Alphadawg7]

3 hours ago, Process said:

This is the truth. We dont have nearly as much talent as people think we do. 

 

Allen is the difference between being one of the worst/best teams in the league. 

 

Hmmmm...seems to me that if you take Rodgers off of GB and Mahomes off KC that neither makes the playoffs.  Saying an elite QB is the difference between being one of the worst/best teams in the league is kind of a pointless statement.  

 

Our roster is actually better top to bottom than GB's and probably as good as KC's top to bottom.  

 

There is a reason we won 13 games and made it to the AFCCG.  This whole notion that our roster somehow sucks now because the game didnt go our way is just over exaggeration.  

 

End of the day, the game was decided on just a handful of plays.  Not allowing our TD at end of half forcing us to take 3, the missed XP played a big factor, and again not converting in the 3rd on 3rd and short in the Redzone.  The gap was not as big as people are making it out to be.  To be honest, our OC was out played by their DC and also our DC was outplayed by their OC.  Talent to talent, we are not that far apart from top to bottom on the roster.  

[Straight Hucklebuck]

9 minutes ago, Chandler#81 said:

Well kind of.

 

’ok’ drafters? By who’s measure? Every single player drafted last year PLUS an undrafted FA rookie made the team and contributed to a Division Championship. We’ve also drafted Allen, Edmunds, Ford, Milano, T. White, H. Phillips, Oliver, Davis, Neal & others while trading a 1st Round pick for an All Pro WR. Perhaps your standards are a bit high. I’d challenge that OL has been the best FA work. Ask fans of any team what they think of their Oline.

Chandler81, yes I didn’t say ‘ok’ on a whim. We’re okay drafters under Beane.

 

Edmunds finished Year 3, he’s okay, would anyone argue he’s Pro Bowl? Does he show consistent instincts?
 

Allen is obvious. 

 

Oliver is below average at this point? 
 

Ford has been a below average OG and OT when healthy.

 

Davis was a hit as a 4th Rd rookie.

 

Singletary and Moss are functional, but they’re average NFL backs at this point. 

Bass was a hit. Huge leg.

 

Taron Johnson and Phillips have been nice contributors. 
 

We can go through pick by pick, but I think we’ve been okay. 

[LOVEMESOMEBILLS]

1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

It's very true that Milano missing was far from the only factor in those games  Especially in the Tenn. game, our offense and ST put the defense in a big hole 4x.

 

That said, the defense did not play well against Tennessee and AZ.  At Tenn, just when we'd drawn within 4 pts 10-14, the D gave up a 12 play, 90 yd drive to go into half 10-21.  Then another 6 minute, 12 play, 75 yd drive when we'd scored a TD early in the 4th Q to possibly bring ourselves back within 2 scores.

 

The similar thing "ultimately lost on the Hail Mary play".  We were leading 23-9.  If the D doesn't give up 17 points (14 on 75 and 56 yd drives), we don't have to re-take the lead.  After we re-take the lead, if we don't let them convert 2 1st downs and move the ball 32 yds in 23 seconds, there is no "Hail Murray".

 

You can never say the team "ultimately lost on one play" IMO.

I get ya. But let's not forget Allen threw 2 picks in the 2nd half in Arizona, which swung momentum, and on the 2nd one wasted great field position at mid field down 26-23. The Cardinals averaged 26.6 points a game, which is what they had(26) before the hail mary. It was definitely a team loss.

 

Against Tennessee I didn't think the defense didn't play bad at all. They only gave up 334 yards, held Henry 57 yards on 19 carries and held Tannehill to 195 yards passing. Again it was the turnovers that killed us. First one happened right out of the gate on an interception that was returned to the Bills 16 yard line. 2nd interception was a killer down 21-10 and after the defense made Tennessee punt on their first possession of the 2nd half. They were on a 14 play 64 yard drive and Butler got his 2nd pick of the game returning it 68 yards to our 12 yard line. 3rd one was a fumble on a kickoff return that Tennessee recovered and returned to the 18 yard line. That's 3 TD drives of 16, 12 & 18 yards off of turnovers in that game. Without the turnovers it's 21-16 game and one of those turnovers almost for sure took points off the board for us. The defense didn't play great, but IMO they were not the main problem that night. 

