When the Patriot Way goes wrong

[YoloinOhio]

Things are bad in Detroit but this details how bad. 

Patricia and Quinn have tried to make their New England ways work in Detroit, but one coach who has experience coaching in the Patriot Way culture says the system can be grating on players and coaches, especially if there aren't results.

"Listen, we all want to replicate the Patriots' success, but the track record of guys that come out and seem to try to replicate it is tough among front office and coaches," says another source, who has interviewed coaching candidates coming from New England, including Patricia. "Authoritarian, very hierarchical organizations, whether they are in football or otherwise, that's what you get: You don't get people to develop their own way."

 

Then you have the much discussed Bill O’Brien debacle in Houston and this on Joe Judge from last week -

 

 

[FeelingOnYouboty]

The only NE coach who’s had some success is Flores but it’s still too early to judge him.

 

Thank God for Beane and McDermott. I’m so grateful!

[LikeIGiveADarn]

Amazing how much it's looking like Brady covered for BB.

[Inigo Montoya]

I think the lack of success from the Belichick coaching tree, especially when compared to the Parcells and Andy Reid trees, is because when you are an assistant coach in New England, Bill micro-manages everything. Belichick doesn't develop coaches, he simply instructs them on how to do things his way.  When his coaches finally get a head coaching gig and leave New England they suffer from that lack of personal growth and development.  Most of these guys go off to another team and try to be Bill Belichick, like Matt Patricia is doing, and it just doesn't work.  

 

The other thing these fledgling coaches don't have is the incredible good fortune to find a unicorn like Brady, a generational talent at QB who is also beta-male enough to tolerate the constant abuse of his head coach even after numerous championships and MVPs.  What Belichick did in New England is not reproducible elsewhere and I think the rest of the League is finally starting to figure that out.

 

 

Edited November 27, 2020 by Inigo Montoya

[DaBillsFanSince1973]

38 minutes ago, FeelingOnYouboty said:

The only NE coach who’s had some success is Flores but it’s still too early to judge him.

 

Thank God for Beane and McDermott. I’m so grateful!

 

 

5-11 last season and likely to finish no better than 8-8 this season. not real success as of yet but not as bad as the others mentioned in the OP.

[Don Otreply]

Its just fine with me to watch the entire pats tree fail, to include Belichick and Brady, they all deserve what they are getting. Makes me smile every time more of it comes apart. Getting caught cheating every four ish years for decades says an awful lot the entire organization, and all the people who happily participated in it. A giant asterisks and a dark cloud hovers over every one of them. Birds of a feather as they say...

[Mark80]

17 minutes ago, A Firm Tree Does Not Fear said:

 

 

5-11 last season and likely to finish no better than 8-8 this season. not real success as of yet but not as bad as the others mentioned in the OP.

 

It is when you consider the team last year was so talent deprived that many thought they would go 0-16.  And this years team is surprising most as well.  I'm sure not many would have put them over 5 wins for the entire season. This guy is going to be a problem for us for a long time to come I'm afraid.  'Bout to be like the late 80s/early 90s rivalry again.

Edited November 27, 2020 by Mark80

[DaBillsFanSince1973]

4 minutes ago, Mark80 said:

 

It is when you consider the team last year was so talent deprived that many thought they would go 0-16.  And this years team is surprising most as well.  I'm sure not many would have put them over 5 wins for the entire season. This guy is going to be a problem for us for a long time to come I'm afraid.  'Bout to be like the late 80s/early 90s rivalry again.

we shall see...

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

This is really fascinating.

 

I actually have no doubt that the “patriot way” works in theory. It’s just impossible to implement in practice. I suspect that Bellichick lucking into it by having Tom Brady and early success and then having a few other key players who bought in— and that was just the right recipe to establish his culture.  
 

You’re not going to get any buy in, unless you are winning. 

[Coffeesforclosers]

The Patriot Way consists of:

 

1. Tom Brady

2. Ten feet of BS

3. Bill Belichick

4. 30 feet of BS

5. A bunch of kool aid drinking assistants chanting "Do Your Job!"

 

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

1 hour ago, FeelingOnYouboty said:

The only NE coach who’s had some success is Flores but it’s still too early to judge him.

