One thing has me feeling better about the defense going forward...

[Beast]

The Bills will beat every team left on their schedule.

[BFLO]

1 hour ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

Where are the 3 and outs?  Winning franchises are allowed to prevent the opposing teams from scoring at will in the 3rd Q blowing big leads.

 

You're basically saying that it's up to the Offense to make up for blown leads by the D in the second half.  

 

 

Against the Dolphins, the Bills had a modest lead going into the 4th Q (again, agaisnt the Dolphins).  In the 4th Q, the O scored 14 more points.  The D, however, gave up 15 points in the 4th--the Dolphins comeback only dying on a failed onside kick.    The Bills scored 31 points.

 

Against the Rams, the Bills held a 28-3 lead until under 6 minutes into the 3rd Q.  In 15 minutes, they gave up 29 points. Allen leads the winning comeback drive  ( a comeback...after leading by 25 points late in the 3rd!!).  Bills score 35 points.

 

Against NE they were trading TDs against Cam Newton and NE scrubs.  It took a FF by Zimmer to stop a game tying/winning drive by a team that should have been blown out.

 

And then of course the Cards.  Another sizeable lead later in the game evaporated.  Bills comeback to take the lead.  Defense lets Murray scramble all over the field until he throws the perfect hail mary.  Bill score 32.

 

So in each game where the D struggled, the Bills averaged 30.5 points scored.    Daboll can't figure out how to make a running game work (save for 1 game), I'll give you that.  But this D can't hold a lead.  

 

 

 

I'm saying it's on the offense to burn a lottttt more clock in the second half and stop giving the opposing O short fields. You don't need your O to keep scoring after you have the lead if they can burn clock. 

 

Like the Rams game, look at the Bills offensive possessions after taking the 28-3 lead, and before the game winning drive.

 

2 plays -8 yards, 0:34

3 plays 0 yards 1:35

6 plays 27 yards 3:09

 

Turn the first 2 of those into 5 minute drives where the Bills don't even score and the game is over. 28-25 Bills win.

 

Look at the Arizona game after going up 23-9

 

3 plays 6 yards 1:09

3 plays 14 yards 1:52

6 plays 5 yards 3:17

4 plays 8 yards 2:37

1 play 0 yards :07

[njbuff]

2 hours ago, Beast said:

The Bills will beat every team left on their schedule.

 

They easily could, but they don't click on all cylinders during games to give themselves easy wins.

 

And when you keep opponents in games, NO MATTER WHO THE OPPOSITION IS, you will get picked off.

 

I am forgetting about the HaIl Joke for a minute...........

 

How is it that when you build a 23-9 lead, then all of a sudden fall off the planet after that? Not good.

 

Just about every Bills win has been a merry-go-round this year and unless they can adopt a bulls-by-the-horn method of closing out these games..........

 

how can we expect the Bills doing any better than 4-2 with the remaining schedule.

 

They can obviously win them all, but will they realistically do that the way they have played the first 10 games?

[TBBills]

We will get Milano back and be so much better. A second half of defensive turnovers are about to start.

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

2 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

The Cards scored  in 23 plays--all in the 3rd Q.  Don't want it to be 23 plays?  make it 3 three and outs.  If a D cannot get off the field that's their problem.  AZ Defense was getting off the field. 

 

Patient; "Doc, I get really tired doing this"

 

Doc: "stop doing that"....

 

Easier said than done. When your own offense keeps going 3 and out an sprinkle in an Int on top, you never get to rest.  And yes Az offense also didn't get much rest, but it always affects the defense more as they are chasing.  Throw in a guy like Murray really makes it tiring.   That was why the K gun in the 90s worked so well as you'd have an exhausted defense.

 

I'll add to your story:

 

Patient; "Doc, I get really tired doing this" as this dog keeps chasing me

 

Doc: "stop doing that"....

 

Patient "then the dog will catch me"

 

Moral of the story you can't stop doing something if you can't control it, i.e stopping the dog ....   in this case can't control not getting any rest.

[Mr. WEO]

1 hour ago, BFLO said:

I'm saying it's on the offense to burn a lottttt more clock in the second half and stop giving the opposing O short fields. You don't need your O to keep scoring after you have the lead if they can burn clock. 

 

Like the Rams game, look at the Bills offensive possessions after taking the 28-3 lead, and before the game winning drive.

 

2 plays -8 yards, 0:34

3 plays 0 yards 1:35

6 plays 27 yards 3:09

 

Turn the first 2 of those into 5 minute drives where the Bills don't even score and the game is over. 28-25 Bills win.

 

Look at the Arizona game after going up 23-9

 

3 plays 6 yards 1:09

3 plays 14 yards 1:52

6 plays 5 yards 3:17

4 plays 8 yards 2:37

1 play 0 yards :07

 

 

The D is free to make more stops.  They fall apart after halftime.  Why can't this D do the same to opponent's Offenses in the 2nd half?  This happened in last year's playoff game.

