Joe B article on the game (Athletic). Fair.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

I think Joe's assessment is pretty fair in this one:

https://theathletic.com/2200307/2020/11/16/bills-cardinals-josh-allen/?source=emp_shared_article

(paywall, trial available)

 

It all began with the pass rush. The Bills got Murray on the run and likely intended to keep him in front of them and on his back foot. As we saw during the game and over the course of the season, when Murray finds room to operate when rolling to his left, he can make a defense pay. The Bills’ edge rusher on the play was defensive end Mario Addison, who’d forced Murray to run horizontally throughout the game without much success. Addison worked past his blocker as Murray began to roll toward him and, at one point, was within 2 yards of Murray without a blocker between them. At that moment, Addison had a choice: He could play it safe and move side to side to try to disrupt Murray or he could go for it all and try to end the game with a sack. Even though the Bills focused on staying square all week, Addison lunged at Murray and missed. That gave Murray space to throw and he bought more time by rolling as far left as he could. Had Addison played it safe and held Murray up until reinforcements arrived, Addison likely would have forced Murray into an uneven throw as time expired. He made the wrong choice and left it up to the secondary to make the play.

Once the ball was in the air, the outcome still was in the Bills’ favor. The defense was in quarters coverage, and by the time Hopkins went to pull in the reception, he was engulfed by three Bills’ defenders. The defensive backs were in perfect position, and likely nine times out of ten, that ball hits the ground. Why didn’t the defenders try to knock the ball down? White was a little underneath in coverage, and if he went barreling into Hopkins’s chest first, he ran the risk of getting flagged for defensive pass interference. So, White tried to box out Hopkins and use both hands to try to bat down the pass. The problem was not the technique itself; it was that Hopkins timed the jump better than anyone else, had the best leaping ability of the four players and had strong enough hands to complete the catch.

While some might criticize those defensive backs for not knocking down the pass, I’m chalking it up as an unbelievable play by one of the best receivers in the league. Sometimes it is that simple. The pass and the jump had to be perfect to beat that tight coverage, and they were. To me, the player most at fault was Addison, who went for the big play rather than the smart play well before the throw. If he didn’t do that, I firmly believe the Bills would be 8-2 at this moment.

 

I think it's probably a fair point that if White goes up one handed and gets higher, he might knock it away - but it's also a fair point that it's easier for a top WR to overcome one hand to make a catch if the knock-away isn't perfect.

 

[H2o]

Poyer also jumped early and bumped White just slightly out of position while in the air. 

[SCBills]

I think this is a great point on Addison.  When he lunged and missed, I felt a bit of dread as Murray rolled left and had all sorts of room to wind up.  I certainly didn't think anyone would catch it, but it didn't need to get to that point.   Addison doesn't do that and he's simply running with Murray, which doesn't allow Murray to reset and launch.

 

Addison abandoned every principle of how that last play needed to be defensed.

 

 

Edited November 16, 2020 by SCBills

[BuffaloRebound]

Yes, Addison was at fault, but one of your 3 highly paid DB’s have to prevent that catch.  

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

Forcing a hail marry from the 43 with no time left into triple coverage is a play you expect to win. 
 

tough loss, unlucky play. 

[dave mcbride]

9 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

I think Joe's assessment is pretty fair in this one:

https://theathletic.com/2200307/2020/11/16/bills-cardinals-josh-allen/?source=emp_shared_article

(paywall, trial available)

 

It all began with the pass rush. The Bills got Murray on the run and likely intended to keep him in front of them and on his back foot. As we saw during the game and over the course of the season, when Murray finds room to operate when rolling to his left, he can make a defense pay. The Bills’ edge rusher on the play was defensive end Mario Addison, who’d forced Murray to run horizontally throughout the game without much success. Addison worked past his blocker as Murray began to roll toward him and, at one point, was within 2 yards of Murray without a blocker between them. At that moment, Addison had a choice: He could play it safe and move side to side to try to disrupt Murray or he could go for it all and try to end the game with a sack. Even though the Bills focused on staying square all week, Addison lunged at Murray and missed. That gave Murray space to throw and he bought more time by rolling as far left as he could. Had Addison played it safe and held Murray up until reinforcements arrived, Addison likely would have forced Murray into an uneven throw as time expired. He made the wrong choice and left it up to the secondary to make the play.

