Not-So-Random Thoughts About Election Security

[The Frankish Reich]

1. The fact that one party is taking buffoonery and sleaziness to a new level does not mean that election security is not a real issue.

2. There will always be a balance between ensuring that all eligible voters have the right and a realistic opportunity to cast their ballots and measures to ensure that unqualified persons do not cast ballots. We saw legitimate complaints from the Stacy Abrams activists following the 2018 midterms as Georgia laws probably suppressed the vote, and suppressed the black vote by a disproportionate degree. We are seeing legitimate complaints that the widespread vote by mail rolled out in many states (as a reaction to the Abrams type criticisms, and accelerated by COVID restrictions) would lead to more ballots from unqualified (or multiple) voters.

3. The (almost) perfectly secured election would mimic what we saw post-Saddam in Iraq: voters had to come in person, cast their ballots openly, and then stick their forefingers in indelible ink to prove they've voted and can't vote again. And we'd probably add biometric checks; there's no reason why my voter registration file can't include my fingerprint, and that when I show up in person to vote that fingerprint can be checked against my registration record. This is nearly foolproof voter ID.

4. I've yet to hear anyone advocate for this (my proposition 3.) It would make voting as cumbersome as it was before vote by mail, and it would be an intrusion on privacy that it seems neither side wants to see (with the State maintaining my fingerprint/retinal scan/etc. on file). We are willing (forced by economic necessity?) to give this information to our employers, but we balk at giving it to the government.

5. The way to ensure that all eligible voters may vote (and actually do vote) is to make mail-in (actually, drop-off) voting even easier. Allow more time before the election, increase drop-off locations, allow for same day registration/ballot drop-off. And then add in internet voting with some kind of password/key.

6. I've yet to hear anyone advocate for this (my proposition 5.) It seems that people are uncomfortable with something amounting to a pure honor system, which would likely allow people to vote more than once, people to vote in states/districts they don't live in, and unqualified (noncitizen? deceased?) persons to cast ballots too.

7. In the United States we defer to the individual states to set the rules, within some very loose guidelines. A state can require voter ID and in-person voting. I'm not even sure there's anything that would prohibit a state from banning absentee ballots entirely, even for those with a good reason for not being in the state at the time. A state can also open up elections to 100% mail-in/drop-off voting; my state (Colorado) has. The weighing of access to the polls vs. ballot security is given to the states. This may or may not be a good idea in today's world, but it seemed like a good idea to the drafters of the federal constitution and its amendments.

 

We need to have a national conversation about voting rules. The time to have that conversation is not after the voting has already happened; it's now.

 

[TBBills]

Can someone give me the number in this entire country of proven fraudulent votes from this election?

 

[The Frankish Reich]

29 minutes ago, TBBills said:

Can someone give me the number in this entire country of proven fraudulent votes from this election?

 

The only one I've seen with an actual name attached to it belongs to a guy who is being prosecuted for filling out his dead mother's ballot in addition to his own.

He was a Trump voter. In Pennsylvania.

https://www.centredaily.com/news/state/pennsylvania/article248016795.html

 

[MarkyMannn]

On 1/4/2021 at 4:34 PM, The Frankish Reich said:

1. The fact that one party is taking buffoonery and sleaziness to a new level does not mean that election security is not a real issue.

 

Could you be clear which party you are talking about.  Seriously

[TBBills]

47 minutes ago, MarkyMannn said:

Could you be clear which party you are talking about.  Seriously

Trumpsters party, b.c I don't want to lump every republican in with them.

Edited January 7, 2021 by TBBills

[MarkyMannn]

29 minutes ago, TBBills said:

Trumpsters party, b.c I don't want to lump every republican in with them.

Ok because as a 42 year Democrat. I'm embarrassed by my party's behavior over the last 4 years

[TBBills]

2 minutes ago, MarkyMannn said:

Ok because as a 42 year Democrat. I'm embarrassed by my party's behavior over the last 4 years

It's ok to be embarrassed for your own party b.c both parties have done things that were embarrassing. 

 

In reality together both democrats and republicans should be embarrassed for allowing this president to do the things he has done.

 

As long as we all learn from this treasonous time and put forth the lesson that should be learned from this experience than the future can look a little brighter.

[The Frankish Reich]

2 hours ago, MarkyMannn said:

Could you be clear which party you are talking about.  Seriously

Perhaps I could have excused this if it had been posted yesterday.

[Thurmal34]

On 1/4/2021 at 4:34 PM, The Frankish Reich said:

1. The fact that one party is taking buffoonery and sleaziness to a new level does not mean that election security is not a real issue.

2. There will always be a balance between ensuring that all eligible voters have the right and a realistic opportunity to cast their ballots and measures to ensure that unqualified persons do not cast ballots. We saw legitimate complaints from the Stacy Abrams activists following the 2018 midterms as Georgia laws probably suppressed the vote, and suppressed the black vote by a disproportionate degree. We are seeing legitimate complaints that the widespread vote by mail rolled out in many states (as a reaction to the Abrams type criticisms, and accelerated by COVID restrictions) would lead to more ballots from unqualified (or multiple) voters.