 

Again, the Bills scored 31 PPG in those games I referenced.  They gave up 29 PPG.

 

What kind of team makes a habit out of turning comfortable second half leads into come from behind thrillers?

 

If you argument is that a team that puts up 31 a game in a stretch of close games has a problem with the Offense......you have some heavy lifting ahead of you.

[Mr. WEO]

1 hour ago, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said:

 

Easier said than done. When your own offense keeps going 3 and out an sprinkle in an Int on top, you never get to rest.  And yes Az offense also didn't get much rest, but it always affects the defense more as they are chasing.  Throw in a guy like Murray really makes it tiring.   That was why the K gun in the 90s worked so well as you'd have an exhausted defense.

 

I'll add to your story:

 

Patient; "Doc, I get really tired doing this" as this dog keeps chasing me

 

Doc: "stop doing that"....

 

Patient "then the dog will catch me"

 

Moral of the story you can't stop doing something if you can't control it, i.e stopping the dog ....   in this case can't control not getting any rest.

 

 

Sure you can---you even said so in your second sentence:  make them keep going 3 and out.  If you can't, you're going to get tired.

 

The Bills came out of the half and ran 10 plays, got 3 1st downs and then punted. The Bills get the ball right back and run 5 plays and score a TD to pad the lead even more.   So the Bills D get back on the field  for the first time since then end of the half at 9:52 left in the 3rd.  In only 4 minutes they give up a 10 play TD. 

 

Followed was the disastrous Bojo punt (THIS is what gave the Cards a short field).  Cards kick FG 90 seconds later. 

 

After another 1.5 min of play, Allen throws a pick and the Cards drive 56 yards on 4 plays (3 runs!) in exactly 60 seconds for another TD.

 

So....in the 3rd Q, the D gave up 17 points in 6 min 43 seconds on the clock..........because they were "tired"-----after halftime and standing on the sidelines until 9:52 in the 3rd?  Someone should fire the Strength and Conditioning staff..

 

Come on....after the Bills fell behind, they forced consecutive 3 and outs in the 4th Q.  Was the D suddenly rejuvenated?

 

 

Edited November 19, 2020 by Mr. WEO

[Antonio]

On 11/16/2020 at 3:03 PM, noacls said:

Improvement? Last 3 game average they are giving up 29 points, 253 passing yards, 154 rushing yards.  They should have lost to NE. Changes have to be made or the playoffs may be a dream. 

You do realize that we have faced the top scoring offenses in the NFL right?!

 

Won one and we had the other one, and the D gave the Offense a chance at the end, that’s all you can ask for when facing top teams. 
 

Well we can also ask for no catch on a well covered Hail Merry hehe 

[streetkings01]

Seems the defense has found its groove......good enough to win us a game.

[Big Turk]

They made Herbert look bad for most of the game. A few good plays but his feet were all over the place. The most underwhelming 300 yard passing day I have ever seen.

On 11/18/2020 at 6:34 PM, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

The D is free to make more stops.  They fall apart after halftime.  Why can't this D do the same to opponent's Offenses in the 2nd half?  This happened in last year's playoff game.

 

Again, the Bills scored 31 PPG in those games I referenced.  They gave up 29 PPG.

 

What kind of team makes a habit out of turning comfortable second half leads into come from behind thrillers?

 

If you argument is that a team that puts up 31 a game in a stretch of close games has a problem with the Offense......you have some heavy lifting ahead of you.

 

Pretty much every team in the NFL?

 

No lead is safe. The Packers turned a big halftime lead into a loss last week in Indy. KC survived a comeback attempt by TB after being up 17-0 amd 27-10. 

 

It's just how the league is. Too many rules favoring the offense and too many penalties on defense now. Thinking otherwise is simply just not watching enough other games.

[appoo]

Defense absolutely won this game. They were close to dominant in the 2nd half at linebacker and coverage, and the DEs were a constant menace even if they weren’t sacking Herbert (who has an insanely quick release). 
 

No idea how Milano improves on Klein. That was a tremendous performance from the backers, and especially Klein. 
 

But with the back 7 getting healthy, they’re as good as anyone at this point.

 

definitelt need to to work on their Hail Mary D

[TigerJ]

5 minutes ago, appoo said:

Defense absolutely won this game. They were close to dominant in the 2nd half at linebacker and coverage, and the DEs were a constant menace even if they weren’t sacking Herbert (who has an insanely quick release). 
 

No idea how Milano improves on Klein. That was a tremendous performance from the backers, and especially Klein. 
 

But with the back 7 getting healthy, they’re as good as anyone at this point.