 

Thank God for Beane and McDermott. I’m so grateful!

Vrabel In Tennessee is from the Pats*** tree so to speak 

 

They have had some success 

 

Not many other Belicheat offshoots have 

 

The segue -  Brady or Belichick? 
 

one or the other or was it both. 
 

sure you can argue Matt Cassel and 11 wins. Or was it just a good team all around?

 

And the Refs favoritism 

[Freddie's Dead]

The Cheatriot Way is unreproducible because it's based on cheating.  It hasn't "gone wrong", it's been wrong from the beginning.

Edited November 27, 2020 by Freddie's Dead

[Saxum]

13 minutes ago, Coffeesforclosers said:

The Patriot Way consists of:

 

1. Tom Brady

2. Ten feet of BS

3. Bill Belichick

4. 30 feet of BS

5. A bunch of kool aid drinking assistants chanting "Do Your Job!"

 

 

0.  Ernie Adams, Senior Offense Assistant and Director of Tells, Cheats and Dirty Tricks

 

 

[YoloinOhio]

7 minutes ago, SlimShady'sSpaceForce said:

Vrabel In Tennessee is from the Pats*** tree so to speak 

 

They have had some success 

 

Not many other Belicheat offshoots have 

 

The segue -  Brady or Belichick? 
 

one or the other or was it both. 
 

sure you can argue Matt Cassel and 11 wins. Or was it just a good team all around?

 

And the Refs favoritism 

I don’t consider Vrabel from that tree since he never coached there. He’s from the Bill O Brien tree though I suppose 

[dpberr]

The only time period in recent memory where I remember the Lions being somewhat consistently "good" was all the way back in the Wayne Fontes era where they got close to the SB in 1991.

 

Jim Caldwell is the only Lions coach since Joe Schmidt in 1972 to have a winning record, and it's barely a winning record at .503.

 

The Fords (husband and wife) never hired the right people. 

 

I expect now that ownership is in the hands of Sheila Ford Hamp, there's a chance things will be different there because although a Ford, she's cut from a different cloth than her parents and even her brother, Bill. 

 

I don't think she will keep Quinn and Patricia - they are as good as gone.

 

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

7 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

I don’t consider Vrabel from that tree since he never coached there. He’s from the Bill O Brien tree though I suppose 

he played for the Pats and he has used a few of the Belicheat tricks in games he’s coached. 
 

one against BB in a game IIRC 

 

 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

2 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

Things are bad in Detroit but this details how bad. 

 

TBH I think that Daboll kind of started out down that path, not relying on his assistants and not "buying in" to McDermott's belief that part of the coach's job is to figure out why the performance isn't up to standard and how to help the player improve vs. scream at them and let them figure it out or fail. 

 

It didn't help that he began in B'lo working with mostly assistants he didn't choose (OL especially).

 

I saw a big change in Daboll's approach starting about 1/3 of the way into last season (after the first Patriots game, actually) and big change in how he talks about things this season.  And changes in how McDermott seems to talk about the offense, too.  I think he has more trust in Daboll now.

To a Point.

[Call_Of_Ktulu]

21 minutes ago, Freddie's Dead said:

The Cheatriot Way is unreproducible because it's based on cheating.  It hasn't "gone wrong", it's been wrong from the beginning.

I agree, I really want a documentary done called The 6*'s. I want them to talk to people who saw the destroyed tape and dig deep into every crooked thing that the Patriots have done. 

[atlbillsfan1975]

Belichick is a proven cheater. Brady looks to be just as responsible for the Pats “dynasty”*. The longer old Bill hangs around in NE the longer, we will see the cloak slip off him and people realize he is a good HC not a great one. He is not the Nick Saban of the NFL.

Edited November 27, 2020 by atlbillsfan1975

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 hour ago, A Firm Tree Does Not Fear said:

5-11 last season and likely to finish no better than 8-8 this season. not real success as of yet but not as bad as the others mentioned in the OP.

 

When I watch the Dolphins play, they just strike me as a well-coached, well-prepared football team.

 

Which is not how Detroit or the Giants strike me.