14 Positives on Marlins

[BillsFan2313]

2 minutes ago, BullBuchanan said:

Why and why not?

 

I wear a mask, and follow all of cdc suggestions, but I don't think people not following the protocols is the problem. Thats pretty much what I got from it. 

[BullBuchanan]

Just now, MJS said:

Because tons of people are following the guidelines and the spread continues, especially in densely populated areas that have had strict and enforced policies.

And tons of people aren't, like the beachgoers you mentioned. America is the only country that seems to think this is some inevitable and unsolvable problem. I guess that's what happens when you rank in the 30's in education.

We aren't failing despite our best efforts. We're failing because our best effort isn't good enough.

[teef]

1 minute ago, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said:

 

There's also more recent studies contradicting the older ones stating kids can spread it just as much if not more than adults. 

 

What will be the answer once a teacher or school bus driver catches it and now are out for two weeks?  Where will their replacement come from?  Can't believe someone would take a job as substitute teacher these days based on what they pay and with this on top.

again...this will happen in every work environment.  you know what else will happen?  the job force will take a hit when people have no idea how to deal with care.  there's a big trickle down effect with schools closing.  

 

 

[BullBuchanan]

2 minutes ago, teef said:

but isn't this the case for all work environments?  hell, my staff is in a way more "dangerous" situation than anyone at a school.  we put systems in place, have precautions, ppe, etc.  again, we may have to close for a period of time due to an incident, but we have to navigate through this the best we can.  all work places have risks.  we can eliminate risks...just try to greatly minimize them.

The difference being that you're all adults and you all understand what's at stake. If some selfish person on your team wants to place you all in danger, they know exactly what they're doing. Kids cannot possibly understand the gravity of this.

[Doc Brown]

7 minutes ago, Bill Lewes said:

 

That isn't really the complete problem or answer, though.  Schools aren't just kids.  In every community in this country, you're talking dozens if not hundreds of adults - and their entire social circles - at risk unless you create a safe environment to reopen.

 

True but how is that any different than hospital staff?

7 minutes ago, BullBuchanan said:

how are you determining the death rate?

Just based off that article.  That's the current death rate of children in Florida.

4 minutes ago, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said:

 

There's also more recent studies contradicting the older ones stating kids can spread it just as much if not more than adults. 

 

What will be the answer once a teacher or school bus driver catches it and now are out for two weeks?  Where will their replacement come from?  Can't believe someone would take a job as substitute teacher these days based on what they pay and with this on top.

It's not going to be easy and it's why they're pushing ahead to open with major precautions.  The CDC recommends that schools not reopening would do more damage to children than reopening.

[HappyDays]

It blows my mind that we are one of the richest cilizatizations in history and we could not get this thing under control by now. How did we not have a procedure already in place? We could knocked the whole thing out in a month early in the year. Mandate that everyone in the country wear masks in public, make testing easily available and cheap/free, contact trace the positive tests. That's it. It would be all but eliminated at this point if we had followed those three steps for 3-4 weeks.

 

There are no contingencies in place if this sort of thing happens in the NFL. It's one thing for a couple players to get covid, but it if spreads within a whole team the season will be at risk. I can't see how they are going to make a 16 game schedule work at this point. It is logistically impossible.

Edited July 27, 2020 by HappyDays

[teef]

2 minutes ago, BullBuchanan said:

The difference being that you're all adults and you all understand what's at stake. If some selfish person on your team wants to place you all in danger, they know exactly what they're doing. Kids cannot possibly understand the gravity of this.

some may depending on the age.  and as mentioned with kids under 11, there seems to be a different take on the spread.  it's up to the adults to help them with the day to day negotiation of it.  as i mentioned, our daughter hugged a positive covid child.  we followed the guidelines of the department of health, and we were all ok.

 

besides...i don' want virtual learning.  it's not a replacement and does nothing positive for the kids.  it's amazing that people without kids are taking such a hard stance on it.  i feel my kid/kids can get a good in school education while being safe.  i'm even looking into private schools not that are going 5 days a week.  enough is enough.

