Joshs development has been amazing

[Solomon Grundy]

8 hours ago, Putin said:

I think Kyler is much better passer then Lamar and as far as injuries goes could happen to anyone look what happened to Brees , but I agree with you on Josh I wouldn’t trade him for ANY QB in the league NOT even Mahomes 

Never thought I'd ever say I agree with Putin

[Putin]

21 minutes ago, Solomon Grundy said:

Never thought I'd ever say I agree with Putin

That’s goot I put poison awey now 

[BADOLBILZ]

2 hours ago, JohnNord said:

Yes, considering so much of the media told us thst Allen destined to be failure due to advanced analytics.  
 

Sam Monson, Mena Kimes, Cian Fahey, A-Ron Schatz et al

 

 

So you are saying that we shouldn't be surprised that a bunch of fringe analysts of no import might have had it wrong about Josh Allen?

 

Agreed.

 

 

[BADOLBILZ]

1 hour ago, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said:

 

For years I always said I'd be willing to make a bet that "QB "X" will be a failure" and I'll bet the starting QB for all 32 teams as more fail than succeed so will end up ahead on the bet.

 

Admittedly in recent years no so sure I'd take that bet anymore as there seems to be a resurgence in their overall play. My theory has always been that overall players have got too big, and too fast and with all the computer analysis the game to complicated for almost any QB to process everything fast enough to make the right decision.  10 years back there was maybe a handful who could; Brady, Manning, Brees, Rodgers.

 

Now there seems to be more good young QB's why?  Not sure, but maybe the limited practice time reduces the ability for defenses to get as complicated as they use to??  So makes the QB's look good??

 

 

It's a bunch of factors making more young QB's more productive............it really started 10 years ago with Goodell making it very hard to be violent with QB's and WR's.........the fear of being hit while prone was always the biggest limiting factor.

 

Then......after the spike in passing production......... you had the big money going the QB and WR positions.    That draws young talent to those positions and it helps the NFL get players that used to go to other sports(see Kyler Murray most recently).    And the training these young guys get is very advanced now..........it's easier to access information and the money involved has created a whole QB development industry.

 

Then the implementation of more college style offense.......like RPO's.......have made the reads and throws easier for young QB's.

 

I also think that teams are finding it too expensive to throw tons of money at defense.........and you almost need to be outstanding at every position to be outstanding at defense with the offense having so many advantages........and that is just much harder to sustain than offense is.

 

It's a lot of factors that have favored the expansion of the passing game/QB play.

[BADOLBILZ]

2 hours ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

You aren’t seeing “many projected to be unviable” as skeptical?

 

 

So Bills fans should be amazed for the skeptics?

 

What some of you guys responding to me are talking about aren't the odds that a top of the first round QB would become very good.....those are decent.

 

It's you wanting a bunch of analysts to be astonished.

 

In a league where the guys like Tom Brady and Drew Brees and Russell Wilson have dominated at a HOF level for about 50 combined years without any of them even being 1st round picks...........good luck getting people to fall over dead at Josh Allen playing well for a season.

 

Just enjoy having a good QB........the journey is the reward.      

 

 

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

 

 

 

 

[thebandit27]

1 hour ago, Gene1973 said:

The Allen selection was was a throw down between the analytics crowd and the old school football measurables crowd.

 

It seemed like a no brainer the analytics crowd would eventually win this "argument", but they have lost. Allen could definitely change how future QB prospects are evaluated. It could lead to mamy busts though, as a lot of the "tools" prospects are usually fools gold.

IMO it was more of a throw down between people that studied him intently and people that box score scouted.

[JMF2006]

I think if the Browns Giants and Jets had a redo Josh would be their guy

 

I am so happy Beane went up to 7 to get him  

 

What a perfect fit.

 

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

8 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

So Bills fans should be amazed for the skeptics?

 

What some of you guys responding to me are talking about aren't the odds that a top of the first round QB would become very good.....those are decent.

 

It's you wanting a bunch of analysts to be astonished.

 

In a league where the guys like Tom Brady and Drew Brees and Russell Wilson have dominated at a HOF level for about 50 combined years without any of them even being 1st round picks...........good luck getting people to fall over dead at Josh Allen playing well for a season.

 

Just enjoy having a good QB........the journey is the reward.      

 

 

Just because you're not impressed doesn’t mean everyone else can’t be that a prospect universally acclaimed as having an uncorrectable inaccuracy trait, is now one of the most accurate passers in the NFL, and drastically outperforming the QBs drafted ahead of him. It’s astonishing to most that understand what they saw in the first year versus now. 

[thebandit27]

7 minutes ago, Gene1973 said:

There will always be many more Kyle Bollers than Josh Allens.

No offense: that’s a total and complete non-sequitur

[thebandit27]

8 minutes ago, Gene1973 said:

Beane and McDermott touting the big arm, big hands throwing in cold weather stuff says otherwise IMO.

1) what does that have to do with Kyle Boller?

2) you think his arm and hand size are the reasons that he was drafted?

 

I really don’t see your point here.

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

 

 

 

 

 

 

Even the majority of the Power Rankings are praising Josh for his final drive and mentioning a "lucky" Hail Mary play. 

 

[JohnNord]

11 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

So you are saying that we shouldn't be surprised that a bunch of fringe analysts of no import might have had it wrong about Josh Allen?

 

Agreed.

 

 

Ha ha yes!  It’s actually surprising how many fans (myself included) as well as other analysts and media members allowed this crew to completely shape their opinion that Allen was going to bust and that Rosen was THE choice at pick 7.  

