Quinton Spain released; signs with Bengals PS

[Mr. WEO]

Meh...adios

[JGMcD2]

10 minutes ago, Victory Formation said:

I think Spain is and has been a better guard than Cody Ford has been... Ford was only out there because he was a high pick.. McBeane was ashamed to admit that they blew a high pick on a below average guard, a player they traded up for nonetheless... then they traded Wyatt Teller for a bag of footballs and he’s been an elite guard for the Browns.. 

Yes, Brandon Beane is extremely afraid to part with underperforming players that this regime has drafted and missed on. 
 

He’s totally never traded one away, the coaching staff has totally never benched one. They’re just thick skulled with no ability to assess anything. He must be so embarrassed and so stubborn that it impacts his decision making. Such a horrible leader. 
 

Yes, Cody Ford a player who has 6 career starts at guard is below average and has no room for improvement and is an absolute bust. 

3 minutes ago, uticaclub said:

Not a precedent to set. When the going gets tough, pout about and you'll get released. I know there's two sides and no one really knows what's going on, but how the hell do we release a guy like this after signing a 3 year deal. 

Idk. Ask Belicheck... he does stuff like this all the time. His culture sucks over there in New England. 

[Aussie Joe]

2 minutes ago, MrEpsYtown said:

I think the fact that they kept him over Teller and Spencer Long is meaningful. Also, when they released Ike briefly a couple of years ago, he was quickly scooped up by KC. I think people around the league like his potential. 

Well yes they decided to keep him over Teller... thats not looking a great Idea now ...assume Long was moved on to save cap space...He was on $4mil per year from memory which was too much for a back up...

 

 I want to believe that he is going to work out but given he is now in his third year would suggest that the lightbulb needs to switch on for him very soon 

[Matt_In_NH]

8 minutes ago, uticaclub said:

Not a precedent to set. When the going gets tough, pout about and you'll get released. I know there's two sides and no one really knows what's going on, but how the hell do we release a guy like this after signing a 3 year deal. 

 

I think this is more a case by case basis. When they signed him to that extension I think they would have expected him to be playing.  So that obviously did not go that way, he is a fairly high paid backup, bad attitude, you can save some loot on the cap, sometimes its best to cut bait and move on.  In another situation you dont just get released.  I think they also wanted a roster spot for Zimmer in the near term.

[ghostwriter]

1 minute ago, JGMcD2 said:

Yes, Brandon Beane is extremely afraid to part with underperforming players that this regime has drafted and missed on. 
 

He’s totally never traded one away, the coaching staff has totally never benched one. They’re just thick skulled with no ability to assess anything. He must be so embarrassed and so stubborn that it impacts his decision making. Such a horrible leader. 
 

Yes, Cody Ford a player who has 6 career starts at guard is below average and has no room for improvement and is an absolute bust. 

He had all of last year too.. Spain and Teller are both better yet he’s stuck with Ford. Why? 
 

Dawkins-Spain-Morse-Teller-Williams is much better than what we have now.. That’s actually a very good OL. Should have let Mongo and Spain fight for LG and kept Teller at RG.. Fact that we got rid of Teller, a diamond in the rough, one of the guys we drafted for subpar below average guards is concerning.. then Spain is released too only to be replaced by someone he’s better than... I’d be pissed too.
 

Say what you want man..

[John from Riverside]

The timing of this......after the Ford injury....Boatgner actually getting live reps.....

 

THere has to be SOMETHING going on

[RyanC883]

46 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

The dead cap hit is almost identical to the cap hit if we keep him - we get about $250,000.  So no impact on cap.

 

Per Overthecap, his base salary wasn't fully guaranteed - $1.6 out of $2.25M fully guaranteed. 

Depending on how the contract was written, if he catches on somewhere else, the Bills may get some or all of that back.  He also had $31,250 of per-game Roster bonuses he may not have been getting if inactive, and that we don't have to pay - $312,500.  So $562,500 of savings I think, even if he sits all year.

 

Is Spain looking to go back to the Titans with Taylor Lewan on season-ending IR?  Yes, yes, I know Lewan is the LT and Q is a guard... but the Titans have Roger Saffold playing LG, who started in the NFL as a LT with the Rams.  Is it possible they might feel moving Saffold to LT and putting Spain next to him would be a better line than starting their swing tackle backup Ty Sambrallo?

 

the point is that if Spain is here, we have a backup OL.  Currently, he is gone, with, as you correctly point out, no benefit to the cap.  So, we are down a player, with less availability to sign someone.  

[Aussie Joe]

1 minute ago, RyanC883 said:

 

the point is that if Spain is here, we have a backup OL.  Currently, he is gone, with, as you correctly point out, no benefit to the cap.  So, we are down a player, with less availability to sign someone.  

 

Agreed.. Why not keep him for the rest of the year as insurance against further injury and try to trade him in the offseason? Not a lot to lose, other than he takes up a roster spot...