 

every time a business reopens, there's such a fear attached to it.  within a few weeks when everything has shown to go smooth, the nonsense calms down.  schools will work the same way.  

[DrDawkinstein]

Just now, HappyDays said:

It blows my mind that we one of the richest cilizatizations in history and we could not get this thing under control by now. How did we not have a procedure already in place? We could knocked the whole thing out in a month early in the year. Mandate that everyone in the country wear masks in public, make testing easily available and cheap/free, contact trace the positive tests. That's it. It would be all but eliminated at this point if we had followed those three steps for 3-4 weeks.

 

There are no contingencies in place if this sort of thing happens in the NFL. It's one thing for a couple players to get covid, but it if spreads within a whole team the season will be at risk. I can't see how they are going to make a 16 game schedule work at this point. It is logistically impossible.

 

WRT the bold. We did. We had the best pandemic response system in the world. Someone threw it all away in 2018.

[Meatloaf63]

5 hours ago, MJS said:

How do you explain California? They have been having huge spikes in cases too. They have been shut down and masked up for months now.

Riots, and going to bars without distancing. As good a guess as any. 

[BullBuchanan]

2 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

It blows my mind that we one of the richest cilizatizations in history and we could not get this thing under control by now. How did we not have a procedure already in place? We could knocked the whole thing out in a month early in the year. Mandate that everyone in the country wear masks in public, make testing easily available and cheap/free, contact trace the positive tests. That's it. It would be all but eliminated at this point if we had followed those three steps for 3-4 weeks.

 

There are no contingencies in place if this sort of thing happens in the NFL. It's one thing for a couple players to get covid, but it if spreads within a whole team the season will be at risk. I can't see how they are going to make a 16 game schedule work at this point. It is logistically impossible.

Well, we did, but talking about why we don't anymore would be making this political.

[FireChans]

52 minutes ago, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said:

 

From what I've read what makes everyone more concerned with Covid compared to seasonal flu is that it's much more contagious and easier to catch and spread.  In addition we have had years of dealing with the flu and have a better idea on how to treat it.  We're also much earlier in the cycle than seasonal flu.  The hard hit areas have only been that way for maybe 2 to 3 months, then it jumps someplace else because very little to stop it's spread.  By the end of 2020 at the rate wer're going likely will be at the same if not higher levels than seasonal flu.  I just found one site that stated there were 30 deaths of kids under the age of 15 and that was only thru July 14th.    Seasonal flu for whatever reason dies off in the warmer weather, believe that was something Trump had a hunch would happen too with Covid.

 

Also when comparing it to the seasonal flu how come there were never reports of hospitals and ICU's overflowing in bad areas?  I've yet to hear an explanation to that from everyone who says "this is just like the flu"!  That was the idea behind flattening the curve, yes will still be bad, but at manageable levels as opposed to places that can't handle it.  Again for whatever reason the flu seams to follow a much flatter spread so can keep up better. or just isn't as contagious, maybe because there's already a vaccine out there.

You’ve never read an article about flu season overwhelming ICU’s?

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/time.com/5107984/hospitals-handling-burden-flu-patients/%3famp=true

 

Man, everyone just graduated med school this year, huh?

[Billl]

11 minutes ago, teef said:

again...this will happen in every work environment.  you know what else will happen?  the job force will take a hit when people have no idea how to deal with care.  there's a big trickle down effect with schools closing.  

 

 

What’s the death rate of the job force taking a hit?  That’s all that matters.

2 minutes ago, FireChans said:

You’ve never read an article about flu season overwhelming ICU’s?

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/time.com/5107984/hospitals-handling-burden-flu-patients/%3famp=true

 

Man, everyone just graduated med school this year, huh?

So there were 61,000 deaths from the flu in the year your article discusses despite no lockdown measures.  There have been 150,000 in the past 4 months from COVID despite a nationwide lockdown, and half the country thinks we’re doing too much.