 

 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

4 minutes ago, LOVEMESOMEBILLS said:

I get ya. But let's not forget Allen threw 2 picks in the 2nd half in Arizona, which swung momentum, and on the 2nd one wasted great field position at mid field down 26-23. The Cardinals averaged 26.6 points a game, which is what they had(26) before the hail mary. It was definitely a team loss.

 

Against Tennessee I didn't think the defense didn't play bad at all. (...)

 

Any win or loss is a team loss.  But the point to which I was responding was exculpating the defense in those games except for that one freak play.

 

I pointed out when and where I felt the defense played poorly in both games - which I see you're not willing or able to acknowledge or counter. 

So I'll leave it there.

[Alphadawg7]

1 hour ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

Well kind of.
 

The Bills have been ‘ok’ drafters with Beane, but they’ve had to supplement quite a bit of the roster via FA, and that’s always going to lead to pricey veterans. 
 

The WR group has been his best work, but we’ve struggled to find much impact on the DLine in the draft or FA.

 

Where do people come up with these statements?  Are you kidding?  Most of our AFC East champion and AFCCG team was built through the draft.  Find me a team that has had so many draft picks come in and turn the team around in the last 4 years than the Bills.  Just one.  

 

I mean first year we drafted guys like Tre, Dawkins and Milano...one draft.  Thats 3 studs.  

 

Not to mention following that up with Allen and Edmunds to go with Phillips, Taron, and Wyatt Teller in that draft (who has become a top end OL even though its not on our team anymore).

 

Then in 2019 we add Oliver, Ford, Singletary, Knox...all 4 of which are starting for this team.  

 

In 2020 we flipped a first round pick for Diggs, and added Moss, Davis, and Bass who all played big roles on this team this year as rookies, not to mention flashes from 7th Rond pick Dane Jackson and the potential still of AJ Espenesa.  

 

There is a reason Beane is a front runner for GM of the year, hes earned it by building a team through the draft mostly (last 3 drafts) and finding good values in FA to plug other holes and also having the guts to make a big trade for Diggs.  

 

If you think that draft history above is weak, well then I don't know what to tell you.  I promise you any team in the NFL would LOVVVVE that draft history result over the past 4 seasons.  

Edited January 27, 2021 by Alphadawg7

[Hapless Bills Fan]

17 minutes ago, Chandler#81 said:

Well kind of.

 

’ok’ drafters? By who’s measure? Every single player drafted last year PLUS an undrafted FA rookie made the team and contributed to a Division Championship. We’ve also drafted Allen, Edmunds, Ford, Milano, T. White, H. Phillips, Oliver, Davis, Neal & others while trading a 1st Round pick for an All Pro WR. Perhaps your standards are a bit high. I’d challenge that OL has been the best FA work. Ask fans of any team what they think of their Oline.

 

Just to add to this. 

 

People like to look at a single team's draft and say "oh, they're not drafting well, they've only drafted some decent players"

 

The context, of course, is that league-wide, GMs only hit on ~20-30% of the players in the first 4 rounds - and that's "becomes decent NFL player" not "lights up the league".

 

 

[Chandler#81]

It’s all relevant. No team knocks it out of the park every Draft. ‘Whaley’s last Draft’ had significant input by Sean -with the most likely understanding that Beane would soon join the team. You both know this, so please stop pretending just it because it’s never been discussed. Case in point, was Beasley broken leg a complete shock to the brass when he revealed it post season? Of course not. But you’ll never hear it from them. Beane’s scouting team is top notch and the envy of most teams. 

[GaryPinC]

3 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

 

It was really surprising to me to see how leaned out and muscular Epenesa was compared to his Iowa years.  I think his body fat % went way down and bulking muscle up during the season has to be a pretty tall order.  Looking forward to see where his weight is at next year, and it will probably be all muscle.  He played violently at Iowa, he may take a nice jump for us next year. 

[NewEra]

11 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

They struggled against the better offensive lines of the league. The Titans and Chiefs(hell the Chiefs back ups) just completely destroyed them upfront.... the Bills made the AFC Championship game because of Josh Allen and a terrific defensive effort against a one dimensional Ravens offense. ...Still Allen and the offense carried them most of the year by being aggressive and out scoring the opponent making the game out of reach for the opposing teams offense most of the time. 

But the ultimate goal is beating the Chiefs. Don’t think you can maintain status quo with the defensive line and expect things to change. 

 

They don’t have to maintain the status quo.....they can cut the players that want and not have major dead cap hits.  
 

