HappyDays Posted December 21, 2020 Posted December 21, 2020 10 minutes ago, McGahee said: It's Mahomes. He's on another level. He has not been on another level from Allen the past few weeks. They've been on the same level. If you want to talk about the whole season then yes it's Mahomes because his worst games weren't as bad as Allen's, he has less turnovers, and he beat Allen head to head. But right now I would argue they both share the #1 spot with Rodgers slightly behind them.
McGahee Posted December 21, 2020 Posted December 21, 2020 Just now, HappyDays said: He has not been on another level from Allen the past few weeks. They've been on the same level. If you want to talk about the whole season then yes it's Mahomes because his worst games weren't as bad as Allen's, he has less turnovers, and he beat Allen head to head. But right now I would argue they both share the #1 spot with Rodgers slightly behind them. Oh, I didn't know we were discussing 2 week MVP, lol. My bad. In that case, I'd go with Derrick henry.
NewEra Posted December 21, 2020 Posted December 21, 2020 35 minutes ago, mannc said: Donald is the outstanding player on that team (although Jalen Ramsey can make a case, as well), but that doesn't make him the most valuable. The Rams still have a pretty good defense even without Donald. I don't know who the Rams' backup QB is, but you're probably right that Goff being out would sway the line more than Ramsey or Donald being out. If Goff's backup proves himself to be competent, that might not be the case. But yeah, I think it's absurd for anyone other than a QB to win Most Valuable Player. The only exception I can think of would be OJ Simpson in 1973, which is the type of anomaly that will never happen again. That year, Simpson had almost 2100 yards from scrimmage, while the Bills as a team passed for less than 1000 yards. He was their entire offense. Henry has nowhere near that sort of impact for the Titans, who have a good passing attack, as well. I’m not saying Henry is the MVP. I’m saying that the Qb positions has, by far, more influence on the game than any other position. That’s why it affects the betting lines so much when the starting qb is out. I’m agreeing with you to an extent. However....I wouldn’t agree that The QB is the MVP of every team. Not every QB is good enough. Including Goff. Donald is their team MVP. I don’t think it’s even close. Ramsey is great. He doesn’t have the same impact on the game as Aaron Donald does. Replace Goff with Fitzpatrick, you’ll get similar results. Why? Because Goff isn’t an impact QB. He just plays the most impactful position.
FireChans Posted December 21, 2020 Posted December 21, 2020 4 hours ago, Doc said: Depends. Jackson didn't have the most yards last year, even taking rushing yards into account. He also had a poor completion percentage. But if Josh doesn't win it, no biggee. He's just as good as them. ??????
mannc Posted December 21, 2020 Posted December 21, 2020 8 minutes ago, NewEra said: I’m not saying Henry is the MVP. I’m saying that the Qb positions has, by far, more influence on the game than any other position. That’s why it affects the betting lines so much when the starting qb is out. I’m agreeing with you to an extent. However....I wouldn’t agree that The QB is the MVP of every team. Not every QB is good enough. Including Goff. Donald is their team MVP. I don’t think it’s even close. Ramsey is great. He doesn’t have the same impact on the game as Aaron Donald does. Replace Goff with Fitzpatrick, you’ll get similar results. Why? Because Goff isn’t an impact QB. He just plays the most impactful position. I think we are in agreement. An average or below average QB like Darnold or Lock or Wentz is rarely going to be his team's most valuable player because he's not really bringing much to the table and he's not helping them win games that they wouldn't win anyway with a backup. So yeah, QB is the most important position on the field, but not every QB is his team's MVP. I don't see any way a non-QB could win league MVP now, although I suppose maybe a totally dominant WR could make a case. 1
Doc Posted December 21, 2020 Posted December 21, 2020 41 minutes ago, FireChans said: ?????? My bad. Was thinking of rookie year completion percentage.
NewEra Posted December 21, 2020 Posted December 21, 2020 20 minutes ago, mannc said: I think we are in agreement. An average or below average QB like Darnold or Lock or Wentz is rarely going to be his team's most valuable player because he's not really bringing much to the table and he's not helping them win games that they wouldn't win anyway with a backup. So yeah, QB is the most important position on the field, but not every QB is his team's MVP. I don't see any way a non-QB could win league MVP now, although I suppose maybe a totally dominant WR could make a case. If the titans were to win 13+ games and rush for 2000 and 15+ TDs,. If the Vikings D were to play like they were 4 years ago, Dalvin Cook would be in the mix if they won 13+ games. Peterson did it. In 1012 iirc. It’s just even more difficult right now for two reasons imo. 1-QB play is getting even better than ever before. 2- there aren’t too many teams are looking to build their offense around the running game in a league that caters its rules to helping the pass game succeed.
BillsPride12 Posted December 21, 2020 Posted December 21, 2020 Just the fact that Josh is in the conversation for MVP with Mahomes and Rodgers in Year 3 already is a huge victory in itself! He probably won't actually win it this year but his time will come. His rapid progression has been through the charts when you think about the narrative on him in Years 1 and 2. Don't forget that there were BILLS fans going into this season that were still questioning if he was the real deal or not.
mannc Posted December 21, 2020 Posted December 21, 2020 24 minutes ago, NewEra said: If the titans were to win 13+ games and rush for 2000 and 15+ TDs,. If the Vikings D were to play like they were 4 years ago, Dalvin Cook would be in the mix if they won 13+ games. Peterson did it. In 1012 iirc. It’s just even more difficult right now for two reasons imo. 1-QB play is getting even better than ever before. 2- there aren’t too many teams are looking to build their offense around the running game in a league that caters its rules to helping the pass game succeed. And many run-heavy teams, like Cleveland or the Ravens, don't use one back to shoulder the whole load. 1
Chuck Wagon Posted December 21, 2020 Posted December 21, 2020 We play New England on Monday night. If Josh puts on a show he could sweep in and snag the award. 1
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