[HappyDays]

2 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

WRT the bold. We did. We had the best pandemic response system in the world. Someone threw it all away in 2018.

 

You can't help but wonder how things would be different if Trump wasn't president. But I don't know, I don't necessarily buy that Democrats would have solved the problem. There was zero chance of federal legislation that mandated masks nationally and I don't think the President has any constitutional standing to mandate them with an executive order. I think this pandemic belongs to the citizens of the country. Too many just weren't willing to socially distance and wear masks - many still aren't! As long as those people are here, no pandemic response would have been enough short of federal policy.

[RiotAct]

8 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

It blows my mind that we one of the richest cilizatizations in history and we could not get this thing under control by now. How did we not have a procedure already in place? We could knocked the whole thing out in a month early in the year. Mandate that everyone in the country wear masks in public, make testing easily available and cheap/free, contact trace the positive tests. That's it. It would be all but eliminated at this point if we had followed those three steps for 3-4 weeks.

 

Just like that!  Simple.

[Doc Brown]

4 minutes ago, Billl said:

What’s the death rate of the job force taking a hit?  That’s all that matters.

84%

[teef]

3 minutes ago, Billl said:

What’s the death rate of the job force taking a hit?  That’s all that matters.

obviously when people talk in extremes, the conversation stalls.

 

i've been worried about two things...my kid's health and education.  after doing some basic research and having a face to face conversation with our peds, i'm comfortable with our daughter going into that environment.  concerning my kid's education, even at this early stage, there's no way learning on line will be even close enough to ok.  life needs to move forward carefully.

[DrDawkinstein]

Just now, HappyDays said:

 

You can't help but wonder how things would be different if Trump wasn't president. But I don't know, I don't necessarily buy that Democrats would have solved the problem. There was zero chance of federal legislation that mandated masks nationally and I don't think the President has any constitutional standing to mandate them with an executive order. I think this pandemic belongs to the citizens of the country. Too many just weren't willing to socially distance and wear masks - many still aren't! As long as those people are here, no pandemic response would have been enough short of federal policy.

 

I can tell you how it would be different.

 

There would be 3000 dead and Republicans would be blowing their lid about the greatest failure by a President in American history.

 

It wouldnt have been 0 for anyone, ever. But starting the approach by dismissing a global pandemic as a "Democratic Hoax" set us down a path from which we are unable to recover.

[JoshAllenHasBigHands]

3 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

I can tell you how it would be different.

 

There would be 3000 dead and Republicans would be blowing their lid about the greatest failure by a President in American history.

 

It wouldnt have been 0 for anyone, ever. But starting the approach by dismissing a global pandemic as a "Democratic Hoax" set us down a path from which we are unable to recover.

 

You are dead right about the first piece. Republicans would have been absolutely terrible situation reversed. 

 

That said, Trump didn't call it a hoax. I feel like that has been fact-checked enough that people shouldn't still be making that claim. 

[Billl]

7 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

You can't help but wonder how things would be different if Trump wasn't president. But I don't know, I don't necessarily buy that Democrats would have solved the problem. There was zero chance of federal legislation that mandated masks nationally and I don't think the President has any constitutional standing to mandate them with an executive order. I think this pandemic belongs to the citizens of the country. Too many just weren't willing to socially distance and wear masks - many still aren't! As long as those people are here, no pandemic response would have been enough short of federal policy.

I’ve got to think that Obama would have come up with something better than “drink bleach and shove a flashlight up your butt”.

[HappyDays]

5 minutes ago, RiotAct said:

Just like that!  Simple.

 

Yep, simple. Here's how simple it is:

 

 

Masks have been shown to be far and away the best method of stopping the virus's spread, short of social isolation.

 

Combine that with readily available testing to anyone who wants it and tracing those that test positive, we could have had this thing well under control by now. Instead we're still sputtering along.