Once the ball was in the air, the outcome still was in the Bills’ favor. The defense was in quarters coverage, and by the time Hopkins went to pull in the reception, he was engulfed by three Bills’ defenders. The defensive backs were in perfect position, and likely nine times out of ten, that ball hits the ground. Why didn’t the defenders try to knock the ball down? White was a little underneath in coverage, and if he went barreling into Hopkins’s chest first, he ran the risk of getting flagged for defensive pass interference. So, White tried to box out Hopkins and use both hands to try to bat down the pass. The problem was not the technique itself; it was that Hopkins timed the jump better than anyone else, had the best leaping ability of the four players and had strong enough hands to complete the catch.

While some might criticize those defensive backs for not knocking down the pass, I’m chalking it up as an unbelievable play by one of the best receivers in the league. Sometimes it is that simple. The pass and the jump had to be perfect to beat that tight coverage, and they were. To me, the player most at fault was Addison, who went for the big play rather than the smart play well before the throw. If he didn’t do that, I firmly believe the Bills would be 8-2 at this moment.

 

I think it's probably a fair point that if White goes up one handed and gets higher, he might knock it away - but it's also a fair point that it's easier for a top WR to overcome one hand to make a catch if the knock-away isn't perfect.

 

From Peter King’s column today:

 

“The game’s on the line,” Murray said. “I can’t get tackled here. There was no chance he was tackling me. No chance. The angle he took at me, I’m fortunate he took that angle,” Murray said. Addison touched Murray but didn’t have a good shot at him really, and flew past. Murray took another step, then turned upfield, maybe eight yards from the Cardinal sideline at about the Arizona 48-yard line.

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

11 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

I think Joe's assessment is pretty fair in this one:

https://theathletic.com/2200307/2020/11/16/bills-cardinals-josh-allen/?source=emp_shared_article

(paywall, trial available)

 

It all began with the pass rush. The Bills got Murray on the run and likely intended to keep him in front of them and on his back foot. As we saw during the game and over the course of the season, when Murray finds room to operate when rolling to his left, he can make a defense pay. The Bills’ edge rusher on the play was defensive end Mario Addison, who’d forced Murray to run horizontally throughout the game without much success. Addison worked past his blocker as Murray began to roll toward him and, at one point, was within 2 yards of Murray without a blocker between them. At that moment, Addison had a choice: He could play it safe and move side to side to try to disrupt Murray or he could go for it all and try to end the game with a sack. Even though the Bills focused on staying square all week, Addison lunged at Murray and missed. That gave Murray space to throw and he bought more time by rolling as far left as he could. Had Addison played it safe and held Murray up until reinforcements arrived, Addison likely would have forced Murray into an uneven throw as time expired. He made the wrong choice and left it up to the secondary to make the play.

Once the ball was in the air, the outcome still was in the Bills’ favor. The defense was in quarters coverage, and by the time Hopkins went to pull in the reception, he was engulfed by three Bills’ defenders. The defensive backs were in perfect position, and likely nine times out of ten, that ball hits the ground. Why didn’t the defenders try to knock the ball down? White was a little underneath in coverage, and if he went barreling into Hopkins’s chest first, he ran the risk of getting flagged for defensive pass interference. So, White tried to box out Hopkins and use both hands to try to bat down the pass. The problem was not the technique itself; it was that Hopkins timed the jump better than anyone else, had the best leaping ability of the four players and had strong enough hands to complete the catch.

While some might criticize those defensive backs for not knocking down the pass, I’m chalking it up as an unbelievable play by one of the best receivers in the league. Sometimes it is that simple. The pass and the jump had to be perfect to beat that tight coverage, and they were. To me, the player most at fault was Addison, who went for the big play rather than the smart play well before the throw. If he didn’t do that, I firmly believe the Bills would be 8-2 at this moment.

 

I think it's probably a fair point that if White goes up one handed and gets higher, he might knock it away - but it's also a fair point that it's easier for a top WR to overcome one hand to make a catch if the knock-away isn't perfect.

 

 

Have to agree... Hughes play on the wilson INT the week before is the example of this.  Just stay with him and force him to worry about you, and not have his eyes down field.  

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 minute ago, dave mcbride said:

From Peter King’s column today:

 

“The game’s on the line,” Murray said. “I can’t get tackled here. There was no chance he was tackling me. No chance. The angle he took at me, I’m fortunate he took that angle,” Murray said. Addison touched Murray but didn’t have a good shot at him really, and flew past. Murray took another step, then turned upfield, maybe eight yards from the Cardinal sideline at about the Arizona 48-yard line.

 

Got a linky?

[dave mcbride]

1 minute ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Got a linky?

