Midwest1981 Posted August 21, 2020 Posted August 21, 2020 Just now, GunnerBill said: That might have been unpopular for a few weeks in 2008 but I think everyone know accepts it as a fact. Admittedly it's not as common anymore but sometimes you can still come across this take, that the fate of our franchise the last dozen years was forever changed by that early-game hit in the desert.
Ethan in Cleveland Posted August 21, 2020 Posted August 21, 2020 5 hours ago, Straight Hucklebuck said: Unpopular Takes: 1. The Bills screwed up the Jason Peters situation. I don't care that they renegotiated his deal once before. The fact that Derrick Dockery was making $7 million a year, and Langston Walker was making $5 million a year, when Jason Peters was making $3.25M was absurd. Funny how the Philadelphia Eagles were able to get a contract done immediately. Russ Brandon standing up in front of the media in 2009 saying he had no idea where Peters was, and that he hadn't heard from him since the 2008 season ended. And then seeing PFT quote sources saying the Bills got fleeced. Fans largely sided with the organization, saying Peters was a fat, out of shape slob and that the Bills made him into what he was. Rinky Dink organization. Peters is a HOF LT. 2. Fans sided with Doug Marrone and EJ Manuel when the Bills traded Steve Johnson. I hated that trade. Somehow the guy that turned down Free Agency to stay with the Bills, and led the Bills in receiving 3-years was now too erratic of a route runner for disciplinarian Marrone and EJ. Plus, the coddling of Sammy Watkins started then too, couldn't have Sammy face any competition. Fans tuned on Steve Johnson, his "antics", what a dropped pass and a shirt that said "why so serious?". I know how ghastly. And I ripped the Bills for the Marrone hire to begin with. Again, Russ Brandon promised a no-stone unturned search for a HC. And what we got was 5-days in Arizona. Johnson was a good story and somehow he was able to beat Revis consistently. But that drop in OT against the Steelers was unforgivable. 5 hours ago, TheyCallMeAndy said: Aaron Schobel was NOT a garbage time sack artist. Rian Lindell is in the same tier as Steve Christie Brian Moorman should be on the Wall Stevie Johnson was overrated London Fletcher was underrated Schobel was a great player and deserves to be on the wall. Moorman does not. Fletcher was overrated. Rare an impact play did he make. 5 hours ago, Sammy Watkins' Rib said: Isn't a jersey also team gear? I've never understood the jersey's are only for kids crowd. Yes, I wear jersey's on game day. Adults can wear jerseys. My point was and the other poster agreed, must be on the team currently or a great player. You can't wear a CJ Spiller jersey in 2019. Team gear is sweathiry or Hoodia with just a logo
Captain Hindsight Posted August 21, 2020 Posted August 21, 2020 7 hours ago, Florida Bills Fanatic said: If Whaley was not as bad as people in Buffalo think, why hasn't he landed another good job elsewhere in the NFL? The XFL, really? The professionals in the NFL know him and their actions are proof enough for me. The numbers tell the story for Bill Polian. His record is 229 wins and 138 losses as a GM with his three different teams. All three teams had more wins than losses during his time with them. His teams only missed the playoffs 7 times during his 23 years as a GM. In Buffalo during his tenure, the team only missed the playoffs twice ( his first two years ). His record was 69 and 42 in Buffalo with 8 playoff wins. So much for being drastically overrated. If Beane can even approach those numbers, we should all be happy campers. I think a big reason Whaley doesnt have an NFL job was him saying something along the lines of humans shouldnt play football
GunnerBill Posted August 21, 2020 Posted August 21, 2020 2 minutes ago, Captain Hindsight said: I think a big reason Whaley doesnt have an NFL job was him saying something along the lines of humans shouldnt play football I think it is because he has only been willing to interview for GM jobs.
FireChans Posted August 21, 2020 Posted August 21, 2020 19 hours ago, BullBuchanan said: Because I think he was at best average at drafting, not just in Buffalo, but Indy too. The best 2 players he ever drafted were consensus #1 overalls in Bruce and Manning. Give him credit for Getting Andre Reed in the 4th round. He built those teams in a pre-salarycap era largely by paying Jim Kelly the highest salary ever for an NFL player. Essentially, I think a lot of Polian's success was luck of getting franchise QB's and elite talent at the top of drafts. And the fact that neither the Bills nor the Colts won anywhere near as much as they should have is the result of his weaknesses. He had a ton of mid round picks that never even ended up playing a game. Granted, there was a lot more rounds in those days , but if he didn't need the picks he should have done something more valuable with them. Edit: I think the fact that he didn't build the Bills on a salary cap in Buffalo, and that he was unable to build a balanced team in Indy under a cap is further indictment. What’s pretty funny in this post is that you call Polish overrated because he drafted great blue chip players and franchise QB’s. Maybe that’s less “whys he’s overrated” and more “this is how you win a lot.” 1
BullBuchanan Posted August 21, 2020 Posted August 21, 2020 7 minutes ago, FireChans said: What’s pretty funny in this post is that you call Polish overrated because he drafted great blue chip players and franchise QB’s. Maybe that’s less “whys he’s overrated” and more “this is how you win a lot.” Read it again. He didn't draft Kelly. He joined a team where a Franchise QB was there and it took the highest contract ever to get him signed. You don't call someone a great negotiator if they pay the maximum every time. With Peyton Manning, it was an obvious decision that every GM in his position would have made, backed up by the pre-draft analysis I posted. How much credit do you want to give him for drafting the consensus #1 on a team that desperately needed him, with the #1 pick. It's not like he moved up to get him or found a diamond in the rough. Ryan Leaf's mother would have drafted Peyton first overall. 1
Jauronimo Posted August 21, 2020 Posted August 21, 2020 10 minutes ago, FireChans said: What’s pretty funny in this post is that you call Polish overrated because he drafted great blue chip players and franchise QB’s. Maybe that’s less “whys he’s overrated” and more “this is how you win a lot.” I don't think anyone, ever, has said being Polish is overrated. I don't even think its rated.
