Cards make Baker the highest paid safety in the NFL

[Brennan Huff]

21 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

Again, I think Milano is gone after this year.

Me too and I’m ok with that

[Chicken Boo]

6 hours ago, Call_Of_Ktulu said:

Hopefully 4 years 50 mil can get Milano done and 4 years 67 mil can get White done.

 

Wishful thinking.  Tre will be looking to reset the market, imo.

[2ForMacAdoo]

8 hours ago, DrDawkinstein said:

So a 2x Pro Bowl Safety gets $14.75M/year, and that's about what we think we'll have to pay to keep Milano?

 

Is Milano = Budda Baker?

Among premier NFL safeties, soon to be eclipsed by Jamal Adams' new contract when the Seahawks extend him.

[Sherlock Holmes]

Meh, Harrison Smith is the best safety, bar none...

[GunnerBill]

4 hours ago, Sherlock Holmes said:

Meh, Harrison Smith is the best safety, bar none...

 

I mean he is arguably the second best safety on his own team...... But two of the best 3 safeties in the league (would probably be two of 4 but Earl Thomas is currently not in the league for whatever went on in Baltimore) are on the Vikings. That is the elite camp - Harris, Smith, Adams, Thomas. Then I have McCourty, Byard, Mathieu and Hyde as the next group. But there are a few young guys and I put Baker, Simmons, Minkah, Eddie Jackson and Marcus Williams in that category who have been in the league 3 years or fewer and have been a bit up and down but flashed elite potential. Justin Simmons last year might have been for 2019 only the best safety in football but that was his first season close to that level so he has to back it up before you can put him in true elite company. Eddie Jackson was awesome for Chicago (also in Fangio's scheme) in 2018 but his play dropped off a bit last year. Simmons at least has the advantage that Fangio is staying put.

[Bill from NYC]

This was a smart move by a smart, highly successful franchise. After all, just look at how many games that he took control of and won for them.

[GunnerBill]

5 minutes ago, Bill from NYC said:

This was a smart move by a smart, highly successful franchise. After all, just look at how many games that he took control of and won for them.

 

I mean you say that Bill.... but who was the big Free Agent addition to the reigning Superbowl Champion defense 12 months ago that helped get them over the hump..... what position did he play?

 

I know you are a build your defense front to back kinda guy..... but the trend at the moment in the NFL is a lot of the most successful defenses have their best players on the backend. The 49ers probably being the one exception to that rule. But Buffalo, Baltimore, New England, Minnesota, Pittsburgh even Tennessee.... they are back to front defenses.

[machine gun kelly]

9 hours ago, MiltonWaddams said:

4 years/$82million if I had to hazard a guess

Milton, I did a quick search the other day and Darius Slay is the highest at $16.7 mil., and Byron Jones at $16.5 mil., lastly Xavien Howard at $15.5 mil. James Bradbury is fourth at $14.5 mil.

 

So that’s a big leap for Tre in a year and a decreased cap year at $20.5 mil./yr.  What is more likely is $18 mil./yr for $72 mil.  If I’m in his camp, this is a rare situation where he might want to stay on the 5th year option before an extension as he is more likely to get it in two years the $72 mil.  By 2021, you would think we should have the fan issue resolved.  If they extend while on the option year over five years it stretches the $ out and brings the $18 mil. lower.  There is no way this Bills team is going to let one of the best players on defense in the league go especially when they have a defense built from the back forward like BB constructed in NE.

[GunnerBill]

36 minutes ago, machine gun kelly said:

Milton, I did a quick search the other day and Darius Slay is the highest at $16.7 mil., and Byron Jones at $16.5 mil., lastly Xavien Howard at $15.5 mil. James Bradbury is fourth at $14.5 mil.

 

So that’s a big leap for Tre in a year and a decreased cap year at $20.5 mil./yr.  What is more likely is $18 mil./yr for $72 mil.  If I’m in his camp, this is a rare situation where he might want to stay on the 5th year option before an extension as he is more likely to get it in two years the $72 mil.  By 2021, you would think we should have the fan issue resolved.  If they extend while on the option year over five years it stretches the $ out and brings the $18 mil. lower.  There is no way this Bills team is going to let one of the best players on defense in the league go especially when they have a defense built from the back forward like BB constructed in NE.

 

It really depends if Jalen Ramsey signs first. He is supposed to be holding out for $19m. Tre may well want to wait until Ramsey's deal is done because that gives him a very good benchmark.