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2020/11/16/fmia-week-10-inside-the-hail-murray-and-how-the-cardinals-got-it-done/

[BuffaloRebound]

Addison did the same thing on Murray’s TD run.  Went for the fake and flailed taking himself out of the play.  After 10 games who wouldn’t trade Shaq Lawson for Addison right now?  

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

Just now, BuffaloRebound said:

Addison did the same thing on Murray’s TD run.  Went for the fake and flailed taking himself out of the play.  After 10 games who wouldn’t trade Shaq Lawson for Addison right now?  

 

Well thats a read-option... he played the back.  If he plays the QB then he hands it off.  

[BuffaloRebound]

Just now, dneveu said:

 

Well thats a read-option... he played the back.  If he plays the QB then he hands it off.  

 You think he was gonna get to the RB on that play?   Put himself in no man’s land.  

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

Just now, BuffaloRebound said:

 You think he was gonna get to the RB on that play?   Put himself in no man’s land.  

 

It takes away the cutback lane if he were to head to his left.

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

5 minutes ago, BuffaloRebound said:

Addison did the same thing on Murray’s TD run.  Went for the fake and flailed taking himself out of the play.  After 10 games who wouldn’t trade Shaq Lawson for Addison right now?  

Murray does that to everyone. 

[TigerJ]

Tony Dungy (on the Sunday night pregame show) thought the Bills should have jammed the Arizona receivers at the LOS.  Don't know if that would have made a difference.  He also thought Buffalo paid too much attention to Arizona players who were not going to be targets.  Another possibility, had Buffalo expected a Hail Mary, would have been to put some receivers on the field, Kumerow and Davis come to mind, who have physical attributes to contest a Hail Mary better than White and Hyde, who aren't that big.  As always, hindsight is easier than foresight.

[Jauronimo]

25 minutes ago, H2o said:

Poyer also jumped early and bumped White just slightly out of position while in the air. 

It wasn't slight.  He knocked Tre on his ass.  Tre still has a chance to get a hand in there and rip the ball loose until Poyer cleans him out.

[Mr. Magoo]

26 minutes ago, H2o said:

Poyer also jumped early and bumped White just slightly out of position while in the air. 

I also saw that and that slight bumped changed everything.

[bigK14094]

6 minutes ago, TigerJ said:

Tony Dungy (on the Sunday night pregame show) thought the Bills should have jammed the Arizona receivers at the LOS.  Don't know if that would have made a difference.  He also thought Buffalo paid too much attention to Arizona players who were not going to be targets.  Another possibility, had Buffalo expected a Hail Mary, would have been to put some receivers on the field, Kumerow and Davis come to mind, who have physical attributes to contest a Hail Mary better than White and Hyde, who aren't that big.  As always, hindsight is easier than foresight.

YEs, Bellicheck used to use Gronk as a db in that situation.  Our coaches need to be smarter.

[dave mcbride]

6 minutes ago, TigerJ said:

Tony Dungy (on the Sunday night pregame show) thought the Bills should have jammed the Arizona receivers at the LOS.  Don't know if that would have made a difference.  He also thought Buffalo paid too much attention to Arizona players who were not going to be targets.  Another possibility, had Buffalo expected a Hail Mary, would have been to put some receivers on the field, Kumerow and Davis come to mind, who have physical attributes to contest a Hail Mary better than White and Hyde, who aren't that big.  As always, hindsight is easier than foresight.

As I said elsewhere, Kenyon Drake was on the field and scored a final second td on the most miraculous play (vs NE) two before. And it wasn’t a hail mary. You can’t ignore that as a coach. 

Just now, bigK14094 said:

YEs, Bellicheck used to use Gronk as a db in that situation.  Our coaches need to be smarter.

That worked so well vs. Kenyon Drake two years ago, who was literally the RB on the field for AZ on that play yesterday!

[BADOLBILZ]

12 minutes ago, BuffaloRebound said:

Addison did the same thing on Murray’s TD run.  Went for the fake and flailed taking himself out of the play.  After 10 games who wouldn’t trade Shaq Lawson for Addison right now?  

 

 

Shaq has literally half as many sacks and TFL's as Addison to this point............he hasn't been good at all......think 2016-2018 Shaq....... and they have him on the books for $10.5M  guaranteed next year.

 

And if you think he was going to be a difference maker against Murray in the open field you are nuts.    

 

Addison has been somewhat disappointing but he's been able to fill in some at the Lorax position as well as DE........he had good plays against Mahomes as a spy and has 3 passes defensed thus far this season too.    Much more versatile player.

 

They gotta' get better than Addison and Shaq at DE........hopefully Johnson and Epenesa become those guys..........but Addison is just a rental and not one of their bigger issues on defense.