 

He also previously seemed a popular locker room guy based on some quotes from the other players including JA...

 

There is obviously more to the story but probably unlikely we will ever know the details...

[Matt_In_NH]

3 minutes ago, Victory Formation said:

He had all of last year too.. Spain and Teller are both better yet he’s stuck with Ford. Why? 
 

Dawkins-Spain-Morse-Teller-Williams is much better than what we have now.. That’s actually a very good OL. Should have let Mongo and Spain fight for LG and kept Teller at RG.. Fact that we got rid of Teller, a diamond in the rough, one of the guys we drafted for subpar below average guards is concerning.. then Spain is released too only to be replaced by someone he’s better than... I’d be pissed too.
 

Say what you want man..

 

I think you can both be right.  A second round pick you were desperate for and traded up for is different than some of the other situations.  And we are not necessarily talking about benching him for a game, with the depth on this roster decisions have to be made about who stays and who goes.  Was Beane making the decision to play Ford over Spain?   Or is he putting pressure on the staff to play him?  Maybe they see more raw ability and upside or maybe they evaluate differently than some fans/websites are.    

 

In general I agree that the sign of a good GM/staff is the willingness to move on from someone you thought a lot of.  A high second round pick gets more slack than a lower end pick or undrafted guy.  On the flipside they did move on after 6 games from a guy they just signed to a 3 year extension.

[Warcodered]

7 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

The timing of this......after the Ford injury....Boatgner actually getting live reps.....

 

THere has to be SOMETHING going on

Without more actual information reading between lines Spain was not happy about his lesser role and his sudden injury keeping him out of the Titans game despite not appearing on the injury report that week at all prior to that is kind of suspicious.

[Aussie Joe]

1 minute ago, Warcodered said:

Without more actual information reading between lines Spain was not happy about his lesser role and his sudden injury keeping him out of the Titans game despite not appearing on the injury report that week at all prior to that is kind of suspicious.

 

Yeah we are all just speculating... However..

 

I'm sure there are always players that are unhappy for whatever reason all the time,  but they might need to be told.."Suck it up big boy.. we have paid you in full this season.."

[Helpmenow]

Hull jersey back where it belongs. Off somebody 

[Call_Of_Ktulu]

1 hour ago, thenorthremembers said:

He caught a TD last week.    Not for nothing, if this year ends how it is trending now Jason Croom will have had the 2nd best season from a Bills tight end in the last three years and Knox wasnt that much better last year.  Woof.

To me they all suck so I could care less if Croom who can’t block, run good routes or get open on a regular basis get 1 or even 3 tds. All of our TE’s suck and so does Croom.

Edited October 21, 2020 by Call_Of_Ktulu

[JGMcD2]

13 minutes ago, Victory Formation said:

He had all of last year too.. Spain and Teller are both better yet he’s stuck with Ford. Why? 
 

Dawkins-Spain-Morse-Teller-Williams is much better than what we have now.. That’s actually a very good OL. Should have let Mongo and Spain fight for LG and kept Teller at RG.. Fact that we got rid of Teller, a diamond in the rough, one of the guys we drafted for subpar below average guards is concerning.. then Spain is released too only to be replaced by someone he’s better than... I’d be pissed too.
 

Say what you want man..

Cody Ford played all of last year at RT.. not RG. Feliciano started every game at RG and Spain literally played every snap at LG... so it’s impossible for Cody Ford to have had played RG all of last year. He played 169 snaps at RG last season. Low and behold, he’s started 6 games at RG in his professional career. He’s played 369 snaps at RG this season. Wyatt Teller didn’t start regularly until the end of 2019 with Cleveland and didn’t breakout until this season, which is his 3rd NFL season.

 

Well for starters it looks like there were disciplinary issues with Spain. Teller was a 5th round pick who was uneven as a rookie and he was traded away in favor of Spain and Feliciano at G. Teller didn’t start for the Cleveland Browns for the first half of the 2019 season.

 

Hindsight is a really cool thing. Say what you want man... 
 

 

22 minutes ago, mattynh said:

 

I think you can both be right.  A second round pick you were desperate for and traded up for is different than some of the other situations.  And we are not necessarily talking about benching him for a game, with the depth on this roster decisions have to be made about who stays and who goes.  Was Beane making the decision to play Ford over Spain?   Or is he putting pressure on the staff to play him?  Maybe they see more raw ability and upside or maybe they evaluate differently than some fans/websites are.    

 

In general I agree that the sign of a good GM/staff is the willingness to move on from someone you thought a lot of.  A high second round pick gets more slack than a lower end pick or undrafted guy.  On the flipside they did move on after 6 games from a guy they just signed to a 3 year extension.

It was essentially a 1 year deal with two option years. Yes, it was written as a three year extension but there’s only $1mm in dead money next year and nothing in 2022. 
 

Spain has played more than 6 games at guard in his career. Ford has not. 

