leh-nerd skin-erd Posted January 13, 2021 Posted January 13, 2021 1 minute ago, Tenhigh said: Doesn't mean they don't agree with a lot of other points in this thread. Not everyone wants to find common ground, Ten. We can all agree on that as well.
jrober38 Posted January 13, 2021 Posted January 13, 2021 1 minute ago, Tenhigh said: Doesn't mean they don't agree with a lot of other points in this thread. The things we agree on don't matter if they can't accept reality. Imagine someone broke into your house and trashed your home. Would you be willing to "move on" and not hold them accountable because you have a few things in common?
Tenhigh Posted January 13, 2021 Author Posted January 13, 2021 (edited) 16 minutes ago, jrober38 said: The things we agree on don't matter if they can't accept reality. Imagine someone broke into your house and trashed your home. Would you be willing to "move on" and not hold them accountable because you have a few things in common? After they fixed what they broke and faced any legal consequences, I would certainly try. But this thread isn't about that. It's about finding things that everyone, regardless of party or race or gender or anything, can agree on and build from there. And for the record, one of the points of common ground we identified was that people should be responsible for their actions, whether it's trashing my living room, burning a Wendy's, or Storming the Capitol. Edited January 13, 2021 by Tenhigh
jrober38 Posted January 13, 2021 Posted January 13, 2021 1 minute ago, Tenhigh said: After they fixed what they broke and faced any legal consequences, I would certainly try. But this thread isn't about that. It's about finding things that everyone, regardless of party or race or gender or anything, can agree on and build from there. OK. After all the bad actors wind up incarcerated and we see who is left, we can discuss coming together. Trump's slogan for years has been you don't have a nation without laws. That applies here. They don't get to have attempted to overthrow the government without hundreds of people winding up in federal prisons for the foreseeable future. 1
Backintheday544 Posted January 13, 2021 Posted January 13, 2021 1 minute ago, jrober38 said: OK. After all the bad actors wind up incarcerated and we see who is left, we can discuss coming together. Trump's slogan for years has been you don't have a nation without laws. That applies here. They don't get to have attempted to overthrow the government without hundreds of people winding up in federal prisons for the foreseeable future. The best analogy for the let’s just move on people I’ve seen was after Timothy McVeighs bombing, did we all say well let’s let him be and let’s all move on! No, it was find the people responsible, put them in jail. 2
jrober38 Posted January 13, 2021 Posted January 13, 2021 1 minute ago, Backintheday544 said: The best analogy for the let’s just move on people I’ve seen was after Timothy McVeighs bombing, did we all say well let’s let him be and let’s all move on! No, it was find the people responsible, put them in jail. This is how the justice system has always worked. Throw the book at the person if they're black or brown. Slap on the wrist if they're a white "Christian". 1
leh-nerd skin-erd Posted January 13, 2021 Posted January 13, 2021 5 minutes ago, jrober38 said: This is how the justice system has always worked. Throw the book at the person if they're black or brown. Slap on the wrist if they're a white "Christian". Timothy McVeigh was executed. It less of a slap on the wrist, more of toxic cocktail that caused his bodily functions to cease. You probably knew this at one time? 8 minutes ago, Backintheday544 said: The best analogy for the let’s just move on people I’ve seen was after Timothy McVeighs bombing, did we all say well let’s let him be and let’s all move on! No, it was find the people responsible, put them in jail. Common ground here, though there are those who think that McVeigh's execution was an afront to humanity and civility.
Doc Brown Posted January 13, 2021 Posted January 13, 2021 26 minutes ago, jrober38 said: This is how the justice system has always worked. Throw the book at the person if they're black or brown. Slap on the wrist if they're a white "Christian".
jrober38 Posted January 13, 2021 Posted January 13, 2021 22 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: Timothy McVeigh was executed. It less of a slap on the wrist, more of toxic cocktail that caused his bodily functions to cease. You probably knew this at one time? Hopefully similar things happen to the people who tried to overthrow the federal government last week.
leh-nerd skin-erd Posted January 13, 2021 Posted January 13, 2021 39 minutes ago, jrober38 said: Hopefully similar things happen to the people who tried to overthrow the federal government last week. Which people?
Tenhigh Posted January 13, 2021 Author Posted January 13, 2021 58 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: Which people? @TB Bills what are you "meh"ing here?
leh-nerd skin-erd Posted January 13, 2021 Posted January 13, 2021 Just now, Tenhigh said: @TB Bills what are you "meh"ing here? Free speech would be my guess.
