PFF ranks Josh as 6th best QB in week 13.

[buffalo2218]

8 minutes ago, NoSaint said:

 

He did have 389 yards and a TD so it’s not insane 

 

Stanford had 400+
 

Baker was 338 and 4tda 

rodgers and mahomes both look like they had good games

 

i surely didn’t see all 6 performances but this isn’t an egregious snub even if he deserves to be a few higher. He’s in the elite grouping from the week.

 

Garbage yards, the Browns had them blown out for the majority of the game

[NoSaint]

9 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

Tannehill and the Titans got blown tf out and were playing garbage time the whole second half

is it insane to think tannehill may have made many similarly good throws regardless? 
 

I didn’t watch the game and 400 yards can be wildly slinging erratically or great discipline. I didn’t see if he was hitting his reads well to dispute his grade. If someone brings breakdown of one of the others playing badly, so be it. As is they all looked good on paper and the pff folks said they all passed the eye test. No need to be insulted by being among the very best scores in the week 

3 minutes ago, buffalo2218 said:

Garbage yards, the Browns had them blown out for the majority of the game

And pff doesn’t grade on just yards, I was just pointing out he was highly productive 

 

for instance, he probably got a very good grade on the Davis laser but might have come up short of the 2.0 score if they decided he missed the open Lee smith and shouldn’t have. 
 

I don’t think any of us analyzed these guys on that level. 
 

he’s in an elite group for the week.  

Edited December 10, 2020 by NoSaint

[GoBills808]

Just now, NoSaint said:

is it insane to think tannehill may have made many similarly good throws regardless? 
 

I didn’t watch the game and 400 yards can be wildly slinging erratically or great discipline. I didn’t see if he was hitting his reads well to dispute his grade. If someone brings breakdown of one of the others playing badly, so be it. As is they all looked good on paper and the pff folks said they all passed the eye test. No need to be insulted by being among the very best scores in the week 

I did and no, not even close

[The Wiz]

15 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

Tannehill and the Titans got blown tf out and were playing garbage time the whole second half

But they were the best garbage time throws anyone has ever seen.

 

PFF is trolling at this point or just hates Allen.  Either way, their metric is measured by a group of people that don't like the Bills so Fuk 'em.

[Bferra13]

10 minutes ago, Warcodered said:

So wait Mayfield is ahead of Allen despite both fumbling and throwing an INT?

 

I dont think he had any picks. 25 of 33 for 334 4tds 0 ints. 1 fumble lost.

[Warcodered]

Just now, The Wiz said:

But they were the best garbage time throws anyone has ever seen.

 

PFF is trolling at this point or just hates Allen.  Either way, their metric is measured by a group of people that don't like the Bills so Fuk 'em.

[JakeFrommStateFarm]

I would put Rivers ahead of Allen 

[The Wiz]

19 minutes ago, NoSaint said:

is it insane to think tannehill may have made many similarly good throws regardless? 
 

I didn’t watch the game and 400 yards can be wildly slinging erratically or great discipline. I didn’t see if he was hitting his reads well to dispute his grade. If someone brings breakdown of one of the others playing badly, so be it. As is they all looked good on paper and the pff folks said they all passed the eye test. No need to be insulted by being among the very best scores in the week 

And pff doesn’t grade on just yards, I was just pointing out he was highly productive 

 

for instance, he probably got a very good grade on the Davis laser but might have come up short of the 2.0 score if they decided he missed the open Lee smith and shouldn’t have. 
 

I don’t think any of us analyzed these guys on that level. 
 

he’s in an elite group for the week.  

This is honestly why the metric is crap.  Let me watch video for 5 minutes at a time of 1 play and then say "yea he made a great throw but I'm knocking it down to a 1 because he missed a wide open receiver.  Actually, it was a very interceptable ball so maybe knock it down to a 0.5".  Meanwhile, Allen has about 2.5 seconds to diagnose this.  Everyone can go back to film and pick apart every player for every play that didn't end up positive.  So this, makes it seem like you are looking for something wrong with the player other than evaluating them on the real time play.

Edited December 10, 2020 by The Wiz

[GoBills808]

Missed the open Lee Smith route is hilarious

 

as if that was even a read😂😂😂

[H2o]

PFF after they release anything

 

[MJS]

Most of those guys had big games. So it's not super crazy. But it's safe to say that Allen's games are viewed with more scepticism from PFF than others, for some reason.

 

Rodgers could make a throw into triple coverage for an amazing completion and they would say "wow, what a play! He put it where only his receiver could get it!" but if Allen would do that they'd say "that ball was interceptable. He's lucky the receiver caught it!"

 

These numbers they come up with are just visual representations of their opinions after watching a play. They aren't even real numbers. They don't mean anything. They are trying to turn qualitative data into quantitative data. It's not real.

[billsfan_34]

46 minutes ago, Warcodered said:

Tannehill?

Without Henry as tanneys relief valve Tanny is just average.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

47 minutes ago, The Wiz said:

He completed too many hard passes. That's a bad thing. 

