Brown- should they cut him?

[Sundancer]

2 hours ago, Aussie Joe said:

Hey John... been on your side for months...

 

We’re you happy with him today?

 

Yes... I don’t want him to be the scapegoat... I really wanted him to stand up today though... they needed him..

Not the same playing with the injury. He’s still good. 

[TPS]

3 hours ago, BringMetheHeadofLeonLett said:

Keep the talent and regroup.  We got out-coached by Andy Reid.  Get a breakout threat at running back, TE, and rework defensive personnel.  Not saying there can't be a better cost/youth concept than Brown going forward, but he was definitely part of the reason we made the AFC Championship game.  

Andy Reid out-coaches everyone. 

[machine gun kelly]

2 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

Joe right now we are thinking with our hearts whenever things calm down we start thinking with our heads we will realize everything that John Brown is done for this team and how he was Josh Allen’s primary receiver before digs came along John Brown bring some thing that you cannot easily find when healthy

 

Now what I wanna know it’s just how injured John Brown is that is the underlying piece that we don’t have that the bills will

This is why I stated on the thank you thread, first I am too grateful, and that I was too angry and upset to post last night.  Second, I thought it was too early to think about player decisions.  You make a solid point about his injury.  To me that is the determining factor as to whether he stays or goes.  It’s hard to believe he fell off a cliff from a 1,000 yard season, or was he trying to be a trooper and come back too early when maybe IR would’ve been the better option.  He was also very productive in Baltimore, just didn’t fit into their scheme.

 

So, John I’m taking a breath and let’s see how he does in OTA’s.  That’s the gamble of getting something small in a trade, or cutting after we see what he looks like later.  I just don’t think McBeane are a tandem that makes quick decisions.  They are both more methodical in their choices.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

4 hours ago, transplantbillsfan said:

 

Beasley sticks. Brown is expendable... and saves something like $8 million for our Cap if we cut him.

 

Shame because when healthy I think he's an excellent #2. But Davis will very much suffice and we need money to sign the likes of Allen and Milano.

 

Not sure Milano is worth it, given injury history, meh, I just don't know.

[ProcessTruster]

4 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

No need to make a hole where one should not exist restructure him

He's the only speed guy the Bills have.  He isn't going anywhere until they get another 4.4 guy in there.  

[auburnbillsbacker]

I think a lot depends on what they plan on using the 8 million for.  I think they should see what free agents they could get then cut as needed.  If we are not picking up new players I see little reason to cut him.  

[SectionC3]

3 hours ago, Ethan in Portland said:

Brown and Morse are the two most likely cuts to save cap space

If Brown was injured I'd favor keeping him one more year.  I'm ready to draft a center and move on from Morse and that bloated deal for an average player.

Brown is a goner.  Q. Jefferson, Addison, and Vernon Butler might find themselves on that list, too.  I'd rather give Brown's money to Milano.  It's a no-brainer.  The D-line will be rebuilt this off-season, as will perhaps the right side O-line (out of cap necessity, more than anything else; Feliciano may get Morse's money) and our RB corps.  It's flaming obvious that we lost last night in the trenches.  

[Mr. WEO]

3 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

Better than a 1000 yard receiver?Because that’s what he was just a year ago

 

He was a 1000 yard receiver because there was no Diggs or Davis.

 

Maybe it was the injuries, but his downfield speed is gone.   Daboll rarely send him more than 15 yards downfield and Josh hardly looked his way anymore except as a checkdown.  His YBC has been dropping like a stone, as has his average depth of target.  Daboll has given up on the "Smoke" legend.

 

If they let him go, there would be no impact on this Offense.  He's a playoff ghost his whole career.

.

 

 

[colin]

46 minutes ago, HOUSE said:

He used to be a pretty good writer then he leaked some player information and Beane got pissed

 

What was that about?

 

 

so, players who im like 50/50, where losing them creates a hole at least on paper, but these guys aren't really difference makers:

Brown (not over all super dynamic, speed and some ability, but hurt too much too)

Milano (i like the way he plays, i think he's an above replacement level guy, but he's hurt way too much and is not a game breaker, i could be convinced he needs to stay though)

Mongo (love the guy, but he's clearly a lesser player than teller, who we sadly let go for cheap.  has been hurt and is over all a replacement level guy)

Josh Norman (just done at this point)

Levi Wallace (a tad better than Norman, but a weakness at corner)

Klien (had some solid games as a pass rusher, but had more negative impact overall)

all the DL they brought in this year (Butler, Addison, Williams) didn't even manage to equal the guys they replaced, who aren't stars.

Motor (not as good as a JAG 3rd stringer, rookie deal so we don't need to move on from him)

 

 

Guys who losing would make a real hole and we aren't likely to get a solid replacement for

Morse (paid like an all pro, plays just above average)

Edumnds (sick talent, just a bad angle and mistake machine, although he brings some good plays sometimes.  could be out of position, cheap contract so he obv gets at least another year)

Knox (clearly not a great player, sick athlete, has been improving at least some tho, on rookie deal so whatever)

 

and there you have it, we don't have enough playmakers (diggs, allen, white) and the guys we have around them are just not good enough.

 

There was an athletic article on the final 4 teams, the bills had more free agent players than any other team.  a couple of those have been decent, but look at who TB brought in on D (suh and JPP) and who we did (a bunch of no ones, including Murphy who barely plays) and it's obvious where the issue is

 

 

 

[SectionC3]

4 minutes ago, colin said:

 

What was that about?