[BADOLBILZ]

8 hours ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

Just because you're not impressed doesn’t mean everyone else can’t be that a prospect universally acclaimed as having an uncorrectable inaccuracy trait, is now one of the most accurate passers in the NFL, and drastically outperforming the QBs drafted ahead of him. It’s astonishing to most that understand what they saw in the first year versus now. 

 

 

I never said I wasn't impressed.........just not filled with astonishment by it.

 

And you are wrong about his accuracy issues being "universally" believed to be uncorrectable.

 

That's hyperbole.

 

When Allen was having accuracy issues in year 1 there were a number of analysts who pointed out that most of them were correctable thru better mechanics and it was often emphasized how inexperienced he was at the position compared to other prospects etc..

 

He then made huge strides on some throws last year,  becoming one of the most accurate short passers in the league.

 

He's taken more strides and the game has clearly slowed for him and he's gotten more help in the receiving corps this year.

 

A switch didn't just come on overnight.........it wasn't a bestowed miracle........this has been a relatively linear advancement..........which isn't always the case with QB play...........but it's not "beyond shocking".  

 

He still has to resolve some deep ball/touch issues but at the current rate one would think that he will get there in the near future.

 

We had a thread recently about fan confidence in McBeane..........and it said that a poll of Bills fans said that 89% were very confident in the direction they had the Bills going............and just a couple posts into it someone posted that there was "endless negativity" from Bills fans.    

 

Some people just can't contain their need to exaggerate.......

[SCBills]

Top 10 in every single category listed 

 

(swipe through if you have ig)

 

https://www.instagram.com/p/CHtg0_2DcP1/?igshid=c4v5c1d1c4mq

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

1 hour ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

I never said I wasn't impressed.........just not filled with astonishment by it.

 

And you are wrong about his accuracy issues being "universally" believed to be uncorrectable.

 

That's hyperbole.

 

When Allen was having accuracy issues in year 1 there were a number of analysts who pointed out that most of them were correctable thru better mechanics and it was often emphasized how inexperienced he was at the position compared to other prospects etc..

 

He then made huge strides on some throws last year,  becoming one of the most accurate short passers in the league.

 

He's taken more strides and the game has clearly slowed for him and he's gotten more help in the receiving corps this year.

 

A switch didn't just come on overnight.........it wasn't a bestowed miracle........this has been a relatively linear advancement..........which isn't always the case with QB play...........but it's not "beyond shocking".  

 

He still has to resolve some deep ball/touch issues but at the current rate one would think that he will get there in the near future.

 

We had a thread recently about fan confidence in McBeane..........and it said that a poll of Bills fans said that 89% were very confident in the direction they had the Bills going............and just a couple posts into it someone posted that there was "endless negativity" from Bills fans.    

 

Some people just can't contain their need to exaggerate.......

so you were impressed? Ok then in other words according to a thesaurus, you might have even been synonymously somewhat .... wait for it.... astonished. 
 

what you call hyperbole I call a legitimate belief routinely stated by numerous football experts. Not agreeing with them but the list of objective football people who believe college completion percentage correlates to NFL performance is long. 

 

some people can’t contain their need to split hairs for the sake of an boredom arguing for no real apparent cause whatsoever 😂 
 

basically we’re both Violently agreeing we’re impressed by how much he has improved... but I’m overstating things because I’m Just little more impressed than you. 

[BADOLBILZ]

19 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

so you were impressed? Ok then in other words according to a thesaurus, you might have even been synonymously somewhat .... wait for it.... astonished. 
 

what you call hyperbole I call a legitimate belief routinely stated by numerous football experts. Not agreeing with them but the list of objective football people who believe college completion percentage correlates to NFL performance is long. 

 

some people can’t contain their need to split hairs for the sake of an boredom arguing for no real apparent cause whatsoever 😂 
 

basically we’re both Violently agreeing we’re impressed by how much he has improved... but I’m overstating things because I’m Just little more impressed than you. 

 

 

Impress and astonish are not synonyms..............that's like saying good and great are exactly the same.

 

I expected and still expect Allen to become great......he's getting there..........that was the point of making him the highest selected QB in franchise history.

 

You and some others are astonished......apparently because *some* people whose opinions you chose to give weight to said that Allen wouldn't be good.....and now he is.

 

I think the theoretical difference is that I expect results and some others want results but are often afraid to even hope for them.

 

I understand that a lot of that is due to Bills ownership/management letting you down.

 

But you gotta' have perspective......the NFL is a business centered around a violent,  ultra-competitive game........you shouldn't feel like you as a fan are less worthy or likely to benefit from the NFL's intention to create parity.   

 

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

1 hour ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Impress and astonish are not synonyms..............that's like saying good and great are exactly the same.

 

 

They are similar words, but with varying magnitudes... just like based on the last few seasons, we expected Josh should be hopefully good this year but the leading passer in the nfl nearly 70% 10 games in, 100+ passer rating, gaudy YPA??? That’s great. Who jumps ten points in completion percentage YoY? 
 

so I guess to your point since Josh has been great this season not just good. It’s more than impressive.. I wish there were a word to convey that. I’ll go with astonishing 

 

You go with whatever suits you.
 

I tend to firm up my expectations around things I have a deep and up close understanding of or are actively influencing.  
 

Absent one of those two things expectation is just a naive version of expectation called  hope. 

Edited November 19, 2020 by Over 29 years of fanhood

[FeelingOnYouboty]

From bottom 5 in nearly all statistical categories to Top 5. Unreal!

 

i think he’s going to make another jump from Year 3 to Year 4.

[BruceVilanch]

I'm just here to see the breakdown between "astonished" and "Impressed"