Jauronimo Posted August 21, 2020 Posted August 21, 2020 31 minutes ago, Captain Hindsight said: I think a big reason Whaley doesnt have an NFL job was him saying something along the lines of humans shouldnt play football That and he had no ability to handle the media and represent a franchise. The way tossed the Pegulas under the bus before getting canned sealed his fate as director of pro personnel or nothing.
BullBuchanan Posted August 21, 2020 Posted August 21, 2020 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Jauronimo said: That and he had no ability to handle the media and represent a franchise. The way tossed the Pegulas under the bus before getting canned sealed his fate as director of pro personnel or nothing. Yea, it's a bit strange that he had no public speaking ability and just seemed like very much an introvert. Seems odd to be able to rise up the ranks in an industry as public as the NFL without those skills. Edited August 21, 2020 by BullBuchanan
EasternOHBillsFan Posted August 21, 2020 Posted August 21, 2020 Doug Flutie was never going to win us games that mattered because he didn't have the ability to win big games. He never won a playoff game and rode our defense the whole time. He alienated the veterans on the team and accelerated the turnover process from a team who won AFC East titles to a team that couldn't even come close to winning one. It never was RJ vs. Flutie... it was the inability for the Bills to draft a franchise QB and instead they chose to reach for Flutie.
Florida Bills Fanatic Posted August 21, 2020 Posted August 21, 2020 1 hour ago, GunnerBill said: I think it is because he has only been willing to interview for GM jobs. The biggest reason is that he sucked at his job. We all need to stop kidding ourselves. Even though he was a nice guy that people liked, he was terrible. 1
GunnerBill Posted August 21, 2020 Posted August 21, 2020 Just now, Florida Bills Fanatic said: The biggest reason is that he sucked at his job. We all need to stop kidding ourselves. Even though he was a nice guy that people liked, he was terrible. Nah he wasn't terrible. He wasn't good either. But he wasn't terrible. He has had two GM interviews so the league clearly doesn't think he was terrible.
Ridgewaycynic2013 Posted August 21, 2020 Posted August 21, 2020 31 minutes ago, EasternOHBillsFan said: Doug Flutie was never going to win us games that mattered because he didn't have the ability to win big games. Are you trying to be funny? Little QBs need love too!
Just Jack Posted August 21, 2020 Posted August 21, 2020 Lou Saban is a quitter, he doesn't deserve to be on the Wall Of Fame.
Golden Goat Posted August 21, 2020 Posted August 21, 2020 9 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said: The HOF is a popularity contest as well. Joe Namath shouldn't be in there too. Namath is in the HOF and Ken Stabler isn't. IMO that's one of the most egregious examples of your point. We had 'Broadway Joe,' but not 'Stabler Street.' 1
Matt_In_NH Posted August 21, 2020 Posted August 21, 2020 8 hours ago, Steve O said: Harmon's drop against Cleveland would have been a difficult catch. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H5tBYB88MPA Does not look all that difficult for an NFL player.....he short armed it. That still stings when I think back on it.
Jerry Jabber Posted August 21, 2020 Posted August 21, 2020 2 hours ago, boco357 said: I always believed Aaron Schobel was over rated. He put up some solid numbers, but I thought a lot of time was garbage time production. I am trying to think back of a huge game changing play, but off the top of my head can't. I think Schoebel would have been a great #2 DE. One thing I’ll say in his defense, he didn’t have good DE’s playing along side him. My favorite play from Schoebel was his one-handed INT against Brady which he returned for a TD. 1
The BLUES Brothers Posted August 21, 2020 Posted August 21, 2020 10 hours ago, GunnerBill said: I think his college tape displayed a level of natural inaccuracy (that is inaccuracy not explainable by an obvious technical issue) that I would not have been comfortable drafting. It has show itself in the NFL too at times, but when he really gets in rhythm and the ball is in his hands he has shown he can be a consistent and accurate thrower. It is why I am absolutely against any suggestion that the way we develop Josh is by babying him, only asking him to throw 25 times a game and run it relentlessly. I don't think you will ever develop this guy that way. You have to have him in rhythm and throwing. His decision making did worry me too, that worries me less now. I think he is a bit of a reckless gunslinger at times but some of his best plays come when he does that. The one area I completely missed in my evaluation of him was how dangerous he is with his legs. I totally missed on that. The other faults that I saw are still there and while I worry about them less now, they would still looking back at the college tape have put me off drafting him. That said, I am pretty optimistic with where he is at. If he can take another step this year he may well be the guy. Thank you for the reply and astute observations. Glad you are optimistic and interesting how you could see a great way to get him in a rhythm to be even better. I am not blowing smoke - I respect your opinion and wanted to see your take - sorry I have been offline all day - TGIF to one and all and Go Bills!
The Wiz Posted August 21, 2020 Posted August 21, 2020 When you consider his injury and eventually benching, EJ was still a rookie. One of my favorite. 1
EasternOHBillsFan Posted August 22, 2020 Posted August 22, 2020 2 hours ago, Ridgewaycynic2013 said: Are you trying to be funny? Little QBs need love too! HA, HA Figured it had been 20 years since the debate, so all of the edge had worn off by now. The Bills were TERRIBLE at choosing QBs from Todd Collins on, and that probably cost us years and years in itself. Glad those days are over and the second guessing and the turmoil.
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