You said:  Says no big moves in FA due to salary cap restrictions which is obvious.....but they wouldn’t be as restricted if they didn’t over value and over pay some really average players in last years FA. 

 

I don’t see how they are restricted because of the guys they signed last offseason. Many can be cut with little dead cap.  If he would’ve signed multiple players to contracts that weren’t essentially one year deals....then we’d be more restricted and in a bad spot.  But we’re not.  
 

He signed the players that were ok signing essentially a one year contract if the team chooses it to be.  
 

10. Shaq Lawson-  3 yr 30 mill 10 mil dead cap

9. Bud Dupree-  franchised- not available 

8. Robert Quinn- 5 years 70 mill 23 mill dead cap 

7. Matt Judon franchised- no available 

6. Everson Griffen- 1 year 6 mill

5. Dante Fowler- 3 years 45 mill- 15 mill dead cap

4. Arik Armstead- 5 yr 85 mill 34 mill dead cap

3. Shaquil Barrett-  franchised not available 

2. Yannick Ngakoue-  franchised not available 

1.  Jadaveon Clowney-  1 yr 13 mill-  

 

sooooo who did you want to sign instead of Addison?  
 

10. Michael Brockers 3 yr 24 mill 4 mill dead cap.

9. Mike Daniels- 1 yr 1.5 mill

8. Ndamukong Suh 1 yr 8 mill to play with Brady 

7. Michael Pierce- 3 yr 27 mill 5 mill dead cap

6. Jarran Reed 2 yr 23 mill 5 mill dead cap

5. Shelby Harris 1 yr 4 mill

4. Javon Hargrave- 3yr 39 mill 22 mill dead cap

3. Leonard Williams- franchised tag not available 

2. Dj Reader- 4 yr 53 mill 12 mill dead cap

1. Chris Jones-  wasn’t available 

 

who would you have signed instead of Butler and Jefferson?  2 mill dead cap between the both of them if we cut them.

 

you act as if signing those players this past offseason ties us to them.  Signing other players would have tied us to their contracts.....and not one of them is worth their contract and WOULD BE stuck with them.  We aren’t stuck with the guys Beane signed.....AND they helped us make it to the AFCCG.....regardless of how they played vs the titans (who we held Henry to 19 rushes 47 yards with an injured Milano and Edmunds) and the chiefs, who just happen to destroy everyone.  
 

your case is ridiculous.  Move on

[Hapless Bills Fan]

19 minutes ago, transplantbillsfan said:

Keep both.

McDermott's LB corp is generally just 2 guys and Milano and Edmunds make up a really good LB corp.

You can't throw away the really good in search of the Elite every year.

 

Ha.  This is the "Good is the Enemy of Great" conundrum.

 

We have a good OL - but it's not quite good enough against the very best front 7s.  So we probably need to make a move away from good in search of great.

 

We have a good defensive front 7 (front 6 really, given our Nickle Love).  But it's not quite good enough against the very best OLs, QBs, and TE.  So we probably need to make a move away from good in search of great.

 

My hope is that we'll be able to make deliberate, well-thought-out moves towards that goal rather than cap-driven clippage.

[Blank Stare]

2 hours ago, SCBills said:

 

It's not that simple. 

 

I'd rather not re-sign Milano AND cut Jefferson, Butler and Addison, thus allowing us to go after a pass rusher in Free Agency.  

 

Getting Star back, drafting a mid-round space eater and putting a legitimate pass rusher opposite Hughes next year is far more impactful than paying big money to not one, but two linebackers on a team who will have a QB commanding a ton of cap space soon.  

I hear you, but I guess it’s just preference.  I’d rather cut all those guys, keep Milano, and invest in young dline in the draft. I don’t know that you’re going to find a premier pass rusher in FA. Certainly not one that won’t command a ton of $. I agree they are critical to have. A really good pass rusher that can change a game is something we’ve lacked for a while now, but I’d invest some draft picks in the dline. At least 2 picks on the dline and maybe grab 1-2 decent (but not high priced) guys in FA. Keep Jerry on another year if you can to teach the young cats. 

[TUBSTER]

3 hours ago, Bangarang said:

We were 24th in rush attempts per game. TB was 28th, KC was 23rd and Green Bay was 15th. 
 

KC and GB were 11th and 6th in yards per rush respectively. We were 19th and TB was 26th.

