The End of the Lamar Jackson Era

[Rico]

One thing Lamar and Josh have in common is an intense desire to be great and win. That can’t be taught. Disagree with the OP,  this was just one game.

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

Just now, H2o said:

Yeah it wasn't routine or anything, but it's a catch he usually would make. He is one of the better receiving TE's in the NFL right now. 

 

For sure - but the twitter trolls who constantly criticize allen for ball placement didn't have anything to say there.  The blame went to andrews only.

[WEATHER DOT COM]

2 minutes ago, dneveu said:

 

For sure - but the twitter trolls who constantly criticize allen for ball placement didn't have anything to say there.  The blame went to andrews only.

 

I guess I'd have to see it again but I'd expect my TE to make that catch every time.

 

The one over the middle Andrews dropped was a tough catch.

[Figster]

While I agree with OP to a certain extent I think its very possible Greg Romans O lacks enough emphasis in the passing game. Something I think the Bills experienced with Romans tenure here in Buffalo IMO.

 

Beating KC requires TD's on almost every posession.  One slip up and its playing catch up against a team practically impossible to stop. 

 

Josh Allen and the Buffalo Bills are on a collison course with KC.

 

Prepare for fireworks, explosions. McD's got a plan. Its all part of the process.

 

When the smoke has cleared there will be one team standing.

 

One Buffalo strong...

 

Do you Billieve!!! 

 

 

 

 

Edited September 29, 2020 by Figster

[Kwai San]

3 hours ago, Golden Goat said:

How good did it feel to type that? Was it weird? 

 

Felt weird to read it thats for sure.  But a good kinda weird...a warm fuzzy weird.  Ima gonna cuddle with this weird for awhile!!!!

[ColoradoBills]

1 hour ago, Nihilarian said:

Oh, because one team has another teams number... then everything unravels...no!

 

Ravens schedule, Washington, Cincy, Philly, Pittsburgh x2, Indy, NE, Tenn, Pitt, Dallas, Cleveland, Jacksonville, NY Giants, Cincy. This is a playoff team that will be there at the end of the season. 

 

 

I was scrolling thru the thread seeing if anyone cited the Ravens schedule.  It is so easy.

They got 4 games left against decent teams.  Let's say they split with PIT and split with NE*/TEN.

 

Not matter what Lamar Jackson eventually becomes the Titans are probably looking at a 12 win season and maybe more.

If PIT beats them twice then PIT will more than likely have a 12 or better win record.

It will be tough for the Bills with their tough schedule to get the bye.

 

[NewEra]

12 minutes ago, Figster said:

While I agree with OP to a certain extent I think its very possible Greg Romans O lacks enough emphasis in the passing game. Something I think the Bills experienced with Romans tenure here in Buffalo IMO.

 

 

 

 

I agree that it lacks enough emphasis on the passing game.  Some of that is on Roman.  Some of that is on Decosta.  He’s a great Gm, but their WR unit is among the worst in football.

Edited September 29, 2020 by NewEra

[GunnerBill]

1 hour ago, blacklabel said:

I'll give Lamar a mulligan on this one. If they do falter this season, I'll put it on Greg Roman. It's happened everywhere he's gone, he designs an offense that can lead the league in rushing year after year but his passing concepts have always been pretty elementary from what I've read. Once you stop his run game, he struggles to attack you through the air. It caught up to him in both San Francisco and Buffalo. Both teams could run the ball all day and do well with a lead. If they fell behind and had to throw it a bunch, forget it. If he can't adjust to help Lamar then they could have some trouble. 

 

It caught up to him in San Fran, sure. As did working for a borderline psychopath as his Head Coach. Whether it did for him in Buffalo is a matter of opinion. Mine is that being fired 2 games into your second season after leading the league in rushing to save the lardy ass of the useless Head Coach and his equally useless brother who had just been shredded by Ryan Fitzpatrick is not evidence of your offense failing. 

 

Roman is one of the best and most innovative OCs in the NFL. But people don't want to hear about creativity when it is run game creativity. Is his passing game a bit "vanilla"? Sure. But then equally all three stops he has had QBs who are better runners than passers. He was the OC that saved Alex Smith's career before that. 

