BullBuchanan Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Big Blitz said: Needs to run its course. I vehemently disagree Edited July 27, 2020 by BullBuchanan
Big Blitz Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 3 minutes ago, Billl said: You may as well have linked Trump’s interview saying it would suddenly magically disappear. Hell, even the comments section of the article is littered with people talking about how it would go away when the weather heated up. You might also want to note that Levitt is a biophysicist, not an epidemiologist. Smart guy with some interesting insights, but not an expert. New York's cases plummeted totally bc they just wear masks and protest more responsibly. The data is here. They were at 14% infected in late April via seroprevolance studies. No doubt that number is over 20% now. Annnnd cases have slowed. I'm open to doing what I've been doing all along. Listening to all voices and following the data.
Billl Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 12 minutes ago, Big Blitz said: T-Cells Antibodies Complex science-y stuff This has led to speculation about whether a population can achieve some sort of immunity to the virus with as little as 20% infected – a proportion well below the widely accepted herd immunity threshold (60-70%). https://theconversation.com/coronavirus-could-it-be-burning-out-after-20-of-a-population-is-infected-141584 Well, if you believe the models that have come out of MIT early on you can wait till March ........of 2022. Nothing more sciency than taking individual sentences, stripping them of context, and spiking the football...especially when your own cherry picked sentence uses the terms “speculation” and “some sort of immunity” while acknowledging that 60-70% is “widely accepted”.
Dopey Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 2 hours ago, MJS said: Oh, so we can't trust the CDC now? Then who do we trust? All the data out there is compromised then and nobody knows anything. You can't trust an agency that wrote guidelines for the return to schools, then "softened" them cuz Donald says the guidelines are too tough. Donald is the last person the CDC should be taking advise from. Or maybe we can inject a disinfectant like he suggested. What a JOKE!!! 1 hour ago, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said: I've told you this once before and I'll say it again, you're awful smart for someone who's Dopey! Dude! Give me a warning at least. I spit my coffee out in laughter! Thanks and be safe. 1
Billl Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 Just now, Big Blitz said: New York's cases plummeted totally bc they just wear masks and protest more responsibly. The data is here. They were at 14% infected in late April via seroprevolance studies. No doubt that number is over 20% now. Annnnd cases have slowed. I'm open to doing what I've been doing all along. Listening to all voices and following the data. Your data consists of one projection from March that has already been proven incorrect and a study that won’t be complete for 2 years. Both are worthless at this point in time.
MJS Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 3 minutes ago, Big Blitz said: New York's cases plummeted totally bc they just wear masks and protest more responsibly. The data is here. They were at 14% infected in late April via seroprevolance studies. No doubt that number is over 20% now. Annnnd cases have slowed. I'm open to doing what I've been doing all along. Listening to all voices and following the data. Wow. They went down because they got hit so hard and now there is a significant portion of the population with antibodies.
FireChans Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 3 hours ago, That's No Moon said: Really? The medical community or the medical community that got told to rewrite all the guidelines a couple weeks ago or just the medical community on the channel you watch. https://blogs.edweek.org/edweek/District_Dossier/2020/07/cdc_american_academy_pediatrics_guidelines_different.html What medical community to trust? The one that agrees with me, of course!
billsfan89 Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 50 minutes ago, JoshAllenHasBigHands said: That is true. And I dont mean for my comment to suggest that there are not risks associated with opening schools. Its just important that all the facts are right. The fact that children are not at risk for this disease is an important fact of which people need to be aware, but which they are not. To be frank, there will be risk up until the point we have a vaccine. Waiting that long is not a realistic option. It just isn't. I think we can all agree on that, right? Maybe I presume too much. It's just too big of a risk short term. If it is October and we really buckled down and getting this curve bent then maybe we could have a smart 50/50 approach to in school and distance learning (kids do 5 days in school and 5 days from home every 2 weeks) and we are able to stock schools with PPE and have in place protocols. But for August and September they shouldn't do any full school reopenings. I just don't see schools being able to reopen properly during a surge in most areas of the country. It has bad consequences written all over it. I think this is where the federal government's scattered approach is not working. The feds should have mandated basic safety standards and flooded districts with PPE and sanitizing products. But right now there is just scattered guidance and the resources aren't being provided to schools in a timely or effective manner. It just seems like too much of a cluster ***** right now. 1
FireChans Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 30 minutes ago, BUFFALOBART said: ..Just hope some of 'the dozen', aren't your kid(s) More than a hundred kids died of the flu last year. We should have cancelled school years ago.
teef Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 25 minutes ago, GoBills808 said: My wife is due in a couple months. that's awesome! congrats! the reason i ask i because families will have different problems to navigate depending how old the kids are. i have not been cavalier with the virus at all. as some posters know from all the crying i did, my office was shout down for 10 weeks during the quarantine. no earning at all for two and a half months. i'm the primary earner in my house, and i had just opened a building we finished constructing a few months earlier. it was not fun. i say this because i'm still someone who constantly monitors how covid is progressing because there's a chance i could be shut down again. i avoid big crowds, i always wear a mask in public, and we've spent thousands getting my office up to code so we can operate. i can be done. even with this going on, i'm still 100% for the schools reopening, as long as it's done safely. if a child or teacher/staff is not in a medical position to return, there need to be alternatives in place for them. kids learning through zoom was a complete disaster last year. can it be done if it has to? i suppose, but there's no substitute for in class learning. some kids were done in one day what they were supposed to do for the week. i'm sure it will be smoother this semester, but if the numbers support a reopening, there should be an option to go 5 days. if some parents or staff don't want to do that...stay home. an article was posted before about a covid positive child in a daycare. that was my daughter's day care, and according to the department of health, my daughter hugged the covid positive child. straight up hugged her. i was freaking out thinking about my 80 year old parents, would i have to close down again, my nieces and nephews that she had seen, etc. we spoke with the department of health, and kept her away from other kids and adults she had not been into contact with. they wanted me to monitor symptoms, but i did not have to stop work. it was a long two weeks, but fortunately today everyone is fine. my point with all of this is that there will be incidences, but they have to be managed properly like this on was. the world can not stay shut, because we really don't know how long this is going to go on. should it be a free for all? of course not, but if the numbers are kept low, and guidelines are followed, there is no reason to not move forward with life imo.