 

definitelt need to to work on their Hail Mary D

Matt Milano can do a lot of things well.  AJ Klein doesn't do as many things well.  The Bills coaching staff finally figured that out and made adjustments that ask Klein to doo mostly the things he's good at.  You can get good results when Klein is being disruptive in the backfield, but you don't want to give him a lot of responsibility in pass coverage.  Milano was a safety before he was a linebacker, so he has a better handle on pass coverage.

[Mr. WEO]

1 hour ago, matter2003 said:

They made Herbert look bad for most of the game. A few good plays but his feet were all over the place. The most underwhelming 300 yard passing day I have ever seen.

 

Pretty much every team in the NFL?

 

No lead is safe. The Packers turned a big halftime lead into a loss last week in Indy. KC survived a comeback attempt by TB after being up 17-0 amd 27-10. 

 

It's just how the league is. Too many rules favoring the offense and too many penalties on defense now. Thinking otherwise is simply just not watching enough other games.

Do these rules make teams blow big leads late in the game?  Why didn’t these rules make the Bills D serially blow big leads during the regular season last yea?  Are these recent rule changes? 

 

Sure you pick a few other teams that blew leads here and there, but that’s not what I was talking about.

[appoo]

11 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

Do these rules make teams blow big leads late in the game?  Why didn’t these rules make the Bills D serially blow big leads during the regular season last yea?  Are these recent rule changes? 

 

Sure you pick a few other teams that blew leads here and there, but that’s not what I was talking about.

24 - 6 to 27 - 17 isn’t remotely blowing a blowing a big lead 

[Mr. WEO]

Just now, appoo said:

24 - 6 to 27 - 17 isn’t remotely blowing a blowing a big lead 

true but that was today’s game.  You were responding to a post of mine after AZ game.  

[appoo]

3 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

true but that was today’s game.  You were responding to a post of mine after AZ game.  

I wouldn’t really consider that “blowing it” either. Bills were up 2 TDs without about half the game to go.  And it’s not the Bills were dominant either, to get to that point. Mean reversion meant that it was always likely that the Cards were going to come back and score a bunch of points. Just too much talent.   
 

Thing is, the Bills don’t play in a vacuum. Yea we want to see defenders making good plays, but at the same time you got NFL athletes lining up across from you, and they’re doing their damndest to make life hell for the Bills. You’re not watching collapses so much as you’re seeing the opposition asserting itself. That’s football, especially in the league, designed for parity of talent. 

[PaoloBillsFanFromItaly]

Defense seemed to shine with a lot of 5 and 6 men pressures.

But I don't think this can be sustainable in the long run, the chargers beated the blitz badly with the swing pass to the HB, other teams will figure it out this and other counters.

We have to make our base zone cover2/quarters defense working, this is the McDermott defense identity and OCCASIONALY mix up with man pressure (or zone blitz), this is the recipe of a dominant defense.

[Mr. WEO]

7 hours ago, appoo said:

I wouldn’t really consider that “blowing it” either. Bills were up 2 TDs without about half the game to go.  And it’s not the Bills were dominant either, to get to that point. Mean reversion meant that it was always likely that the Cards were going to come back and score a bunch of points. Just too much talent.   
 

Thing is, the Bills don’t play in a vacuum. Yea we want to see defenders making good plays, but at the same time you got NFL athletes lining up across from you, and they’re doing their damndest to make life hell for the Bills. You’re not watching collapses so much as you’re seeing the opposition asserting itself. That’s football, especially in the league, designed for parity of talent. 

 

Nope.  They were up 14 points with 6 minutes left in the 3rd Q.  They gave up 17 points in under 15 minutes.

 

Mean reversion?  AZ has scored under 25 points 5 times in 11 games---including only 21 against (NFL's worst Defense) and 17 against a mediocre NE Defense....those were their last 2 games.  There is no reversion to the mean  within a game....

[Dont Stop Billeiving]

12 hours ago, TigerJ said:

Matt Milano can do a lot of things well.  AJ Klein doesn't do as many things well.  The Bills coaching staff finally figured that out and made adjustments that ask Klein to doo mostly the things he's good at.  You can get good results when Klein is being disruptive in the backfield, but you don't want to give him a lot of responsibility in pass coverage.  Milano was a safety before he was a linebacker, so he has a better handle on pass coverage.

Agreed. The really exciting thing is that with Klein's resurgence (and better use of his skill set) and Milano hopefully back healthy this week, we will have all three LBs playing as well and as healthy as we've had all year (fingers crossed it stays that way!).

 

When offenses went heavy against us earlier this year, we struggled a lot given Klein's shortcomings and the injuries Edmunds and Milano were carrying. Now we can mix and match those three guys depending on the down and distance and that should be a real asset to this defense and maybe a return to last year's dominant defense. 

[BuffaloBill]

I thought the OP was going to say the improved play of Klein. Putting Milano on a big fat contract seems to be less of a priority now.