3. The (almost) perfectly secured election would mimic what we saw post-Saddam in Iraq: voters had to come in person, cast their ballots openly, and then stick their forefingers in indelible ink to prove they've voted and can't vote again. And we'd probably add biometric checks; there's no reason why my voter registration file can't include my fingerprint, and that when I show up in person to vote that fingerprint can be checked against my registration record. This is nearly foolproof voter ID.

4. I've yet to hear anyone advocate for this (my proposition 3.) It would make voting as cumbersome as it was before vote by mail, and it would be an intrusion on privacy that it seems neither side wants to see (with the State maintaining my fingerprint/retinal scan/etc. on file). We are willing (forced by economic necessity?) to give this information to our employers, but we balk at giving it to the government.

5. The way to ensure that all eligible voters may vote (and actually do vote) is to make mail-in (actually, drop-off) voting even easier. Allow more time before the election, increase drop-off locations, allow for same day registration/ballot drop-off. And then add in internet voting with some kind of password/key.

6. I've yet to hear anyone advocate for this (my proposition 5.) It seems that people are uncomfortable with something amounting to a pure honor system, which would likely allow people to vote more than once, people to vote in states/districts they don't live in, and unqualified (noncitizen? deceased?) persons to cast ballots too.

7. In the United States we defer to the individual states to set the rules, within some very loose guidelines. A state can require voter ID and in-person voting. I'm not even sure there's anything that would prohibit a state from banning absentee ballots entirely, even for those with a good reason for not being in the state at the time. A state can also open up elections to 100% mail-in/drop-off voting; my state (Colorado) has. The weighing of access to the polls vs. ballot security is given to the states. This may or may not be a good idea in today's world, but it seemed like a good idea to the drafters of the federal constitution and its amendments.

 

We need to have a national conversation about voting rules. The time to have that conversation is not after the voting has already happened; it's now.

 

A lot of good stuff here, i whole heartedly agree. Let's talk! Let's engage! What is working? What isn't? How can we improve? What are we doing poorly? 

 

Let's do it!!

Just now, Thurmal34 said:

A lot of good stuff here, i whole heartedly agree. Let's talk! Let's engage! What is working? What isn't? How can we improve? What are we doing poorly? 

 

Let's do it!!

 

Just now, Thurmal34 said:

Come on guys we got this!

 

[Tiberius]

Boy, this says a lot about the cops. How in the world could these people possible enforce the law fairly if this is how they think? 

Quote

At least 13 off-duty law enforcement officials are suspected of taking part in the riot, a tally that could grow as investigators continue to pore over footage and records to identify participants. Police leaders are turning in their own to the FBI and taking the striking step of reminding officers in their departments that criminal misconduct could push them off the force and behind bars.

The reckoning within police departments comes as plans for new demonstrations this weekend and on Inauguration Day are solidifying, with authorities warning of the potential for violence in state capitals. Participants are expected to protest election results that made Joe Biden president-elect.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/police-trump-capitol-mob/2021/01/16/160ace1e-567d-11eb-a08b-f1381ef3d207_story.html

[T master]

We all need to show up in person to get a drivers license which is a privilege and no matter how secure any Tech makes a computer system there will always be that guy or gal that is a little bit smarter to be able to some how figure out how to change the security of that system .

 

If you are registered to vote you should be able to do so no matter who you are where you are but IMHO if you are not a citizen of this country then you should not be able to participate until you become a citizen so they need to stream line that process instead of taking 10 yrs or longer . 

 

When you register isn't there a profile to fill out to know the age, race, height weight and such just like a drivers license if not there should be and all that info could be entered into a voter file of sorts then each individual given a voter registration card and like a license be updated every so many years .

 

Like a drivers license the (for sake of conversation) the UPC number would be used to register your vote and that number could only be used 1 time in a given election monitored by some kind of program that way if the person is elderly they can vote from home or if you are a military service member you too could vote from where ever .

 

There are so many ways the process could be done so there would be no BS like that that surrounds this past election and if a company like dominion is known to and proven beyond a shadow of a doubt with indisputable evidence to have done things from other elections in a corrupt manner in any way should not ba allow'd to be involved with that process period .

 

That would be like giving a country or individual proven more then once to be a involved that in terrorist or criminal actions money or weapons to continue those actions it's just foolish at any level .

 

The thumb print is awesome because there is no way (unless you do what they did in that movie ?? (Face off) was it to change that info .

 

Given all the volunteers in any given election they could go door to door like the census for those known by their registration for their voter registration card to be elderly or physically unable to go to vote and bring the vote to them but that would be met with a huge "OH YOU CAN"T DO THAT IT WOULD COST TO MUCH AND TAKE TO MUCH TIME" type of response .

 

Excuses are like A holes every bodies got one and they usually stink !!! 

 

There is a way out there some where to make it infallible we can look at DNA and find out what makes you susceptible to getting cancer and other diseases but we can't figure out how to have a fair election as to not have any of the BS that has been happening to that i say COM ON MAN !! 