 

TB is worse than us running the ball. All the teams in the conference championship game live and die by the arm of their QB. 
 

 

I think that a reliable TE opens the game up for Allen more than a RB would, although I think we need to target both this off-season/draft.  Even a guy who is half as good as Kelce (Tonyan as far as receptions and yards) is better than our entire TE group.  It's not realistic to assume that we can just find a Travis Kelce, Darren Waller, or George Kittle, but we can find someone around Tonyan's level and an upside of one of those guys mentioned, especially with Josh throwing them the ball.  

 

Three of the teams in the championships have legit number 1 receivers and very reliable TE's.  We were the only team that didn't and I think it really hurt us.  

[NewEra]

51 minutes ago, BuffaloRebound said:

In terms of free agents, Leonard Williams.  
Guys who might be available via trade (also longer in the tooth) include Khalil Mack and Fletcher Cox.  

Giving up multiple 1st rd picks and paying the guy 6839 million a year is probably not in our plans.

 

23 mill a year and trading multiple picks for Cox.  I just don’t see it ever happening. 

 

I’d love Williams....again.....22 mill+ might be out of our range and that’s if the giants let him out of the building. 
 

3 great players.  Is the cost too much?  We’ll see 

 

 

43 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Jefferson has 0 dead cap OTC.  Addison's salary is $6.625M not $10.2M (that's his cap number), though he's due $8.225 once "likely to achieve" bonuses are added.

 

My question isn't, what is the dead cap associated with each of these cuts. 

 

It's, "what does little dead cap mean to you?"  In a year with a possible cap of $175M, what would be minimal dead cap?  5% or $8.75M?  10% or $17.5M?  What? 

The Bills are currently carrying $2M dead cap from cuts this year.

 

 

Little compared to every other impact free agent DL that we could’ve signed last season.

[Blank Stare]

2 hours ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

You're just going to have to deal with that. If not with Milano, then it will be someone else. This is exactly what happens to good teams who draft well. They'll re-sign some/most guys, but you can't keep everyone. That is literally how the system is setup. It wants to create Free Agents.

 

 

I agree, we can’t keep everyone, but we can keep a core group of homegrown guys. Guys that make up our core should be retained. Like Tre and Dawkins, I believe our core should include Milano. Even if that means letting Tremaine go when he’s up. 
 

But it matters not what I think. Beane is going to do what Beane is going to do. I just hope if he lets Milano go, we aren’t sitting around saying how nice it would’ve been to only have had to cut guys like Jefferson, Addison, or Butler to keep him just for the sake of having bodies on the Dline. 
 

Good chat though. I haven’t fully made peace with there not being any games this Sunday, so this has been fun to discuss. Even if we disagree. 

[Bobby Hooks]

A balanced offense sounds like one if those things you need but I hope it doesn’t interfere with what we do well. Which is passing the football. 

 

I do think we could use a really good pass catching RB. Not that i want to run a ton, but it would be nice to get some yardage when we actually do. 

 

Its basically a wasted play right now. Also, a good pass catching RB that Allen trusts would only help the passing game. I do think he was a little gun shy hitting Singletary as he was probably concerned he might not catch it, or not able to do anything with it if he did. Allen could benefit greatly having a guy in there he trusts to get us in better position for 2nd or 3rd down. 

 

Not to mention it would be one more player the Defense would have to account for. The Chiefs were not worried one bit about Singletary. And he proved them right not to be. 

Edited January 27, 2021 by Bobby Hooks

[RobbRiddick]

3 hours ago, Rc2catch said:

Lol reading this comment section you’d think we are Miami blowing the big game to get in the playoffs. 
Funny how some of y’all are missing for weeks at a time until we have a loss. Beane knows what he’s doing. We complained all those years for a stable front office who plans ahead and retains players and isn’t afraid to make a big move. Nothing is going to be perfect but they’re building every year and keep getting better. What good is the negative complaining doing? Everyone sees the needs and where we’re short. They’ll fill the spots they can and coach up the rest. 

 

Very true.

 

The recency effect is huge in sports. When you look at some of the teams we beat, and how we beat them, a lot of that gets forgotten. Everyone was talking about how good Miami's D was and how few points they'd given up. We DESTROYED them with ease. Then people were saying how good the Ravens were, how the weather in Buffalo would benefit their world beating run game, and we held them to 3 points and made Lamar look so bad a lot of their fans are now questioning whether they can ever reach a SB with him, let alone win one.

