Bills scrimmage 8/27

[Warcodered]

5 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

What did he say?

he didn't really say anything the whole PC was essentially just a big nonanswer.

[YoloinOhio]

26 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

What did he say?

 

Daboll loves mckenzie. 

Edited August 29, 2020 by YoloinOhio

[Rocky Landing]

2 hours ago, fergie's ire said:

At the risk of having my credentials pulled....it is interesting that Roberts is in with the first team.  It seems to me that Roberts and McKenzie have similar skill sets...both returners with the shiftiness that position requires.  Yes, McKenzie has been better on the offense and used much more, but was an adventure when returning.  I have been thinking about what receivers they will keep, and with the talent they have now, I wonder if keeping both is a luxury they can no longer afford.  I think Foster is a goner...and if they keep 6, the coaching staff would keep one of Mckenzie/Roberts and Duke/Hodgins.

Other than being used as a returner, I don't see a lot of similarity in their play at WR. As I recall, McKenzie was used last season for primarily short yardage plays, quick outs, etc., as well as all the gimmick plays that Daboll loves, especially plays behind the LOS-- bubbles, end arounds, etc. I don't recall Roberts running anything more complicated than a post.

 

Whether or not they retain McKensie, I don't think Roberts will be looked at to fill those roles. If anything, it's Diggs who makes McKensie redundant, as he ran all of those plays in Minnesota, and ran them much better.

 

I think there is a valid point, though, that If they're using Roberts a lot on offense in a scrimmage, they're likely comparing his skills on offense to the other bubble players to decide who offers more, or unique value to the 53. In that regard, I would think Roberts would be compared more to players like Duke, Hodgins, or Foster than McK.

[Doc]

1 hour ago, YoloinOhio said:

 

Daboll loves mckenzie. 

 

Eh...that's pretty non-committal.  The end could just as easily have "...wherever that may be"

[Mr. WEO]

1 hour ago, YoloinOhio said:

 

Daboll loves mckenzie. 

 

That Bills "kiss of death"...

[Buffalophil1948]

I'm pretty sure they'll keep 7 WR, especially now that we are not keeping 4 kickers

[Doc]

47 minutes ago, Buffalophil1948 said:

I'm pretty sure they'll keep 7 WR, especially now that we are not keeping 4 kickers

 

They kept just 2 kickers last year and only had 6 WRs on the opening day roster.  Then again, it's not like there was another WR worth keeping...

[Buffalophil1948]

1 hour ago, Doc said:

 

They kept just 2 kickers last year and only had 6 WRs on the opening day roster.  Then again, it's not like there was another WR worth keeping...

Its a real nice problem to have for once

[Shaw66]

3 hours ago, Rocky Landing said:

Other than being used as a returner, I don't see a lot of similarity in their play at WR. As I recall, McKenzie was used last season for primarily short yardage plays, quick outs, etc., as well as all the gimmick plays that Daboll loves, especially plays behind the LOS-- bubbles, end arounds, etc. I don't recall Roberts running anything more complicated than a post.

 

Whether or not they retain McKensie, I don't think Roberts will be looked at to fill those roles. If anything, it's Diggs who makes McKensie redundant, as he ran all of those plays in Minnesota, and ran them much better.

 

I think there is a valid point, though, that If they're using Roberts a lot on offense in a scrimmage, they're likely comparing his skills on offense to the other bubble players to decide who offers more, or unique value to the 53. In that regard, I would think Roberts would be compared more to players like Duke, Hodgins, or Foster than McK.

I agree with this. especially the Diggs part.  Other than McKenzie, the Bills had no one who was effective running the jet sweep and similar plays where the offensive wants to attack quickly with a quick, elusive runner.  Beasley tried but couldn't do it.  When McKenzie came it, the defense knew the chances of one of those plays increased.  

 

With Diggs in the lineup, every play threatens to be such a play.  Diggs has shown he has the ability to run those plays.  So McKenzie just isn't as useful as he was before.  For whatever reason. Roberts hasn't shown the ability to be an effective receiver, but McKenzie isn't much better, and Roberts is both a more sure-handed and a more effective punt returner.  

 

I think McKenzie is at risk, unless the Bills just like the fact that he is sort of an all-purpose backup on offense and special teams.  That may be enough to save him.  

 

Having said that, I don't think that Roberts running with the first team signals that Roberts is in and McKenzie is out.  It also could mean that McKenzie is in and the Bills wanted to see whether Roberts could save himself by finally showing something on offense.   Much too hard to read any tea leaves yet. 

Edited August 29, 2020 by Shaw66

[Doc]

8 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

I agree with this. especially the Diggs part.  Other than McKenzie, the Bills had no one who was effective running the jet sweep and similar plays where the offensive wants to attack quickly with a quick, elusive runner.  Beasley tried but couldn't do it.  When McKenzie came it, the defense knew the chances of one of those plays increased.  