 

I am a registered independent and i voted for what i thought was the lessor of 2 evils the last 6 times i voted because i don't care about Democrat or Republican i just want the most qualified person to run our country and am third of hereing all the arguments from both sides about this BS and that BS it's ridiculous .

 

So being the "Best country in the world" with the smartest of smart living here lets just figure this BS out so it never happens again and be done with it !!

 

GO AMERICA !! 

[T master]

On 1/6/2021 at 8:01 PM, TBBills said:

It's ok to be embarrassed for your own party b.c both parties have done things that were embarrassing. 

 

In reality together both democrats and republicans should be embarrassed for allowing this president (should say) 

 

and all president to do the things they have done.

 

As long as we all learn from this ANY treasonous time and put forth the lesson that should be learned from this experience than the future can look a little brighter.

 

Wow for the most part i agree with you (i changed a couple of words in your reply to fit all in the group of 44 that were president) lessons can and should be learned from every presidency no matter who they are and despite yours or their political affiliation history will show by statistics, actions and laws past what may or may not have been good for the country and its citizens no matter personal opinions  . 

 

Hey TBills we made progress 😆 see it can happen ...

[Big Blitz]

 

City councilman.  

 

I'm sure it's the only instance.  

 

But still, all of 2020 was a fraud.  

[Tiberius]

34 minutes ago, Big Blitz said:

 

City councilman.  

 

I'm sure it's the only instance.  

 

But still, all of 2020 was a fraud.  

Trump lost, get over it already. Being a sore loser is ugly 

Edited January 18, 2021 by Tiberius

[daz28]

I think it should be illegal for the president to try to manipulate votes by calling secretaries of states, and threatening them they may be going to prison if they don't.  Oh wait it is illegal?  Oh, the president said he could commit crimes, and not be arrested.  Oh, he said he could commit crimes and pardon himself???  

[Warcodered]

14 hours ago, Big Blitz said:

 

City councilman.  

 

I'm sure it's the only instance.  

 

But still, all of 2020 was a fraud.  

So this guy was already being looked at before the election. At this rate of discovery they might find significant fraud by the time Kamala is finishing her second term.

[WideNine]

On 1/18/2021 at 7:51 AM, T master said:

We all need to show up in person to get a drivers license which is a privilege and no matter how secure any Tech makes a computer system there will always be that guy or gal that is a little bit smarter to be able to some how figure out how to change the security of that system .

 

If you are registered to vote you should be able to do so no matter who you are where you are but IMHO if you are not a citizen of this country then you should not be able to participate until you become a citizen so they need to stream line that process instead of taking 10 yrs or longer . 

 

When you register isn't there a profile to fill out to know the age, race, height weight and such just like a drivers license if not there should be and all that info could be entered into a voter file of sorts then each individual given a voter registration card and like a license be updated every so many years .

 

Like a drivers license the (for sake of conversation) the UPC number would be used to register your vote and that number could only be used 1 time in a given election monitored by some kind of program that way if the person is elderly they can vote from home or if you are a military service member you too could vote from where ever .

 

There are so many ways the process could be done so there would be no BS like that that surrounds this past election and if a company like dominion is known to and proven beyond a shadow of a doubt with indisputable evidence to have done things from other elections in a corrupt manner in any way should not ba allow'd to be involved with that process period .

 

That would be like giving a country or individual proven more then once to be a involved that in terrorist or criminal actions money or weapons to continue those actions it's just foolish at any level .

 

The thumb print is awesome because there is no way (unless you do what they did in that movie ?? (Face off) was it to change that info .

 

Given all the volunteers in any given election they could go door to door like the census for those known by their registration for their voter registration card to be elderly or physically unable to go to vote and bring the vote to them but that would be met with a huge "OH YOU CAN"T DO THAT IT WOULD COST TO MUCH AND TAKE TO MUCH TIME" type of response .

 

Excuses are like A holes every bodies got one and they usually stink !!! 

 

There is a way out there some where to make it infallible we can look at DNA and find out what makes you susceptible to getting cancer and other diseases but we can't figure out how to have a fair election as to not have any of the BS that has been happening to that i say COM ON MAN !! 

 

I am a registered independent and i voted for what i thought was the lessor of 2 evils the last 6 times i voted because i don't care about Democrat or Republican i just want the most qualified person to run our country and am third of hereing all the arguments from both sides about this BS and that BS it's ridiculous .

 

So being the "Best country in the world" with the smartest of smart living here lets just figure this BS out so it never happens again and be done with it !!

 

GO AMERICA !! 

 

The vast fraud narratives have been disproven over and over.

 

Not just in this election, but in several GOP-funded studies in the past.

 

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/study-finds-no-evidence-widespread-voter-fraud-n637776

 

Why should the US spend resources tilting at windmills, crafting hoops for voters to jump through to address GOP-manufactured fears?

 

To do so, I think there would first have to be evidence of an issue that needs resolving.

 

There is none.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Big Blitz]

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

 

 

 

[TSOL]

44 minutes ago, Big Blitz said:

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

 

 

 

 

 

Strange days indeed.

Edited January 24, 2021 by TSOL
Changed my mind

[BillStime]