[HOUSE]

15 hours ago, CLTbills said:

I'm going to be completely honest here. 

I've legitimately never heard of him.

 

Come on you know, Jim & Tammy's son

[machine gun kelly]

25 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

It really depends if Jalen Ramsey signs first. He is supposed to be holding out for $19m. Tre may well want to wait until Ramsey's deal is done because that gives him a very good benchmark.

Very good point GB.  The downside is it is relatively widely known Ramsey is very good, but White is known to be even better.  The upside is we have just under $20 mil. in cap space ranked 13th, and the Rams are the 31st with $4 mil.  Now, we know already it is almost a given the cap hits the floor at $175 mil. so Ramsey getting a jump from the current top player at $16.7 moving all the way up to $19 mil. is a stretch.  There are other reasons, but Diggs shook free for not only his behavior, but they were tight on space and picks.  Beane as always finds a way to pry a top tier WR free.

 

Well the Rams won’t have $, Ramsey’s been good, but will they shake a bunch of players free to keep him.  As it was they had to give a lot of picks for him from Jax.  I don’t know.  You do make a good point GB.

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

24 minutes ago, HOUSE said:

 

Come on you know, Jim & Tammy's son

Actually, I read the title and figured Mayfield had engineered a trade to Arizona, and had switched to the defensive corps.  Had enough of the scheisse show in Cleveland.  ?

[GunnerBill]

13 minutes ago, machine gun kelly said:

Very good point GB.  The downside is it is relatively widely known Ramsey is very good, but White is known to be even better.  The upside is we have just under $20 mil. in cap space ranked 13th, and the Rams are the 31st with $4 mil.  Now, we know already it is almost a given the cap hits the floor at $175 mil. so Ramsey getting a jump from the current top player at $16.7 moving all the way up to $19 mil. is a stretch.  There are other reasons, but Diggs shook free for not only his behavior, but they were tight on space and picks.  Beane as always finds a way to pry a top tier WR free.

 

Well the Rams won’t have $, Ramsey’s been good, but will they shake a bunch of players free to keep him.  As it was they had to give a lot of picks for him from Jax.  I don’t know.  You do make a good point GB.

 

I think Ramsey is elite too. Personally I'd take White but if you are a system that relies on a lot of 1 on 1 man coverage I can totally understand why you might take Ramsey. They are two of the best 4 or 5 in the NFL. 

 

I think Ramsey will get a big prorated bonus up front and big roster bonuses in 2021 and 2022 because the Rams need to control his initial base salaries a bit for cap reasons. But they have plenty of flexibility. He isn't signing for under $18m and I suspect that he ends up very close to his $19m target. Something like 5 years, $93.5m with $50m guaranteed at signing and another $10m of gurantees in the form of roster bonuses the next two years.. 

[Thurman#1]

16 hours ago, Greg S said:

https://www.foxnews.com/sports/cardinals-budda-baker-extension-highest-paid-safety-report

 

 

 

Again, this is one of those PR things where they say it's an extension worth $59 mill, with four new years. Which is a nice ego massage for the player, but actually means he's now under contract for five years for a total of $60.396,364.

 

When you average all that out, it doesn't come to $15 mill a year. Closer to $12.08.

Edited August 26, 2020 by Thurman#1

[Call_Of_Ktulu]

9 hours ago, Chicken Boo said:

 

Wishful thinking.  Tre will be looking to reset the market, imo.

If he resets the market which would be around 4 years 90 mil. we will have a defense with no pass rush that can sometimes shut down a third of the field for a game. The cap is at 198,000,000 and teams are already spending upwards of 135,000,000 on offense and that number is only projected to increase. I love White as a person and a player but for a CB that only takes away a third of the field that is way too much. That doesn't leave a lot for Edmunds, Milano and Oliver if he turns into what I think he will. Also add in that even average DE's take a huge chunk of the cap and you have a major problem. If the cap does decrease in 2021 and 2022 and our offensive spending hits around 130 mil. we will be paying a CB close to 40% of the available cap for defense. The NFL is going to continue to make it easier for the offense and harder on the defense through rule changes. 

[DrDawkinstein]

14 hours ago, Brennan Huff said:

The bigger question is how much are we paying Tre White

 

It's the bigger number, but I'm not sure it's a bigger question. White will get whatever makes him highest paid at that time. Most likely in the $20M range. And I dont think many of us question his value.