[Matt_In_NH]

6 minutes ago, JGMcD2 said:

Cody Ford played all of last year at RT.. not RG. Feliciano started every game at RG and Spain literally played every snap at LG... so it’s impossible for Cody Ford to have had played RG all of last year. He played 169 snaps at RG last season. Low and behold, he’s started 6 games at RG in his professional career. He’s played 369 snaps at RG this season. Wyatt Teller didn’t start regularly until the end of 2019 with Cleveland and didn’t breakout until this season, which is his 3rd NFL season.

 

Well for starters it looks like there were disciplinary issues with Spain. Teller was a 5th round pick who was uneven as a rookie and he was traded away in favor of Spain and Feliciano at G. Teller didn’t start for the Cleveland Browns for the first half of the 2019 season.

 

Hindsight is a really cool thing. Say what you want man... 
 

 

It was essentially a 1 year deal with two option years. Yes, it was written as a three year extension but there’s only $1mm in dead money next year and nothing in 2022. 
 

Spain has played more than 6 games at guard in his career. Ford has not. 

I agree, the guarantees were  not large, however they waived him and ate his money after 6 games.  That's a bad deal, yet they moved on.  Other regimes may have tried to hold on.  At the end of the deal not all draft picks or FA's work out.  Willingness to see/admit that and move on is key.  There have been teams to waive a second round pick after 1 year but that is relatively rare.

[YoloinOhio]

Quote

This didn’t just happen today,” Beane said. “We’ve had conversations since his new role was established. Those are private conversations, but he never demanded a trade or release or anything like that. We had positive communication. Sometimes nobody is wrong, but you just don’t agree. He’s a competitor and our coaches are trying to put the best five in each spot. His number wasn’t called as a start, and when you get a new deal and you started all last year, I don’t think that sat well with him. Those are my words, not his words. He communicated. I give him credit. It just didn’t work out for nothing he intended and nothing we intended. I have nothing but positive things to say about Quinton Spain.”

Edited October 21, 2020 by YoloinOhio

[LABILLBACKER]

I hate Ford & Winters while I appreciated the way Spain played last year. Was looking forward for Mongo & Quinton to return and send the other 2 to the bench where they belong. Obviously someone pissed off someone? 

[YoloinOhio]

“I think he had a mindset where he thought he was probably going to be in that same role this year,” Beane said. “It’s not that I thought any different or the coaches did going into the season. It’s just, we’re always about competition here. That hasn’t changed. It won’t change as long as Sean and I are here. Sometimes it doesn’t go the way you think, and not everybody is going to agree. It doesn’t mean we’re right either. We try to make the best decisions we can as a personnel staff and a coaching staff. That’s what we do at other positions. We have other guys that aren’t starting, too, and they don’t always agree with it. It’s not easy. At the end of the day, we just decided it was best to give him a chance to move on and find a starting role for us to move on with what we have here.”

[Rochesterfan]

1 hour ago, Victory Formation said:

He had all of last year too.. Spain and Teller are both better yet he’s stuck with Ford. Why? 
 

Dawkins-Spain-Morse-Teller-Williams is much better than what we have now.. That’s actually a very good OL. Should have let Mongo and Spain fight for LG and kept Teller at RG.. Fact that we got rid of Teller, a diamond in the rough, one of the guys we drafted for subpar below average guards is concerning.. then Spain is released too only to be replaced by someone he’s better than... I’d be pissed too.
 

Say what you want man..

 

Man really - Wyatt Teller was traded last year and could barely play for the Browns horrible line last year.

 

He has played better this year with a totally different scheme and 2 powerful running backs, but he missed 90% of the Indy game and they were fine and the entire line got destroyed by Pittsburgh - not sure he would be a Pro Bowl type player if he had been in that game.

 

In reality, Teller has looked pretty good in 3 games in 2020 after being poorly graded 2019.  He was not great against Baltimore where they got destroyed.  He is (and was for the Bills) an above average run blocker and a weaker pass blocker.  He has looked good in games where the Browns have gotten ahead and been able to mix in pass and run.  He looked average in the Baltimore game where they were behind and had to pass block only.  
 

He has been a ProBowl level playing in 3 games against Cincinnati, Washington, and Dallas - not exactly a defensive nightmare.  He was average to below average against Baltimore.  Played very limited snaps against Indy and was out against Pittsburgh.  
 

I doubt in the Bills scheme - he would of made the team last year or this year and I certainly do not think he would have been the Bills best O-lineman.  I think there are things he is better at than perhaps any other Bills guard currently, but he is still a very limited player.

 

There was nothing concerning about getting rid of Teller - he was not good enough and they got value for him.  The fact that he has continued to work - good for him, but 3 games does not make him anything special.

Edited October 21, 2020 by Rochesterfan

[34-78-83]

Barring injuries, total inexperience or behind the scenes drama that we'll never be privy to, there aren't very many (if any) coaches on ANY NFL team let alone the Bills, who will have a better player on the bench behind a more flawed player. The exceptions are when the flawed player improves or the entrenched player regresses over time.