 

With Diggs in the lineup, every play threatens to be such a play.  Diggs has shown he has the ability to run those plays.  So McKenzie just isn't as useful as he was before.  For whatever reason. Roberts hasn't shown the ability to be an effective receiver, but McKenzie isn't much better, and Roberts is both a more sure-handed and a more effective punt returner.  

 

I think McKenzie is at risk, unless the Bills just like the fact that he is sort of an all-purpose backup on offense and special teams.  That may be enough to save him.  

 

Having said that, I don't think that Roberts running with the first team signals that Roberts is in and McKenzie is out.  It also could mean that McKenzie is in and the Bills wanted to see whether Roberts could save himself by finally showing something on offense.   Much too hard to read any tea leaves yet. 

 

See, I see that Roberts is a lock because of his return abilities (Pro Bowler), so using him with the 1st team in the role McK would be suggests they're looking for him to be McK's replacement as a backup WR/jet sweep guy.  Taken with the stuff you said about Diggs being able to do that without tipping-off opposing defenses and in light of the fact that they have a glut of WRs.  Plus, like I said, he was an UFA and no one bothered to sign him, so I think they can cut him and easily get him on the PS.

[Buffaloflash]

On 8/27/2020 at 8:31 PM, BillsSB2020KO said:

People like you are SO programmed it’s astonishing. Yet you’ve never read an actual study on police interaction w civilians. You’ve only seen ridiculously biased news stories from companies that exist solely to divide us. 

 

Look at EVERY headline. This formula is 100% accurate. Black perpetrator: race will not be mentioned. White: lead w race. 

 

I’ve read actual studies, I don’t rely on media and honestly ignorant athletes like the ones in the NFL and other major sports leagues. They’re as conditioned as you.

 

Start w Roland Fryer’s study from a few years ago. He’s the youngest ever tenured professor at Harvard, and a black man. He was surprised when he actually LOOKED at the data. Not tweets from idiots and professional agitators and manipulators. 

 

Studies definitively prove there is absolutely no disproportionate targeting of non whites by police. You are wrong. That is not opinion that is fact based on empirical data not anecdotal evidence and misplaced and manipulated emotion. 

 

Remember the news stories about all those white people brutalized by police and mistreated and wrongly arrested? Yeah me neither. Doesn’t mean they didn’t happen, because they absolutely did. Your mind is owned by those who want us divided. You are a perfect success for them. Ignorant and emotional. 

 

Repetition is the most powerful and simple form of mind control. This narrative is repeated over and over and over yet has NO ACTUAL SUBSTANCE backing it. It is amazing to see a narrative go so unchallenged and that’s bc of people being afraid to be called racist. Well I don’t care I simply followed objective fact and there is no backing to this narrative. 

 

Read studies, drop the emotion, learn what anecdotal evidence is and why it’s so weak. Stop watching the operatives on news media. 

 

I’m just sick and tired of hearing this narrative presented as if it’s fact. And I know many of you reading this will agree even if you don’t say so. Stop being afraid to speak truth. Stop letting over emotional posters like the quoted disparage your position w a weak, backless argument. 

 

And there’s nothing wrong w this being left in the football section. It’s wrapped up in sports now whether you want it to be or not. But stop listening to athletes, they don’t know any more than you do and they mostly go along w the rest of their team or else they’ll be black balled. They simply have a more exposed platform.

 

It’s your choice to let your beliefs be formed by emotion or by reality. And if you choose reality, do the work and read the hard data and the great studies done on these actual subjects. And no a vox article or chart isn’t what I’m referring to.

Welcome to TBD!

[Rocky Landing]

On 8/27/2020 at 5:31 PM, BillsSB2020KO said:

People like you are SO programmed it’s astonishing. Yet you’ve never read an actual study on police interaction w civilians. You’ve only seen ridiculously biased news stories from companies that exist solely to divide us. 

 

Look at EVERY headline. This formula is 100% accurate. Black perpetrator: race will not be mentioned. White: lead w race. 

 

I’ve read actual studies, I don’t rely on media and honestly ignorant athletes like the ones in the NFL and other major sports leagues. They’re as conditioned as you.

 

Start w Roland Fryer’s study from a few years ago. He’s the youngest ever tenured professor at Harvard, and a black man. He was surprised when he actually LOOKED at the data. Not tweets from idiots and professional agitators and manipulators. 

 

Studies definitively prove there is absolutely no disproportionate targeting of non whites by police. You are wrong. That is not opinion that is fact based on empirical data not anecdotal evidence and misplaced and manipulated emotion. 

