ColoradoBills Posted August 25, 2020 Posted August 25, 2020 13 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said: Are we certain about this? If your first round draft pick tears an ACL you have to waiver him in order to put him on IR? That doesn’t sound right to me. I think that’s only true before a certain date. No. Fish wanted to waive/IR him to open another spot on the 80 man roster to sign. 1
Billl Posted August 25, 2020 Posted August 25, 2020 2 hours ago, dneveu said: Thats like 2 weeks from now... losing a fairly likely 2021 53 man roster candidate for no reason is really stupid. Odds are its not a really big deal though so whatever. I thought there was some sort of unwritten rule that teams didn’t poach players like that.
Florida Bills Fanatic Posted August 25, 2020 Posted August 25, 2020 2 hours ago, YoloinOhio said: I don’t get it either. He wasn’t coming back this year so why not just IR him I just looked it up, apparently they had to wait until 9/5 to IR him without the waiver process. Seems like they could have done that for a draft pick. Oops is right Living in Florida I hear a lot of chatter about the Miami front office being a mess with most of the problem attributable to the involvement of the owner. If even part of that is actually true, it may explain this and some of the other questionable personnel moves in the past. Anything that keeps Miami struggling, is fine with me. 1
Logic Posted August 25, 2020 Posted August 25, 2020 Here's what I don't understand: The Phins supposedly had to cut Weaver and expose him to waivers in order to put him on IR. The Browns, meanwhile, were able to make space to claim Weaver by placing their OWN rookie -- Grant Delpit -- on IR. Why is it that the Browns were able to place Delpit on IR right away without exposing him to waivers, while the Dolphins were not able to do the same with Weaver? Very confusing. 1
IgotBILLStopay Posted August 25, 2020 Posted August 25, 2020 pretty sure browns were not the only team to put in a claim - maybe even Beane did - but lower claim priority did us in 1 minute ago, Logic said: Here's what I don't understand: The Phins supposedly had to cut Weaver and expose him to waivers in order to put him on IR. The Browns, meanwhile, were able to make space to claim Weaver by placing their OWN rookie -- Grant Delpit -- on IR. Why is it that the Browns were able to place Delpit on IR right away without exposing him to waivers, while the Dolphins were not able to do the same with Weaver? Very confusing. maybe the fins were attempting to pinch pennies - i think waive to IR you may have to play the player less than direct IR
DCbillsfan Posted August 25, 2020 Posted August 25, 2020 35 minutes ago, JerseyBills said: Are you kidding me?!? Wow !That's quite a blunder . I mean imagine Buf losing Milano,Neal , Vosean Joseph , all recent 5th rounders for something like this. Milano is a stud but Neal is a very valuable role player on D and Joseph was injured but def has potential. That's absolutely embarrassing for Dolphins F.O What a waste of a 5th rd pick. Like you mentioned, the Bills put Joseph on IR last year so what's up with the Fish? Either poor roster management or a bad pick to start. Not a good look for the Fish either way.
PromoTheRobot Posted August 25, 2020 Posted August 25, 2020 I recall Sal C mocking him to the Bills where we took Epenesa. Of course he thought Epenesa would be gone by then.
Turk71 Posted August 25, 2020 Posted August 25, 2020 (edited) Incredibly stupid move if they wanted to keep him. I remember him in the draft thinking he was a great value where he got taken. I think he has a lot of potential and could be a good one. Edited August 25, 2020 by Turk71
brianthomas Posted August 25, 2020 Posted August 25, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, Coach Tuesday said: Are we certain about this? If your first round draft pick tears an ACL you have to waiver him in order to put him on IR? That doesn’t sound right to me. I think that’s only true before a certain date. Yep i think so, as long as its before the cut date from 90 players to 53, this is the route they had to take. If they had waited til after the cutdown, they couldve put him on IR. No idea about the Delpit situation in comparison to Weavers. They're both likely out for the season so I have no idea & i dont really care enough to dig into it, even though now i probably will haha. Also i'm no expert on the new CBA & the new changes. Roster designations are/were the main factor in the Phins decision it sounds like. Edited August 26, 2020 by brianthomas
brianthomas Posted August 26, 2020 Posted August 26, 2020 (edited) https://twitter.com/ArmandoSalguero/status/1298005291930451969 Apparently this rule is in place to prevent teams from stashing young players. All news to me though Edited August 26, 2020 by brianthomas 1
brianthomas Posted August 26, 2020 Posted August 26, 2020 That Armando guy is a columnist at the Miami Herald. He says that, but then i read this thorough breakdown here & it says the same thing but with different preconditions. https://www.si.com/nfl/dolphins/news/miami-dolphins-decision-to-waive-injured-curtis-weaver-and-what-it-means I also thought that a player had to pass a physical 1st prior to the waiver claim going thru. Weavers can't pass a physical right now, so i think im just gonna forget this & move on lol.
Rochesterfan Posted August 26, 2020 Posted August 26, 2020 42 minutes ago, brianthomas said: Yep i think so, as long as its before the cut date from 90 players to 53, this is the route they had to take. If they had waited til after the cutdown, they couldve put him on IR. No idea about the Delpit situation in comparison to Weavers. They're both likely out for the season so I have no idea & i dont really care enough to dig into it, even though now i probably will haha. Also i'm no expert on the new CBA & the new changes. Roster designations are/were the main factor in the Phins decision it sounds like. Players do not need to go this route - the Browns placed Delpit on IR to free up the space. Typically the waive IR is used for guys that are not going to make the roster and you want to get rid of them. It sounds like the Dolphins did not think enough of this player and used a route to get rid of him. The Browns thought enough to take a chance.
