ghostwriter Posted December 29, 2020 Posted December 29, 2020 1 hour ago, MJS said: Is it rare? We're not talking about a 1 or 2 win team, here... Unquestionably, the Bills are better and probably will be for the foreseeable future, but there are 3 wild card slots now. The Patriots are not a good team, but they get some fire power back next year and have a ton of cap space. They could conceivably turn it around quickly. Or they could take a decade plus to do it. Guess we'll find out. The margins for that happening are small though.. Took Josh a few years to hit stride.. With no good veteran QBs on the market, they’ll have to rely on a draft pick to come in and dominate which is a hard thing to do when you’re picking in the middle of the first round.. On average it takes a QB 2-3 years before they come into their own.. Not to mention he’ll be going up against Buffalo and Miami twice a year which is tough sledding.. Because of that reality, you may see New England with 3-4 guaranteed losses every year against divisional opponents, and when that happens coaches typically don’t last long..
Success Posted December 29, 2020 Posted December 29, 2020 It's funny to hear how casually they say things like "all we need to do is find a franchise QB" or "we just need a 1-2 year rebuild and we're back on top," like it's all a "just add water" kind of thing. Sure, they might get lucky. But chances are that they are in for a long stretch of mediocrity. They have almost nothing to work with right now, and BB the GM is not as good as BB the coach. I remember feeling the same way after the Kelly years. I just assumed we'd figure out a way to continue to dominate. I remember talking myself into Todd Collins. 1
stevewin Posted December 29, 2020 Posted December 29, 2020 One thing a lot of people are missing is the salad days of the Cheaters signing FAs for nothing who want a ring are OVER. What FAs are going to want to sign to play for that joyless franchise with no QB and questionable future at best and miserable grumbling SOB as coach. Bellicheat's incompetence drafting has been covered up for years by discount FA signings - those days are over. 2
Ghost_002! Posted December 29, 2020 Posted December 29, 2020 55 minutes ago, BUFFALOBART said: The question begs, what the hell happened to Newton? How does a player become MVP, and then turn to crap in a few short years? Injuries. Stops many a talent Side note: (not directed at you at all) For the fans calming NE won't be able to grab a free agent going forward. Free agents/players don't think like emotional fans.... 1
billsfan89 Posted December 29, 2020 Posted December 29, 2020 59 minutes ago, Groin said: My only real surprise is that Bill Belichick thought that rolling with Cam Newton this season would be good enough. Who was a better option for a capped out team drafting late in a so/so QB class? Genuinely asking because while I think Cam wasn't the alternative I am not sure who they could have gotten that could have gotten this ass team 6-7 wins. Cam for all his faults had the team at 6-6 and doesn't impact their cap long term.
Doc Posted December 29, 2020 Posted December 29, 2020 2 minutes ago, Ghost_002! said: Injuries. Stops many a talent Side note: (not directed at you at all) For the fans calming NE won't be able to grab a free agent going forward. Free agents/players don't think like emotional fans.... Grab a FA...what? Franchise QB? Not even close. And what FA's they might get won't be taking discounts (anymore).
TheCockSportif Posted December 29, 2020 Posted December 29, 2020 Just now, billsfan89 said: Who was a better option for a capped out team drafting late in a so/so QB class? Genuinely asking because while I think Cam wasn't the alternative I am not sure who they could have gotten that could have gotten this ass team 6-7 wins. Cam for all his faults had the team at 6-6 and doesn't impact their cap long term. Their only option was to play Stidham. It would've been cheaper, and it probably would've lead to similar results without all of the drama. And by cheaper, I mean play Stidham and bring in some talent on D. Not playing Stidham, and playing Cam full time was a recipe for failure. Cam was played out before he put on the NE unis.
