DCOrange Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 (edited) https://theathletic.com/1945894/2020/07/27/2020-quarterback-tiers-50-coaches-and-evaluators-rank-the-nfl-starters/ I didn't realize Sando had moved over to The Athletic, but he published his annual QB Tiers survey today where QBs are placed on 5 different tiers based on the votes of coaches and "evaluators". Tier 1: A Tier 1 quarterback can carry his team each week. The team wins because of him. He expertly handles pure passing situations. He has no real holes in his game. 1. Mahomes/Wilson 3. Rodgers 4. Brees 5. Watson Tier 2: A Tier 2 quarterback can carry his team sometimes but not as consistently. He can handle pure passing situations in doses and/or possesses other dimensions that are special enough to elevate him above Tier 3. He has a hole or two in his game. 6. Brady 7. Lamar 8. Big Ben 9. Stafford 10. Matt Ryan 11. Wentz 12. Dak 13. Rivers Tier 3: A Tier 3 quarterback is a legitimate starter but needs a heavier running game and/or defensive component to win. A lower-volume dropback passing offense suits him best. 14. Kyler Murray 15. Cousins 16. Goff 17. Garoppolo 18. Tannehill 19. Cam Newton 20. Carr 21. Baker 22. Josh Allen 23. Bridgewater 24. Darnold 25. Daniel Jones 26. Nick Foles Tier 4: A Tier 4 quarterback could be an unproven player with some upside or a veteran who is ultimately best suited as a backup. 27. Mariota 28. Fitzpatrick 29. Tyrod 30. Drew Lock/Gardner Minshew 32. Trubisky 33. Haskins 34. Stidham 35. Kyle Allen On Josh Allen: Vote Breakdown: Tier 2: 4 Tier 3: 40 Tier 4: 6 Quote Allen enjoyed the third-largest improvement from last year in average tier vote (3.69 to 3.04) as voters bumped him into the third tier, where he seems to fit as a quarterback who has won while supported by a top defense, without yet distinguishing himself as a player who can sometimes carry his team on the strength of his passing, especially in pure-pass situations.“I think he is a three trending towards a two,” a former head coach said. “I saw him make some throws this year in the pocket that were really good throws. He will stand in there and get hit and make an accurate throw down the field and he has a good arm. I thought he did a better job understanding how to throw the ball later in the season, not always trying to throw it through the back of the wall.”Allen’s postseason meltdown at Houston is a hard visual to shake. Voters who were skeptical of Allen coming out of college or through the start of his career could easily point to that game for validation. Yet, Allen became one of only four players to move into a higher tier from last year, joining Jackson, Watson and Prescott in that regard. But there are some who think he’s a better football player than quarterback, which isn’t always insurmountable but has been in extreme cases such as Tim Tebow and Blake Bortles.“He is not a real good decision maker, he is not especially accurate,” a defensive coach who faced the Bills said. “He is a tough competitor, but just a dude —a lower three if you were asking me.”An offensive coach said Allen would reach the second tier if he could compensate for a lack of instincts and accuracy by “doing some other things like Lamar (Jackson).”Allen is already doing some of those things. He ran the ball on 18 percent of his plays last season, the second-highest rate behind Jackson (29 percent) among 33 quarterbacks with at least 200 pass attempts. His 544 yards rushing ranked third behind Jackson and Murray. His nine rushing touchdowns led all quarterbacks, but weren’t enough to elevate him higher than 24th in Total QBR.“A lot of these guys rely on their athleticism, but you don’t see Kyler Murray or Russell Wilson take a lot of straight-up clean shots,” an offensive play-caller said. “With Josh and Lamar, they will lower their right shoulders. There are a couple shots where you go, ‘How the hell does he not get stretchered off?’ Josh is not as dynamic as those guys above him and I think his passing leaves a little to be desired, but he is good, he makes enough plays, they play defense behind him.”Allen tied for the NFL lead in fourth-quarter comeback victories last season.“This will be a big year for him just to see where he goes,” a head coach said. “I thought he was accurate enough. People hit him with his accuracy. I thought, teach him how to get into rhythm and go. He had good vision. He was throwing to the right guys.” Edited July 27, 2020 by DCOrange 4 1
Shaw66 Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 Sounds like a pretty fair assessment. Nice that he's one of only a few who climbed the ladder last season. I agree that he looks like he's moving to tier two. His play has to demonstrate it. 5
SCBills Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 Makes sense to me.. I think a lot of us are expecting him to make the jump to Tier 2 this year. 3
eball Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 15 minutes ago, DCOrange said: On Josh Allen: Vote Breakdown: Tier 2: 4 Tier 3: 40 Tier 4: 6 The six guys who voted Allen Tier 4 are morons. 7
DCOrange Posted July 27, 2020 Author Posted July 27, 2020 4 minutes ago, eball said: The six guys who voted Allen Tier 4 are morons. Yeah, I don't really get that either. Tier 3 is definitely right at the moment IMO.