 

Exactly correct.  "Interceptable balls"

[NoSaint]

7 minutes ago, The Wiz said:

This is honestly why the metric is crap.  Let me watch video for 5 minutes at a time of 1 play and then say "yea he made a great throw but I'm knocking it down to a 1 because he missed a wide open receiver.  Actually, it was a very interceptable ball so maybe knock it down to a 0.5".  Meanwhile, Allen has about 2.5 seconds to diagnose this.  Everyone can go back to film and pick apart every player for every play that didn't end up positive.  So this, makes it seem like you are looking for something wrong with the player other than evaluating them on the real time play.

if in 2.5 secs one guy throws great ball dropped by smith and the other is joshs pass.... which play would you grade the qb better?

 

I can see making a great read and solid pass being a better individual performance still and that being good insight beyond yards and completion percentage. 

I don’t know how the grader marked that specific play. Could have said smith wasn’t the reasonable progression and given a perfect score. 

 

no stat will ever tell the whole story. He had a great game and received a great score. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

15 minutes ago, JakeFrommStateFarm said:

I would put Rivers ahead of Allen 

 

 Fascinating.

[NoSaint]

12 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

Missed the open Lee Smith route is hilarious

 

as if that was even a read😂😂😂

to be fair, I was using it as a throwaway bar napkin  example because the board had a big thread on it, not as an actual criticism. I also included commentary about the progressions being a consideration when judging whether the wide open pass would be reasonable expectation. 

Edited December 10, 2020 by NoSaint

[Big Turk]

29 minutes ago, NoSaint said:

is it insane to think tannehill may have made many similarly good throws regardless? 
 

I didn’t watch the game and 400 yards can be wildly slinging erratically or great discipline. I didn’t see if he was hitting his reads well to dispute his grade. If someone brings breakdown of one of the others playing badly, so be it. As is they all looked good on paper and the pff folks said they all passed the eye test. No need to be insulted by being among the very best scores in the week 

And pff doesn’t grade on just yards, I was just pointing out he was highly productive 

 

for instance, he probably got a very good grade on the Davis laser but might have come up short of the 2.0 score if they decided he missed the open Lee smith and shouldn’t have. 
 

I don’t think any of us analyzed these guys on that level. 
 

he’s in an elite group for the week.  

 

Tannehill did it against charmin soft coverage down 38-7.

[The Wiz]

7 minutes ago, NoSaint said:

if in 2.5 secs one guy throws great ball dropped by smith and the other is joshs pass.... which play would you grade the qb better?

 

I can see making a great read and solid pass being a better individual performance still and that being good insight beyond yards and completion percentage. 

I don’t know how the grader marked that specific play. Could have said smith wasn’t the reasonable progression and given a perfect score. 

 

no stat will ever tell the whole story. He had a great game and received a great score. 

A drop in their metric doesn't count against the QB (at least I'm pretty sure it doesn't.  Also assuming they call it a drop and not a bad pass).

 

As far as which I would grade better.  I think of it like diving.  Every type of dive has a degree of difficulty which boosts your score depending on how well you do.  If they have a max of 2 for a clutch/tight window pass, that pass is a 2 hands down regardless of whether someone else might have been open.

 

Like I said, if you dissect a play for 5, 10, 15 minutes, you're going to find something that someone did wrong.  I know you stated that you don't necessarily mean that play in particular but looking at the other throws in the game and the 8 incompletions (4 of them throw aways) I find it hard to find a metric that can say his play wasn't one of, if not, the best of the week.

Edited December 10, 2020 by The Wiz

[Teddy KGB]

20 minutes ago, JakeFrommStateFarm said:

I would put Rivers ahead of Allen 

the whole doing nothing in the second half thing vs a bad Texans defense really sealed it for you ? 
 

impressive red zone stop by the colts d to seal the win 🙃🙃

Edited December 10, 2020 by Teddy KGB

[Hapless Bills Fan]

6 minutes ago, The Wiz said:

A drop in their metric doesn't count against the QB (at least I'm pretty sure it doesn't.  Also assuming they call it a drop and not a bad pass).

 

As far as which I would grade better.  I think of it like diving.  Every type of dive has a degree of difficulty which boosts your score depending on how well you do.  If they have a max of 2 for a clutch/tight window pass, that pass is a 2 hands down regardless of whether someone else might have been open.

 

As to that latter, TBH I'm not sure how PFF's algorithm grades it.  I think the grade may vary according to an algorithm which takes down, distance, score, and time remaining into account (not kidding). 

 

I am pretty sure that if the QB throws an on-target ball they regard as catchable, they score it as a successful pass play for the QB.  He "did his job". 

 

The bottom line is I agree with MJS that 1) PFF is not transparent about how they score plays or the algorithm they use to compute ratings and 2) they are transparent that part of their score depends upon observations they try to make objective, but that inherently have a subjective component (was that a catchable ball, an interceptable ball, etc etc)