Doc Posted December 29, 2020 Posted December 29, 2020 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Groin said: Their only option was to play Stidham. It would've been cheaper, and it probably would've lead to similar results without all of the drama. And by cheaper, I mean play Stidham and bring in some talent on D. Not playing Stidham, and playing Cam full time was a recipe for failure. Cam was played out before he put on the NE unis. Stidham sucks. I fully believe they were blindsided by Tommy's departure and then desperately signed Cam. Because starting Stidham and winning 2, maybe 3 games, would have tainted Belicheat's legacy (people are now starting to talk about how he's got a losing record without Brady and his poor drafting). Edited December 29, 2020 by Doc
billsfan89 Posted December 29, 2020 Posted December 29, 2020 5 minutes ago, Groin said: Their only option was to play Stidham. It would've been cheaper, and it probably would've lead to similar results without all of the drama. And by cheaper, I mean play Stidham and bring in some talent on D. Not playing Stidham, and playing Cam full time was a recipe for failure. Cam was played out before he put on the NE unis. Every time I see Stidham I don't see a good QB. I think Cam brought a running dimension to the team that Stidham wouldn't have brought. Honestly any QB they realistically could have found dropped into that dumpster fire (no WR's, suspect O-line, no TE's and a banged up RB situation) of an offense was doomed to fail. There is only so much good coaching could make up.
TheCockSportif Posted December 29, 2020 Posted December 29, 2020 4 minutes ago, Doc said: Stidham sucks. I fully believe they were blindsided by Tommy's departure and then desperately signed Cam. Because starting Stidham and winning 2, maybe 3 games, would have tainted Belicheat's legacy (people are now starting to talk about how he's got a losing record without Brady and his poor drafting). Maybe the joy of 2020 has caused me to be delusional, but didn't they essentially invite Tommy to leave?
billsfan89 Posted December 29, 2020 Posted December 29, 2020 In the next 3 years (which is about as far out as you can project in the NFL) I don't see the Pats being a bad team. They got 6-7 wins off of a roster depleted due to dead cap and opt outs. They won 12 games last year with an elite ST and defense. In 2021 they will get back key players on defense and the O-line from the Covid opt outs and they will have the cap space to supplement additional needs on their roster as well as a decent selection of draft choices higher than they are used to. They will not be an easy out in 2021. However unless they find a QB I don't see them being more than a 10 win competitive team that won't get past the divisional round. Billy B will keep that defense and special teams units strong but the offense won't be good enough to make serious noise in the playoffs and Billy B isn't a spring chicken. Billy B is 68 years old and will be 69 next season. He doesn't have 10 years to build back up the team and find a QB. I can't see him coaching more than 5 seasons (and 5 seasons is generous but possible) and as this franchise knows it can take decades to find a decent QB let alone a franchise QB. So the Pats will be a pesky team that can run the football, play good to great defense and elite ST play. But if they can't get a good QB (let alone an elite one) then they will be stuck in the good but not great category for a long time.
Ghost_002! Posted December 29, 2020 Posted December 29, 2020 4 minutes ago, Doc said: Grab a FA...what? Franchise QB? Not even close. And what FA's they might get won't be taking discounts (anymore). First off you have no idea what their approach is going to be. They have the cap space to spend if they choose to. This team won 6 games so far. w a sh*tty roster could of one more. So they couldn't compete for the division next year with for the sake of the argument a Ryan Fitzpatrick type QB? There's more in free agency than just QBs...and they have solid players returning
TheCockSportif Posted December 29, 2020 Posted December 29, 2020 2 minutes ago, billsfan89 said: Every time I see Stidham I don't see a good QB. I think Cam brought a running dimension to the team that Stidham wouldn't have brought. Honestly any QB they realistically could have found dropped into that dumpster fire (no WR's, suspect O-line, no TE's and a banged up RB situation) of an offense was doomed to fail. There is only so much good coaching could make up. But they lost a year in evaluating what they had on O. The Bills did this for years and years.
Doc Posted December 29, 2020 Posted December 29, 2020 Just now, Groin said: Maybe the joy of 2020 has caused me to be delusional, but didn't they essentially invite Tommy to leave? That's what they want you to think. No one believes that Stidham would have been an upgrade over Tommy even from last year. 1 minute ago, Ghost_002! said: First off you have no idea what their approach is going to be. They have the cap space to spend if they choose to. This team won 6 games so far. w a sh*tty roster could of one more. So they couldn't compete for the division next year with for the sake of the argument a Ryan Fitzpatrick type QB? There's more in free agency than just QBs...and they have solid players returning Yeah they have cap space. They're going to need to pay the going rates. And they'll still have no QB. Fitz isn't a franchise QB.
billsfan89 Posted December 29, 2020 Posted December 29, 2020 Just now, Groin said: But they lost a year in evaluating what they had on O. The Bills did this for years and years. If Stidham was worth playing he would have beaten out Cam in their camp or during their season, they also had several low points in the season where they could have reasonably played Stidham and benched Cam yet they didn't. At one point they were sitting at 2-5 and they could have easily justified playing Stidham in what was already a lost season. Yet they didn't, which to me tells me they just don't see Stidham as the answer.