TigerJ Posted August 26, 2020 Posted August 26, 2020 He was productive enough at a fairly prestigious football program, you'd think the Dolphins could figure out that he might draw interest if waived.
Green Lightning Posted August 26, 2020 Posted August 26, 2020 4 hours ago, DrDawkinstein said: Classic Dolphins. When you're getting out-maneuvered by Cleveland, it's time to pack it in. Ouch. Well put. 1
YoloinOhio Posted August 26, 2020 Posted August 26, 2020 (edited) 5 hours ago, brianthomas said: I love dogging on the fish as much as anyone, but Miami had to expose him to waivers in order to claim the roster spot. Only after he cleared waivers could they place him on IR, as a non vested player has to clear waivers first. Its not usual for a team to take a chance on a player thats injured & claim them off waivers, as they'll have to pay him while being injured & Weaver's likely out for the whole year. Looks like they were simply rolling the dice & lost out on an intriguing prospect for the future. Yes that’s exactly what they did. But they could have waited until 9/5 and he would not have been exposed to waivers before going to IR. That was the blunder. Edited August 26, 2020 by YoloinOhio 1
Doc Posted August 26, 2020 Posted August 26, 2020 How did he look in camp? Must not have been that impressive if they were willing to risk losing him.
Aussie Joe Posted August 26, 2020 Posted August 26, 2020 Weaver was someone I was thinking the Bills could look at in the 3rd if they went another position in Round 2... I was surprised that he lasted to the 5th, and whilst I am glad the Fins don’t have him anymore, cant say I’m thrilled about him going to the Browns... not a fan of them either..
GunnerBill Posted August 26, 2020 Posted August 26, 2020 I am still really confused. Why can the Browns directly IR Delpit but the Dolphins can't directly IR Weaver? I am sorry I can't believe the Dolphins could and just "didn't want to". I know Flores is a bit Belichickian but even Bill wouldn't do that to a 5th round pick before he so much as played a snap in an exhibition game.
Rochesterfan Posted August 26, 2020 Posted August 26, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, GunnerBill said: I am still really confused. Why can the Browns directly IR Delpit but the Dolphins can't directly IR Weaver? I am sorry I can't believe the Dolphins could and just "didn't want to". I know Flores is a bit Belichickian but even Bill wouldn't do that to a 5th round pick before he so much as played a snap in an exhibition game. I believe it had to do with the severity of the injury and how teams want to proceed with a player. A major injury like Delpit (out for more than 6 weeks) allows teams to directly IR the player. A minor injury like Weaver (expected out less than 6 weeks) the NFL and NFLPA have agreed they can not go directly to IR to prevent teams from stashing players. I believe the doctors have to designate an injury and then the player can also get a say if they agree to full IR or not, but the doctors must initially call it a major injury. The Dolphins doctors decided it was a minor injury and therefore Weaver was likely to miss less than 6 weeks of action. In this case - the Dolphins could not just IR the player - he would need to remain on the active roster until cutdown or they could try the waive/IR designation and free up a spot on the roster. Now the question becomes what have they seen and heard from the player in the last 2 weeks and do they think he has any long term value. The Dolphins must have thought he had little long term value and decided to risk it to try and free up the roster space. Seems crazy to me for a guy you “snagged” as a great value pick in the 5th round, but maybe he did not show a commitment that they want to see. This screams blunder because it is now officially a wasted 5th round pick that you lost for nothing, but if he was not going to practice between now and the season starting did they really want the roster spot more than the player. We will also see what the Browns do as he will not get to practice for them at all do they keep him and cut someone else so they can move him to IR or do they expose him during cut down or try getting him on a PS where the Dolphins can steal him back later on. We will see the final outcome over the next several weeks/years, but it is a really bad look for the Dolphins and a hard move to understand for the Browns with all of their current injuries, but I get it. Edited August 26, 2020 by Rochesterfan 2 1
GunnerBill Posted August 26, 2020 Posted August 26, 2020 28 minutes ago, Rochesterfan said: I believe it had to do with the severity of the injury and how teams want to proceed with a player. A major injury like Delpit (out for more than 6 weeks) allows teams to directly IR the player. A minor injury like Weaver (expected out less than 6 weeks) the NFL and NFLPA have agreed they can not go directly to IR to prevent teams from stashing players. I believe the doctors have to designate an injury and then the player can also get a say if they agree to full IR or not, but the doctors must initially call it a major injury. The Dolphins doctors decided it was a minor injury and therefore Weaver was likely to miss less than 6 weeks of action. In this case - the Dolphins could not just IR the player - he would need to remain on the active roster until cutdown or they could try the waive/IR designation and free up a spot on the roster. Now the question becomes what have they seen and heard from the player in the last 2 weeks and do they think he has any long term value. The Dolphins must have thought he had little long term value and decided to risk it to try and free up the roster space. Seems crazy to me for a guy you “snagged” as a great value pick in the 5th round, but maybe he did not show a commitment that they want to see. This screams blunder because it is now officially a wasted 5th round pick that you lost for nothing, but if he was not going to practice between now and the season starting did they really want the roster spot more than the player. We will also see what the Browns do as he will not get to practice for them at all do they keep him and cut someone else so they can move him to IR or do they expose him during cut down or try getting him on a PS where the Dolphins can steal him back later on. We will see the final outcome over the next several weeks/years, but it is a really bad look for the Dolphins and a hard move to understand for the Browns with all of their current injuries, but I get it. Thanks. What is to stop teams gaming that system? "Broken toe? That is 10 months mate." But also am I right that they could have PUP'd him until cutdowns and then IR'd him? Had they done that though he still counts against the 80?
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