1 minute ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

I was scrolling thru the thread seeing if anyone cited the Ravens schedule.  It is so easy.

They got 4 games left against decent teams.  Let's say they split with PIT and split with NE*/TEN.

 

Not matter what Lamar Jackson eventually becomes the Titans are probably looking at a 12 win season and maybe more.

If PIT beats them twice then PIT will more than likely have a 12 or better win record.

It will be tough for the Bills with their tough schedule to get the bye.

 

 

Only one bye now and the Bills have no shot at it. Baltimore will win 12 games minimum. They played the hard schedule last year and now get the easy one. They are the Bills in reverse. The Ravens are still a potential Superbowl Champion. They have to play better than last night but even aside from Lamar that was not the Ravens at their best. 

[Watkins90]

Mahomes and Allen both have the same arm strength. Yeah, maybe one can out throw the other by a couple yards, but at the end of the day they can both sling it far enough. That's all that matters. 

[BUFFALOTONE]

1 hour ago, TheElectricCompany said:

 

We're forever spoiled by Manning winning 5 MVPs.

Cam is arguably the best dual threat QB in the history of the league. Ryan won it in Year 9 and has always been good to great.

"Regress to the mean" will happen, but what's Lamar's mean? Time will tell.

42 total TDs was a great preview of what's to come.

 

I’d put Warren Moon, Randall Cunningham and maybe even Mike Vick ahead of Cam. 

[Thurman#1]

4 hours ago, JoshAllenHasBigHands said:

 

Its not a thing because the data shows that a QB is more likely to get hurt in the pocked than on the run. This includes in JA's case where the QB takes hits. Especially since the only times JA has ever been injured, he has been in the pocket.  

 

 

Two problems with this post. 

 

First, Allen was knocked out of the first Pats game in 2019 for the concussion protocol, and it was when he was running for the sticks.

 

Second, the data doesn't show what you're saying it does.

 

About what it says is that with the way they can massage the data and be sure of these things, they can't prove that running QBs get injured more than pocket QBs. Not that it doesn't happen, but that they can't prove it.

 

And I haven't yet found that any of them have found a way to look at the data to show whether running QB careers are shorter. Which they may be. When pocket passers lose a gear or two as they get older, they can still play the way they had. Not so with the running QBs, who have to try to re-learn to play the game with one of their biggest weapons missing. A few running QBs have lasted, especially guys who didn't have a lot of designed runs, and who slid a lot. Steve Young played till he was old, but he had a lot less wear on his tires through his first seven years than most. Randall Cunningham too.  But look at Vick, a spot player by 32. 

 

https://www.footballoutsiders.com/extra-points/2019/injury-proneness-running-qbs-overstated

Edited September 29, 2020 by Thurman#1

[BuffaLoko]

4 hours ago, Da webster guy said:

35 yards passing at the end of the 1st half.  Yikes.

In fairness to Lamar, he doesn't have the kind of weapons we have or KC has.  

Josh TD to Diggs Sunday was a Lamar type throw with that wrist flick. He didnt have time or the space to wind up so he just whipped that forearm.  Awesome.

 

 

.

I just can´t believe my own eyes, that we would be reading a statement like the one you made in your second line, as soon as week 3, but its true now we have weapons all over the pace! and the growth starts with adding SD, but goes on to the TEs, we have 1 great veteran in Kroft, 1 serviceable veteran in Smith and one 2 year TE with potential to be great! 

Edited September 29, 2020 by BuffaLoko

[TheCockSportif]

I'm not sure that Jackson is done, and I would opine that he is not... by a long shot.

 

Having written that, I'd rather have Allen than Jackson.  While I don't agree with your premise of the end of the Jackson era, your analysis of why Mahomes and Allen work -- where Jackson struggles -- is solid.

[WideNine]

I appreciate the opinions and recognize that I could easily be wrong, but one bad game does not wipe out the progress and accomplishments Jackson has made in this league.

 

Is he ready to go toe-to-toe with Mahomes? No he is not, but the kid works hard and is willing to adapt so I think folks should tap the breaks.

 

Don't want us to be guilty of the same bias folks have with Allen where they are waiting for one bad game to pile on.

 

I do think Allen is ahead of Lamar just in regards to reading defenses and being able to spread the ball around and push it downfield from the pocket.