John from Riverside Posted December 29, 2020 Posted December 29, 2020 3 hours ago, ProcessTruster said: We'll see. When the Pats' 8 (eight!) Covid op-outs and Gilmore are back and they get a competent QB (they have tons of cap space), they'll be a very competitive team next year. The Bills and strong to be sure, but we beat the Pats twice, Seattle, San Fran and others when they were really beat up by major injury/Covid problems. Bills play KC, Pittsburg and Titans AGAIN next year (along with Brady/Bucs) ; every year and every game will be a battle . Who knows, Bills could have a bunch of guys go down for the season like what happened to the 49ers this year; then the whole conversation changes. Enjoy it now while things are working in the Bills direction. The 9ers fans thought they'd be awesome the next (this year) as well. We see how that worked out. Go Bills. Trust the Process. The problem with this is the problem the bills have faced in many prior years.....the "competent QB" that you mention does not get put out on the end ile at the Wallmart....... VERY hard to find.....not to mention that they have tough decisions to make with guys like Gilmore who is rumored to be out of t here......and they dont have any offensive weapons...... They will probably always field a strong defense.....does that sound like any other team you might know that is always in the middle of the draft? It does to me.
TheCockSportif Posted December 29, 2020 Posted December 29, 2020 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Doc said: That's what they want you to think. No one believes that Stidham would have been an upgrade over Tommy even from last year. I agree with you that nobody thought that there was a replacement for Stidham (full disclosure: I live in New England, as I have for 25 years, and media here was all wobbly about the transition moments after Brady intimated that he was going elsewhere), but they set this table last year. Actually, no. They set this table when they traded Jimmy G, didn't do anything to make O better, bumped up against the salary cap, and were forced to basically put a Band-Aid this season. And I could not be happier. 2 minutes ago, billsfan89 said: If Stidham was worth playing he would have beaten out Cam in their camp or during their season, they also had several low points in the season where they could have reasonably played Stidham and benched Cam yet they didn't. At one point they were sitting at 2-5 and they could have easily justified playing Stidham in what was already a lost season. Yet they didn't, which to me tells me they just don't see Stidham as the answer. That's fine, but regardless of how you want to slice it, they pooched the season. Bigly. Edited December 29, 2020 by Groin
John from Riverside Posted December 29, 2020 Posted December 29, 2020 23 minutes ago, Ghost_002! said: Injuries. Stops many a talent Side note: (not directed at you at all) For the fans calming NE won't be able to grab a free agent going forward. Free agents/players don't think like emotional fans.... Grabbing a bunch of free agents doesnt solve your problems either.....good teams dont let good QB's get away from them......It takes drafting and honestly 50 million dollars is not THAT much money
Ghost_002! Posted December 29, 2020 Posted December 29, 2020 1 minute ago, Doc said: That's what they want you to think. No one believes that Stidham would have been an upgrade over Tommy even from last year. Yeah they have cap space. They're going to need to pay the going rates. And they'll still have no QB. Fitz isn't a franchise QB. Ha ha Never said he was...you telling me the Buffalo bills can't be beat if you have Ryan Fitzpatrick as your QB? The fins won about 10 games with him(obviousl Tua played some games), but BB couldn't win with him assuming he has a better built roster Understand..I am not talking for them to be dominant again, go to the SB I am talking being competitive Again they found a way to win 6 games with their JV squad...
billsfan89 Posted December 29, 2020 Posted December 29, 2020 2 minutes ago, Groin said: And I could not be happier. That's fine, but regardless of how you want to slice it, they pooched the season. Bigly. I don't think they pooched the season so much as Billy B took a step back to take several steps forward. Eat the Brady dead cap and other dead cap space, take on the covid opt outs and see what you can make from a depleted roster. Then regroup in 2021 when you can have several starting players return from a season of rest and you have a good amount of cap space and draft picks to work with. Either way, good luck finding a QB that will get you past that 10 win good but not great level, it can take decades to find a competent one let along a franchise QB.
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