 

Milano's value is all over the place. It's tough to find player comparisons for his role and that type of LB. Plus the importance of that role can be questioned.

 

Spotrac has him at about $14M/yr. Is Milano really equivalent to the league's top Safeties? If you had to decide between keeping Milano and signing the best Safety in the league, what would you (or any of us) do?

[GunnerBill]

16 minutes ago, Call_Of_Ktulu said:

The NFL is going to continue to make it easier for the offense and harder on the defense through rule changes. 

 

Which is why I believe that the adjustment teams are making is prioritising top end DBs much more. The rules on hitting QBs now make it far harder to get to disrupt the passer. What you have to do increasingly is find athletes who can win 1 on 1 battles with receivers. The Bills currently secondary has 3 of those. The Bills have to pay Tre. I'd rather pay Tre and lose both Edmunds and Milano if it came to it. Not that I think it will. They can get Edmunds under the cap as well.

19 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

It's the bigger number, but I'm not sure it's a bigger question. White will get whatever makes him highest paid at that time. Most likely in the $20M range. And I dont think many of us question his value.

 

Milano's value is all over the place. It's tough to find player comparisons for his role and that type of LB. Plus the importance of that role can be questioned.

 

Spotrac has him at about $14M/yr. Is Milano really equivalent to the league's top Safeties? If you had to decide between keeping Milano and signing the best Safety in the league, what would you (or any of us) do?

 

You'd sign the best safety. There is no way the Bills give Milano $14m. I think $11m is the absolute top of where the Bills would be and I even think that is high. If they can get him for $10m or under I think they'd do it. Any more than that and he will be allowed to walk.... which I think is the more likely outcome at this stage. One thing the Bills will have to stop doing as they start to pay Tre, Edmunds and Oliver is signing expensive mid range players like Butler and Klein. You can do that when your three defensive cornerstones are all on rookie deals. Once they ain't that has to stop.

[PaattMaann]

39 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

It's the bigger number, but I'm not sure it's a bigger question. White will get whatever makes him highest paid at that time. Most likely in the $20M range. And I dont think many of us question his value.

 

Milano's value is all over the place. It's tough to find player comparisons for his role and that type of LB. Plus the importance of that role can be questioned.

 

Spotrac has him at about $14M/yr. Is Milano really equivalent to the league's top Safeties? If you had to decide between keeping Milano and signing the best Safety in the league, what would you (or any of us) do?

 

Milano is expendable. Love the dude, solid LB, fits perfectly for what we do. BUT, theres only so much money to go around, and you pay White and then Edmunds on defense. Draft well to fill future voids at LB/DE/S. Its cap management. I am happy we have this problem instead of overypaying for bums so they will give us a sniff.

 

Have to have money for Tre, Edmunds and Allen. Everything else after that is a far leap below. 

[DrDawkinstein]

11 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

You'd sign the best safety. There is no way the Bills give Milano $14m. I think $11m is the absolute top of where the Bills would be and I even think that is high. If they can get him for $10m or under I think they'd do it. Any more than that and he will be allowed to walk.... which I think is the more likely outcome at this stage. One thing the Bills will have to stop doing as they start to pay Tre, Edmunds and Oliver is signing expensive mid range players like Butler and Klein. You can do that when your three defensive cornerstones are all on rookie deals. Once they ain't that has to stop.

 

Agreed, and exactly the point I was trying to make. I love Milano, but he isnt equivalent to the top Safeties in the NFL.

 

I'm thinking (hoping) that given the scheme-fit and the coaching staff, we can get him re-signed on a team friendly deal. If not, bye.

[GunnerBill]

1 minute ago, PaattMaann said:

 

Have to have money for Tre, Edmunds and Allen. Everything else after that is a far leap below. 

 

If Oliver develops and comes on like the end of 2019 he is in that category too. Ultimately what it comes down to is you have to keep drafting well and finding those bottom end free agents like Poyer and Feliciano who become critical starters for next to nothing. But the cap is flexible... Bills fans have to get used to that. Look at Kansas City this year. They have less than $1m space and everyone was freaking out..... go 3 months hence they have signed Mahomes to the biggest deal of all time and locked up Chris Jones. The cap allows any team to have 6 or 7 high end players, as long as they are drafting, developing, and finding cheap FAs. Then of course you need coaching. Good coaching.