 

Everyone was high on the bills before this game and yeah, we got stomped. But KC is light years ahead of every other team in the league. Obviously we need to aspire to be able to beat them, but we're not suddenly an average team because they beat us. We're a very good team who you'd put money on to beat pretty much any team in the league right now... except KC.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

4 minutes ago, NewEra said:

Little compared to every other impact free agent DL that we could’ve signed last season.

 

When we cut people we leave holes.  And when the amount we save is lessened by accumulating dead cap, we also lessen the amount we can use to sign a replacement. 

 

I don't mean to be a dick, but in proposing cuts, I'd like to understand what "little dead cap" means relative to the proposed cap floor next season.  $8M?  $17M?

 

People, not saying this is you and exaggerating (slightly) are always talking about "cut John Brown and the entire starting DL to save $25M in cap and then use that money to resign OLmen and extend Allen" without thinking about "well, you know, we cut all those guys and we need some new DL and where are we gonna get better guys for less money?".  You can kind of squint and see an argument that Davis could become a #2 WR next year and maybe McKenzie could grow into the Burner role or Stills might take a "Prove it!" deal as a speedster. 

 

But on DL, I don't think we have the answer to all those cuts in house on our PS or roster.

[NewEra]

1 minute ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

When we cut people we leave holes.  And when the amount we save is lessened by accumulating dead cap, we also lessen the amount we can use to sign a replacement. 

 

I don't mean to be a dick, but in proposing cuts, I'd like to understand what "little dead cap" means relative to the proposed cap floor next season.  $8M?  $17M?

 

People, not saying this is you and exaggerating (slightly) are always talking about "cut John Brown and the entire starting DL to save $25M in cap and then use that money to resign OLmen and extend Allen" without thinking about "well, you know, we cut all those guys and we need some new DL and where are we gonna get better guys for less money?".  You can kind of squint and see an argument that Davis could become a #2 WR next year and maybe McKenzie could grow into the Burner role or Stills might take a "Prove it!" deal as a speedster. 

 

But on DL, I don't think we have the answer to all those cuts in house on our PS or roster.

I said all of this in reaction to @ScottLaw stating that we can’t sign free agents this year because Beane overplayed for free agents that weren’t worth it last year...... that is not the case.

 

Consider the alternatives:

-resign Shaq and Jordan to multi year deals that we couldn’t get out of.....hence leaving us in the position of not being able to sign free agents.

- sign lesser players than the guys we signed.....and had a lesser defense that might not have gotten us to the AFCCG.

- I listed the free agent DL in my previous post. Are there any free agents in the lists I posted that would’ve given us a better pass rush and helped us beat the chiefs? 

 

 

[NewEra]

4 hours ago, ScottLaw said:

Says no big moves in FA due to salary cap restrictions which is obvious.....but they wouldn’t be as restricted if they didn’t over value and over pay some really average players in last years FA. 

 

4 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

I’m not acting like that at all....They are restricted if they keep those defensive lineman and Beane made it sound like he wanted to keep it status quo.....obviously they have some cap to work with if they let go of Butler, Addison, and Jefferson as I think they should. 
 

There is nothing spectacular about any of those players and they are getting paid a significant amount of money which was my point about him allocating a lot of cap resources to average players. 
 

Justin Zimmer also helped us make it to the championship game does that make him a good player? 

Like i said before, who would you have signed instead of Addison?

 

who would you have signed instead of Butler and Jefferson?

 

You state that Beane signed players that weren’t worth their contracts as a reason why we can’t sign FAs this offseason.....then explain who he could’ve signed that would’ve been better?

 

Beane added players that would accept contracts that would be wiped off the books in 2021 if he so desired.  I order to do that, sometimes you have to pay a little extra.  Addison signing for 10 mill a year is a drastic overpay for a guy that had no less than 9 sacks in each of the last 4 years?  
 

jefferson was viewed as one of the best under the radar signings in the league.  It sucks that star opted out and forced him to play out of position the majority of the year.  
 

butlers play in the 2nd half of the year was one of the big differences in the units turnaround.  He was solid.  He’s not chris Jones.....but no one is.....and that type of player wasn’t available.  There wasn’t a Frank Clark type player available either, as we already gave up our 1st rd pick in order to transform our lowly passing offenses into one of the best in the league.