oldmanfan Posted January 14, 2021 Posted January 14, 2021 The OP to his credit is looking for common ground, asking for things all can agree upon. To the shame of many who have posted, rather than engaging in the spirit of such, you hijack the thread to continue denigrating the other side. Neither side of the political spectrum has all the answers. We should however be able to agree of some basics. I listed several previously. How about focusing on that vs. negativity? 1 1
jrober38 Posted January 14, 2021 Posted January 14, 2021 4 hours ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: Which people? The treasonous ones who tried to overthrow the government after a free and fair election. 1 hour ago, oldmanfan said: The OP to his credit is looking for common ground, asking for things all can agree upon. To the shame of many who have posted, rather than engaging in the spirit of such, you hijack the thread to continue denigrating the other side. Neither side of the political spectrum has all the answers. We should however be able to agree of some basics. I listed several previously. How about focusing on that vs. negativity? Common ground would be great. But it's never going to happen. The US feels like it's at the cusp of a civil war. Almost half of the country completely despises the other half with some people in the middle who don't really care either way. The US has become unbelievably polarized, and people in dense urban areas have next to nothing in common culturally, socially or philosophically with people who live in rural areas. I honestly think the US is essentially a failed state at this point. The ideas that America was founded on were great, but far too much power was ultimately given to the Executive Branch and things have really gotten out of control.
leh-nerd skin-erd Posted January 14, 2021 Posted January 14, 2021 1 hour ago, oldmanfan said: The OP to his credit is looking for common ground, asking for things all can agree upon. To the shame of many who have posted, rather than engaging in the spirit of such, you hijack the thread to continue denigrating the other side. Neither side of the political spectrum has all the answers. We should however be able to agree of some basics. I listed several previously. How about focusing on that vs. negativity? Is this directed at anyone in particular?
transplantbillsfan Posted January 14, 2021 Posted January 14, 2021 11 hours ago, jrober38 said: OK. After all the bad actors wind up incarcerated and we see who is left, we can discuss coming together. Trump's slogan for years has been you don't have a nation without laws. That applies here. They don't get to have attempted to overthrow the government without hundreds of people winding up in federal prisons for the foreseeable future. This. Republican claims against impeachment because it would "further divide our country" is a Red Herring." Everyone at the capital that deserves it should be convicted just like Trump's impeachment is deserved. I've said many times that the words of the POTUS matter and this dismissive attitude of what he has said and tweeted for 4 years has been hard-headed ignorance. Yes of course Trump's words over the last 4 years has led to more White Nationalism. Yes of course Trump's words in the last year regarding mask wearing and "Covid-as-a-hoax" has led to more infections and deaths. Yes of course Trump's words on the 6th influenced the insurrection on the Capital. Letting him get away with it at this point isn't just about precedence for future Presidents, it's about precedence for his post-Presidency because at this point the man shouldn't just not be able to run for office again... he also shouldn't have political power over elected officials. Stripping him of any prospective future in office again will help a great deal with the latter. 1
Buffarukus Posted January 14, 2021 Posted January 14, 2021 (edited) 6 hours ago, oldmanfan said: The OP to his credit is looking for common ground, asking for things all can agree upon. To the shame of many who have posted, rather than engaging in the spirit of such, you hijack the thread to continue denigrating the other side. Neither side of the political spectrum has all the answers. We should however be able to agree of some basics. I listed several previously. How about focusing on that vs. negativity? its a trained response at this point. actually saying i agree takes a person off guard as they are accustomed to certain talking points and veering from the script may expose faults in their own beliefs. its uncharted waters. it can be quoted and used against them. hopefully society learns to swim because this is no longer a kiddy pool. there are many common enemys that are watching and enjoying the show. Edited January 14, 2021 by Buffarukus 1
Motorin' Posted January 14, 2021 Posted January 14, 2021 (edited) 11 hours ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: Which people? There are credible reports that Republican members of Congress gave private tours to demonstrators the day before the riot. If there is evidence that members of Congress gave assistance with planning the riot, how should they be treated? Edited January 14, 2021 by Motorin'
oldmanfan Posted January 14, 2021 Posted January 14, 2021 6 hours ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: Is this directed at anyone in particular? Nope, general statement but certainly not you. 1
leh-nerd skin-erd Posted January 14, 2021 Posted January 14, 2021 7 hours ago, Motorin' said: There are credible reports that Republican members of Congress gave private tours to demonstrators the day before the riot. If there is evidence that members of Congress gave assistance with planning the riot, how should they be treated? First, what you think is credible may not reach be credible to me in the least. I question everything, but certainly question reports that come less than 10 days after something as politically volatile as an assault on the Capitol. There are many, many cases where credible sources turn out to not be credible at all. There is also a massive push for political gain that has little to do with the best interest and unity of the country. To answer your question, if members of congress assisted in the planning and/or execution of the assault, they should be investigated and charged with the crime commensurate with their action. The question I asked the other poster involved me trying to understand his perspective that seemed to imply people should be treated similar to the outcome for McVeigh. When I asked 'which people' he seemed to imply should be executed, I guess I was thinking of different categories of crime or action. In the extreme, while I'm not a proponent of the death penalty, I can understand the individuals responsible for the death of the law enforcement officer being charged as such, but on the other side I'm not so sure the driver of a bus or protestor who didn't enter the Capitol should be charged with anything. Finally, on some level, I understand his outrage and desire for street justice. I felt that way many, many times during the Russia investigation and the attempt to unseat DJT then. I was just trying to understand where he was coming from.
Recommended Posts