Don Otreply Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 Looks to be a fair assessment, like all of us I hope tier 2 is achieved early this season. Go Bills!!! 1
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 23 minutes ago, DCOrange said: Tier 2: A Tier 2 quarterback can carry his team sometimes but not as consistently. He can handle pure passing situations in doses and/or possesses other dimensions that are special enough to elevate him above Tier 3. He has a hole or two in his game. 7. Lamar what a crock of ? 3
Stank_Nasty Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 i'd argue he's in the 14-18 range in tier 3. but it seems pretty fair regardless.
MJS Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 Surprised he got some tier 2 votes. He's clearly tier 3 right now. But he's young and improving.
C.Biscuit97 Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 10 minutes ago, DCOrange said: Yeah, I don't really get that either. Tier 3 is definitely right at the moment IMO. Mariota had a really strong second season. Tribusky made a “pro bowl” in his second year. Allen had Tyrod stats this year. I can definitely get why some people aren’t sold yet. but I can’t imagine anyone arguing this list. This is one of the best ones I’ve seen. At this point, Allen wins with a strong defense and doesn’t have to carry a team. But he certainly has upside. 11 minutes ago, SlimShady'sSpaceForce said: what a crock of ? Huh? 1
Johnnycage46 Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 38 minutes ago, DCOrange said: https://theathletic.com/1945894/2020/07/27/2020-quarterback-tiers-50-coaches-and-evaluators-rank-the-nfl-starters/ I didn't realize Sando had moved over to The Athletic, but he published his annual QB Tiers survey today where QBs are placed on 5 different tiers based on the votes of coaches and "evaluators". Tier 1: A Tier 1 quarterback can carry his team each week. The team wins because of him. He expertly handles pure passing situations. He has no real holes in his game. 1. Mahomes/Wilson 3. Rodgers 4. Brees 5. Watson Tier 2: A Tier 2 quarterback can carry his team sometimes but not as consistently. He can handle pure passing situations in doses and/or possesses other dimensions that are special enough to elevate him above Tier 3. He has a hole or two in his game. 6. Brady 7. Lamar 8. Big Ben 9. Stafford 10. Matt Ryan 11. Wentz 12. Dak 13. Rivers Tier 3: A Tier 3 quarterback is a legitimate starter but needs a heavier running game and/or defensive component to win. A lower-volume dropback passing offense suits him best. 14. Kyler Murray 15. Cousins 16. Goff 17. Garoppolo 18. Tannehill 19. Cam Newton 20. Carr 21. Baker 22. Josh Allen 23. Bridgewater 24. Darnold 25. Daniel Jones 26. Nick Foles Tier 4: A Tier 4 quarterback could be an unproven player with some upside or a veteran who is ultimately best suited as a backup. 27. Mariota 28. Fitzpatrick 29. Tyrod 30. Drew Lock/Gardner Minshew 32. Trubisky 33. Haskins 34. Stidham 35. Kyle Allen On Josh Allen: Vote Breakdown: Tier 2: 4 Tier 3: 40 Tier 4: 6 Thanks for posting this. My one thought on this is it would be interesting to see what Mahomes was without all of his weapons, similar to how Russel Wilson has basically carried the Seahawks for the last 4 or 5 years. I am certainly not saying Mahomes would NOT be good/great, but I think it speaks more to just how damn impressive Wilson is and how he can put his team on his back year after year.