Big Blitz Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 Just now, MJS said: Wow. They went down because they got hit so hard and now there is a significant portion of the population with antibodies. And now their "memory T Cell" function has been exposed to it to help fight off or even prevent future infection. If my summer studies in physiology and biology are correct.
BullBuchanan Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 2 minutes ago, FireChans said: More than a hundred kids died of the flu last year. We should have cancelled school years ago. I love the smell of logical fallacies. 2
Bill Lewes Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 2 hours ago, plenzmd1 said: Very well sourced and researched article authored by 4 professors at Harvard's School of Public Health PLenty of links to studies to substantiate claims views. May have to copy and paste link in incognito mode to get past paywall https://www.bostonglobe.com/2020/07/20/opinion/listen-science-reopen-schools/ From the Boston Globe opinion piece (to be fair these authors are professors at the Harvard school of public health and, though obvious credible, view the issue though a particular lens): "We are not advocating a return to schools as usual. Schools must aggressively implement proven risk reduction strategies. A layered approach should include rapid testing and contact tracing, physical distancing when possible, mask-wearing with breaks built into the day, frequent hand hygiene, and well-ventilated spaces. Districts should consider adding tents and trailers and converting gyms, cafeteria, and libraries to expand learning spaces. Staggering arrival and dismissal times and prohibiting parents from entering schools will limit one of the highest risks — having large numbers of adults in indoor spaces." Additionally, if you link to the risk reduction strategies you will see a document suggesting exactly what I've been talking about - multiple ideas that are cost or structurally prohibitive that won't receive the necessary funding, community support or professional/political leadership required to implement successfully (please check pg 31 for an example).
FireChans Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 7 minutes ago, BullBuchanan said: I love the smell of logical fallacies. If you're gonna play, "what about the dozen kids" card, then why can't I ask why you were okay with sending your brat to public school as 100-150 kids died of flu every year? What about them?
quinnearlysghost88 Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 The nfl is not happening this year. Go get some good camping gear, buy a nice grill and enjoy your fall Sundays with your family and friends.
PonyBoy Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 4 hours ago, That's No Moon said: Maybe the Marlins won't have enough people to field a team and since there is no minor league baseball this year they can't call up 12 guys to fill the roster. So... You're saying I have a chance? LOL!
BullBuchanan Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 1 minute ago, FireChans said: If you're gonna play, "what about the dozen kids" card, then why can't I ask why you were okay with sending your brat to public school as 100-150 kids died of flu every year? What about them? I don't even have kids and I never will. As a general rule, I don't even like them, but I don't want them to die if it can be prevented.
FireChans Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 (edited) 1 minute ago, BullBuchanan said: I don't even have kids and I never will. As a general rule, I don't even like them, but I don't want them to die if it can be prevented. Well then until we have a cure for the flu, school should be out of the question. Let's start an interest group. Edited July 27, 2020 by FireChans
Billl Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 9 minutes ago, FireChans said: More than a hundred kids died of the flu last year. We should have cancelled school years ago. You understand that comparing what a disease does when there is a lockdown in place versus what a different disease does under normal circumstances is intellectually dishonest, right? If we knew that COVID would cause roughly as many deaths as the flu, I think most people would be okay with opening everything. That just isn’t the case, though. People were comparing this to the flu months ago. The flu kills around 40,000 Americans annually. COVID has quadrupled that in 4 months even with all of the social distancing and other precautions that have been taken. This is nothing like the flu. 8 minutes ago, Bill Lewes said: From the Boston Globe opinion piece (to be fair these authors are professors at the Harvard school of public health and, though obvious credible, view the issue though a particular lens): "We are not advocating a return to schools as usual. Schools must aggressively implement proven risk reduction strategies. A layered approach should include rapid testing and contact tracing, physical distancing when possible, mask-wearing with breaks built into the day, frequent hand hygiene, and well-ventilated spaces. Districts should consider adding tents and trailers and converting gyms, cafeteria, and libraries to expand learning spaces. Staggering arrival and dismissal times and prohibiting parents from entering schools will limit one of the highest risks — having large numbers of adults in indoor spaces." Additionally, if you link to the risk reduction strategies you will see a document suggesting exactly what I've been talking about - multiple ideas that are cost or structurally prohibitive that won't receive the necessary funding, community support or professional/political leadership required to implement successfully (please check pg 31 for an example). Other than that, how was the play, Mrs. Lincoln? 3
FireChans Posted July 27, 2020 Posted July 27, 2020 Just now, Billl said: You understand that comparing what a disease does when there is a lockdown in place versus what a different disease does under normal circumstances is intellectually dishonest, right? If we knew that COVID would cause roughly as many deaths as the flu, I think most people would be okay with opening everything. That just isn’t the case, though. People were comparing this to the flu months ago. The flu kills around 40,000 Americans annually. COVID has quadrupled that in 4 months even with all of the social distancing and other precautions that have been taken. This is nothing like the flu. You're exactly right. The flu has killed way more kids.
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