 

Remember the news stories about all those white people brutalized by police and mistreated and wrongly arrested? Yeah me neither. Doesn’t mean they didn’t happen, because they absolutely did. Your mind is owned by those who want us divided. You are a perfect success for them. Ignorant and emotional. 

 

Repetition is the most powerful and simple form of mind control. This narrative is repeated over and over and over yet has NO ACTUAL SUBSTANCE backing it. It is amazing to see a narrative go so unchallenged and that’s bc of people being afraid to be called racist. Well I don’t care I simply followed objective fact and there is no backing to this narrative. 

 

Read studies, drop the emotion, learn what anecdotal evidence is and why it’s so weak. Stop watching the operatives on news media. 

 

I’m just sick and tired of hearing this narrative presented as if it’s fact. And I know many of you reading this will agree even if you don’t say so. Stop being afraid to speak truth. Stop letting over emotional posters like the quoted disparage your position w a weak, backless argument. 

 

And there’s nothing wrong w this being left in the football section. It’s wrapped up in sports now whether you want it to be or not. But stop listening to athletes, they don’t know any more than you do and they mostly go along w the rest of their team or else they’ll be black balled. They simply have a more exposed platform.

 

It’s your choice to let your beliefs be formed by emotion or by reality. And if you choose reality, do the work and read the hard data and the great studies done on these actual subjects. And no a vox article or chart isn’t what I’m referring to.

Or there's this peer-reviewed study: https://www.pnas.org/content/116/34/16793

[Coach Tuesday]

3 minutes ago, Rocky Landing said:

Or there's this peer-reviewed study: https://www.pnas.org/content/116/34/16793

Disparate impact vs. disparate intent

[Rocky Landing]

On 8/27/2020 at 5:31 PM, BillsSB2020KO said:

People like you are SO programmed it’s astonishing. Yet you’ve never read an actual study on police interaction w civilians. You’ve only seen ridiculously biased news stories from companies that exist solely to divide us. 

 

 

 

Start w Roland Fryer’s study from a few years ago. He’s the youngest ever tenured professor at Harvard, and a black man. He was surprised when he actually LOOKED at the data. Not tweets from idiots and professional agitators and manipulators. 

 

Studies definitively prove there is absolutely no disproportionate targeting of non whites by police. You are wrong. That is not opinion that is fact based on empirical data not anecdotal evidence and misplaced and manipulated emotion. 

 

 

Another peer-reviewed journal article specifically addressing Roland Fryer's study, outlining its flaws as outlined in two subsequent peer-reviewed studies--  since you're such a fan of "empirical data." https://scholar.harvard.edu/jfeldman/blog/roland-fryer-wrong-there-racial-bias-shootings-police 

 

It would seem, btw, that the economist professor Roland Fryer has been suspended by Harvard for violating its codes of professional conduct. https://blogs.edweek.org/edweek/inside-school-research/2019/07/education_economist_roland_fry_1.html?s_kwcid=AL!6416!3!266402628866!b!!g!!&cmp=cpc-goog-ew-dynamic+ads+recent+articles&ccid=dynamic+ads+recent+articles&ccag=recent+articles+dynamic&cckw=&cccv=dynamic+ad&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI7eHT89rB6wIVLh6tBh2D1QtvEAAYASAAEgJBLPD_BwE

[CEN-CAL17]

9 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

 

Daboll loves mckenzie. 

I’ve noticed with McKenzie, you forget about him until he makes a big catch or converts a critical first down....

[Doc Brown]

9 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

 

Daboll loves mckenzie. 

“I’m not concerned. I think LeSean still can play. If not, we would have made the decision to move on,” Beane said in July. “I definitely think he’s got enough left in the tank to help us in 2019.”

[Rocky Landing]

36 minutes ago, CEN-CAL17 said:

I’ve noticed with McKenzie, you forget about him until he makes a big catch or converts a critical first down....

Or drops a pass....

[YoloinOhio]

2 hours ago, CEN-CAL17 said:

I’ve noticed with McKenzie, you forget about him until he makes a big catch or converts a critical first down....

He is more important with this team’s offense than any other because there is an “Isaiah mckenzie” role thAt has been created. Until they find someone who can do it better they will keep him. At least while Daboll is here 

[MiltonWaddams]

10 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

He is more important with this team’s offense than any other because there is an “Isaiah mckenzie” role thAt has been created. Until they find someone who can do it better they will keep him. At least while Daboll is here 

I also think that, despite Diggs ability to play that jet sweep, it’s a pretty high risk play for a guy who has so much of the season riding on him. I think McKenzies ability in that play and his obvious degree of success, makes him a very valuable guy to keep on the 53.

[Doc]

So if the Bills keep 6 WRs like they did last year, and we assume Diggs, Brown, Beasley, Davis and Roberts are locks, you're using the final spot on McK?