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 4 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said: Huh? please Lamar get too much credit for having a good defense behind him and opposing defenses over reacting to his running threat. he is Tyrod 2.5. Let him play a few more years and let’s pass judgment then. 1
C.Biscuit97 Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 (edited) 6 minutes ago, SlimShady'sSpaceForce said: please Lamar get too much credit for having a good defense behind him and opposing defenses over reacting to his running threat. he is Tyrod 2.5. Let him play a few more years and let’s pass judgment then. I could only imagine what we would have Allen ranked if won MVP after winning a Heisman. And Why did you pick Tyrod? I must have missed Tyrod’s 36 passing td season at age 23. Allen had a higher ranked defense and you realize Jackson is a huge reason for their running game success right? a lot of double standards on this board. As a critic of Allen, if he had the season Lamar did, I’d fight people who tried to discredit it haha. Edited July 27, 2020 by C.Biscuit97 3
Kirby Jackson Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 6 minutes ago, SlimShady'sSpaceForce said: please Lamar get too much credit for having a good defense behind him and opposing defenses over reacting to his running threat. he is Tyrod 2.5. Let him play a few more years and let’s pass judgment then. He’s the MVP of the league. He led the highest scoring offense in the league (by a substantial margin). Lamar Jackson is elite. Saying that doesn’t discredit Allen or anyone else. I’m not sure why we feel a need to discredit Lamar? As of right now, he’s one of the best QBs in football and trending up. 6
H2o Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 5 minutes ago, SlimShady'sSpaceForce said: please Lamar get too much credit for having a good defense behind him and opposing defenses over reacting to his running threat. he is Tyrod 2.5. Let him play a few more years and let’s pass judgment then. Lamar is not Tyrod in any way my friend. He is the same exact guy in the NFL that he was in college. If anything I would say he's Kaep on steroids. The guy is electric. Our defense held him to his lowest output of the year in total yards from scrimmage, but not everyone has our defense to do that. If Lamar can improve his passing to the boundaries then it's lights out. Right now though he doesn't throw those very well. He loves his tall receivers whether they be TE or WR and a lot of his passing production comes off of the threat of his legs finding those tall receivers. The talent is there and he is in the perfect system for his skill set. You have to give credit where credit is due sometimes brother. 2 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said: I could only imagine when we would have Allen ranked if won MVP after winning a Heisman. And Why did you pick Tyrod? I must have missed Tyrod’s 36 passing td season at age 23. Allen had a higher ranked defense and you realize Jackson is a huge reason for their running game success right? a lot of double standards on this board. As a critic of Allen, if he had the season Lamar did, I’d fight people who tried to discredit it haha. If Allen had a year like Lamar then EVERYONE on here would be defending him if naysayers popped up. 1 1
BullBuchanan Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 Based ont he definitions, I think it's pretty clear Ben is Tier 1, assuming injury plays no role in the list. Dak is too high, Netwon (If injury isn't a factor) and Garoppolo too low, and Murray is too high. Tannehill is probably 6 games removed form Tier 4 status, but if he keeps it up, good for him. Otherwise, it all seems plausible. 4 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said: He’s the MVP of the league. He led the highest scoring offense in the league (by a substantial margin). Lamar Jackson is elite. Saying that doesn’t discredit Allen or anyone else. I’m not sure why we feel a need to discredit Lamar? As of right now, he’s one of the best QBs in football and trending up. If he improves his passing game further, he'll really suck to have in our conference. 1
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