 

 

so, players who im like 50/50, where losing them creates a hole at least on paper, but these guys aren't really difference makers:

Brown (not over all super dynamic, speed and some ability, but hurt too much too)

Milano (i like the way he plays, i think he's an above replacement level guy, but he's hurt way too much and is not a game breaker, i could be convinced he needs to stay though)

Mongo (love the guy, but he's clearly a lesser player than teller, who we sadly let go for cheap.  has been hurt and is over all a replacement level guy)

Josh Norman (just done at this point)

Levi Wallace (a tad better than Norman, but a weakness at corner)

Klien (had some solid games as a pass rusher, but had more negative impact overall)

all the DL they brought in this year (Butler, Addison, Williams) didn't even manage to equal the guys they replaced, who aren't stars.

Motor (not as good as a JAG 3rd stringer, rookie deal so we don't need to move on from him)

 

 

Guys who losing would make a real hole and we aren't likely to get a solid replacement for

Morse (paid like an all pro, plays just above average)

Edumnds (sick talent, just a bad angle and mistake machine, although he brings some good plays sometimes.  could be out of position, cheap contract so he obv gets at least another year)

Knox (clearly not a great player, sick athlete, has been improving at least some tho, on rookie deal so whatever)

 

and there you have it, we don't have enough playmakers (diggs, allen, white) and the guys we have around them are just not good enough.

 

There was an athletic article on the final 4 teams, the bills had more free agent players than any other team.  a couple of those have been decent, but look at who TB brought in on D (suh and JPP) and who we did (a bunch of no ones, including Murphy who barely plays) and it's obvious where the issue is

 

 

 

 

Feliciano and Allen are TIGHT.  And the line gelled when Feliciano returned.  No way they let him walk if his contract demands are reasonable.  Not a chance. 

[Hebert19]

5 hours ago, Aussie Joe said:

Firstly... let me say that I have been a defender of Brown this year when he was long term injured and came back and hasn’t been playing his best towards the back end of the regular season when the O was humming...

 

I was originally thinking that he might be up for a Beane haircut similar to Kroft and Star last  year .... and I would have been ok with that previously...

 

Unfortunately, my thoughts are now that he hasn’t performed this playoff season, and let’s be honest... we needed him to show up today....and whilst he wasn’t the only one to blame... his salary next year makes him stand out...

 

I think it’s time to move on from Brown...and save the 7-8 Mil or so... nothing personal and I sincerely wish him well at his next stop 

1.   Need to make sure he gets healthy 

2.   Restructure will be first option.  

[colin]

Just now, SectionC3 said:

 

Feliciano and Allen are TIGHT.  And the line gelled when Feliciano returned.  No way they let him walk if his contract demands are reasonable.  Not a chance. 

 

 

he's better than the TRASH we had before him, sure, that's why i'm 50/50 on it.  he has a lot of heart, but not as much talent.

[BananaB]

Brown will be gone. Offense looked better without him and despite having Diggs take all the pressure off him he still can’t make tough catches. 

[BigBuff423]

Difficult decisions will need to be made across the board and I think Beane is the right man to make them. I also think there will be a head-scratcher or two with people questioning their decisions. But keep in mind Beane is the guy who moved Darby and Watkins before it was popular and ate a terrible year of Dead Cap in order to free up the money for guys like Mongo, Morse, Brown and Beasley. Now, Beane will have more difficult decisions to make about whom to retain and whom to send packing. 

 

Brown seems like a good guy and speed for days, but this Offense needs more. So, we'll see if Beane thinks the open market will give him more value than what Brown brings. For example, JuJu is likely to be a FA and while I'm not saying the Bills *should* or will sign JuJu if he makes it to market, but right Spotrac is projecting JuJu at ~$16 million / AAV and when Brown is at $8, it causes you to ponder the "value" between Brown and JuJu. 

[Doc]

Likely will have to be a cut given cap savings.  Hopefully he takes a pay cut but at his age, staying healthy isn't likely.

[Steptide]

6 hours ago, Aussie Joe said:

Firstly... let me say that I have been a defender of Brown this year when he was long term injured and came back and hasn’t been playing his best towards the back end of the regular season when the O was humming...

 

I was originally thinking that he might be up for a Beane haircut similar to Kroft and Star last  year .... and I would have been ok with that previously...

 

Unfortunately, my thoughts are now that he hasn’t performed this playoff season, and let’s be honest... we needed him to show up today....and whilst he wasn’t the only one to blame... his salary next year makes him stand out...

 

I think it’s time to move on from Brown...and save the 7-8 Mil or so... nothing personal and I sincerely wish him well at his next stop 

I have a feeling this part of the reason we signed stills. We can get the same production and pay alot less Imo. 

[Rc2catch]

Brown is a good player, but he’s expendable. He didn’t bring his A game this year and speed is a youth game and not that hard to find. They’re gonna need money in other positions. Davis while not the same kind of player made brown expendable with his production when smoke was out. With Beasley and Diggs as the main guys they simply can’t invest into brown. 

[Golden]

Changes coming:

"That's the team we gotta beat. So we gotta do everything with that in mind this offseason." - Sean McDermott, #Bills coach, on the #Chiefs. That's a message 30 other teams need to adopt, especially on the defensive side. @nflnetwork @AroundTheNFL

3 minutes ago, Steptide said:

I have a feeling this part of the reason we signed stills. We can get the same production and pay alot less Imo. 

John Brown: 40 time @4.34

Kenny Stills: 40 time @4.38

[BillnutinHouston]

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