 

I don't fault Roman for emphasizing Lamar's running ability while working to improve the areas where his game is weaker. It is the smart win-now approach.

 

I don't think we have seen Lamar's ceiling.

 

 

 

 

[Rock-A-Bye Beasley]

1 hour ago, IDBillzFan said:

 

Borderline racist? Really? Let's give that a rest, okay? Actual racism would appreciate it.

 

The truth is that the Bills base has more than its fair share of fans who insist the Bills forever screwed up by not grabbing Mahomes or Jackson, and taking the project cantaloupe farmer.  You couldn't be in a GDT or Shoutbox or even Twitter without Bills fans crying in their bowl of Flutie Flakes EVERY SINGLE TIME Josh overthrew a ball the past two years. By the time Mahomes was hoisting the Lombardi, the noise was embarrassingly ridiculous because while many of us would never confuse Allen for Mahomes, we could absolutely see Allen getting better.

 

So try and understand why some fans are happy to see their faith rewarded with the progress Josh has made. Yes, some overdo it a bit. Listen to talk sports radio and you know that's not something exclusive to Bills fans.

 

A Running Back?! Really? Let’s give THAT a rest. It’s insulting and yes it does involve race because For years athletic black QBs were told to switch positions. it’s fine to criticize Jackson, but when someone calls him a running back they are invoking race because of the history of the position and the fact that Jackson has already proven he can play QB at a high level. 
 

Edit: and 99% of running backs are black

Edited September 29, 2020 by Chemical

[machine gun kelly]

Shaw, I’ll give it to you he’s not the hype that has been stated about him, but that’s not his fault.  It’s the media fawning over him, just like Allen is not the trash that has been said about him in the past.  I’d rather have Allen, not because of these three weeks, but he has progressively improved over three years.  You kind of know what you have in Jackson, and the GM and coach have built a team around him.  This is not unlike McBeane have built a formidable team around Allen.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 hour ago, TheElectricCompany said:

 

I love seeing Cam making plays again, even if it's for the Pats. He's an exciting player.

Lamar's 2019 season is as memorable as they come. I like to think more are on deck.

 

"Your Kink is O.K." 

LOL

Kidding.Notkidding

 

Agree on Lamar 2019.

 

5 minutes ago, machine gun kelly said:

Shaw, I’ll give it to you he’s not the hype that has been stated about him, but that’s not his fault.  It’s the media fawning over him, just like Allen is not the trash that has been said about him in the past.  I’d rather have Allen, not because of these three weeks, but he has progressively improved over three years.  You kind of know what you have in Jackson, and the GM and coach have built a team around him.  This is not unlike McBeane have built a formidable team around Allen.

 

See, here is where I disagree. 

 

The dude is only 23 yrs old. 

 

We have endless discussion here that at 23 years old in his 3rd season, Allen is improving and may continue to improve, despite all the naysayers who say inaccurate QB in college do not improve in the NFL.

 

Why do we think one 23 yr old highly competitive intelligent athletic QB can improve, but another "is what he is" and can not?

 

It has puzzled me from Day 1.

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

49 minutes ago, Rico said:

One thing Lamar and Josh have in common is an intense desire to be great and win. That can’t be taught. Disagree with the OP,  this was just one game.

 

Maybe. I thought Jackson's body language and demeanor was pretty poor last night in the second half. I don't think I've seen similar from Josh Allen.

[H2o]

50 minutes ago, dneveu said:

 

For sure - but the twitter trolls who constantly criticize allen for ball placement didn't have anything to say there.  The blame went to andrews only.

Not only that throw, but there were multiple throws to the intermediate and deeper parts of the field Jackson just outright missed. Brown could have had at least two, if not three, TD's last night if Jackson could have hit his man running wide open down the sidelines. Even Riddick called him out on it every time it happened. 

[GunnerBill]

31 minutes ago, BUFFALOTONE said:

I’d put Warren Moon, Randall Cunningham and maybe even Mike Vick ahead of Cam. 

 

Was Warren Moon really duel threat? I'm not sure he belongs in that company. Before my time but based on what I have seen and read Steve Young was more duel threat than Warren Moon. Moon could scramble a bit but he was a thrower from the pocket.