AirAllenPower Posted August 3, 2020 Posted August 3, 2020 8 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said: Because you are conflating the argument. Louisville was a very pro offense. Allen averages 1 passing attempt more a game than Jackson. you talk about the Bills are slowly developing Allen. How can say the Ravens aren’t doing the same with Lamar, who had worse receivers than Allen did last year? Louisville ran rpo ... again the navy option concept and philosophy. In college when Lamar was forced to throw it was a ***** show. The same thing happened in the NFL. But hes great if they can run. It opens up the passing game Just now, GunnerBill said: Can I just say that calling Greg Roman's offense "the navy option" is incredibly disrespectful? It is one of the cleverest and most complex schemes in the NFL. Does it include some triple option plays? Yep. But the scheme is so much more than that. It's not clever... its literally a navy option mixed with wildcat and rpo. Its unique and effective but has limitations which have been discussed ad nauseam 3 minutes ago, GunnerBill said: Can I just say that calling Greg Roman's offense "the navy option" is incredibly disrespectful? It is one of the cleverest and most complex schemes in the NFL. Does it include some triple option plays? Yep. But the scheme is so much more than that. When piety starts, you're losing the argument
GunnerBill Posted August 3, 2020 Posted August 3, 2020 2 minutes ago, AirAllenPower said: It's not clever... its literally a navy option mixed with wildcat and rpo. Its unique and effective but has limitations which have been discussed ad nauseam Oh it is. If you think that you are wrong. It has the triple option concept but it has a lot else too. It is not "literally" that at all. 1
AirAllenPower Posted August 3, 2020 Posted August 3, 2020 15 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said: Because you are conflating the argument. Louisville was a very pro offense. Allen averages 1 passing attempt more a game than Jackson. you talk about the Bills are slowly developing Allen. How can say the Ravens aren’t doing the same with Lamar, who had worse receivers than Allen did last year? If peyton manning had one more passing attempt than Tommy Frazier , are they the same?
eball Posted August 3, 2020 Posted August 3, 2020 20 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said: He averages less than 200 yards passing. They are trying to hide him. Dude. Get off the sauce. There's a difference between developing a QB and "hiding" him. There isn't a single throw Daboll is afraid to let Josh make. 4
C.Biscuit97 Posted August 3, 2020 Posted August 3, 2020 1 hour ago, eball said: Dude. Get off the sauce. There's a difference between developing a QB and "hiding" him. There isn't a single throw Daboll is afraid to let Josh make. How many games have the Bills won when Josh Allen was the main reason why? Like if you subbed in Andy Dalton, would their record being any different? you are so protective over any criticism of Allen but love to rip MVP qbs. It’s strange. 1
eball Posted August 3, 2020 Posted August 3, 2020 9 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said: How many games have the Bills won when Josh Allen was the main reason why? Like if you subbed in Andy Dalton, would their record being any different? you are so protective over any criticism of Allen but love to rip MVP qbs. It’s strange. You made an asinine statement that the Bills are "hiding" Josh Allen. It's dumb, and you should be called out for it. Remember those 4th quarter comebacks you and others want to ignore? Remember the 4th quarter QB rating? Yeah, the Bills are hiding Josh and won in spite of him. Keep smoking whatever you're smoking, man, because it must be some good stojan. And please also spare us the "I really hope Josh is the man, really I do" crap when all you want to do is keep harping on his lack of dominant college performances as your explanation for why he won't be successful in the NFL. 1
C.Biscuit97 Posted August 3, 2020 Posted August 3, 2020 8 minutes ago, eball said: You made an asinine statement that the Bills are "hiding" Josh Allen. It's dumb, and you should be called out for it. Remember those 4th quarter comebacks you and others want to ignore? Remember the 4th quarter QB rating? Yeah, the Bills are hiding Josh and won in spite of him. Keep smoking whatever you're smoking, man, because it must be some good stojan. And please also spare us the "I really hope Josh is the man, really I do" crap when all you want to do is keep harping on his lack of dominant college performances as your explanation for why he won't be successful in the NFL. Dear lord. You have pathetic standards. Watch other QBs some time. For most qbs, 200 passing yards and 19 points/ game isn’t a celebration. But I have to google Mark Sanchez 4th quarter rating when he had 5 4th qbs comebacks in a season. and maybe if you didn’t slurp him, I would actually like him more. But no one has been consistently wrong than you on this board.
YattaOkasan Posted August 3, 2020 Posted August 3, 2020 23 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said: Dear lord. You have pathetic standards. Watch other QBs some time. For most qbs, 200 passing yards and 19 points/ game isn’t a celebration. But I have to google Mark Sanchez 4th quarter rating when he had 5 4th qbs comebacks in a season. and maybe if you didn’t slurp him, I would actually like him more. But no one has been consistently wrong than you on this board. Current question you're talking about is if they are hiding Allen. I dont think they are, and I dont think those numbers show that they are trying to hide him. I agree those numbers are not cause for celebration. As another poster mentioned his ability to dominate at times is cause for a lot of optimism (its not just the GW drives its all his 4th quarter numbers which are very good). To your point his consistency is a big reason for concern (why he often has to come back). Based on the outside factors (drops, just fewer total throws in his career) I believe he can improve (he also showed he could get better last year). I don't think Lamar has the same success in all systems, but he is very good right now (I was very ok with him at 22 and using that draft capital to get a ton of other good talent). I do question the sustainability of Lamar's success, but unquestionably right now he is elite. 1
Doc Posted August 3, 2020 Posted August 3, 2020 1 hour ago, C.Biscuit97 said: How many games have the Bills won when Josh Allen was the main reason why? Like if you subbed in Andy Dalton, would their record being any different? you are so protective over any criticism of Allen but love to rip MVP qbs. It’s strange. Andy Dalton, who went 2-11 last year? 1
Billl Posted August 3, 2020 Posted August 3, 2020 4 hours ago, AirAllenPower said: He doesn't want to admit Allen runs a passing offense, much of which is based of McDaniels system and Lanar runs a option style offense based off his running talent ( which is smart, Lamar is great in that system) but it reveals the truth about who's learning to play big boy qb , and who's hiding certain limitations passing Jackson completed 265 passes. Allen completed 271.
Billl Posted August 3, 2020 Posted August 3, 2020 3 hours ago, AirAllenPower said: Again if what you're saying true why don't Watson, Allen, and Wilson run the navy option? Are you saying Lamar would suck in Allen's offense? Nobody in the NFL runs anything even remotely close to the Navy offense. There are no similarities between what Baltimore runs and what Navy runs. Navy’s QB threw 85 passes last season and ran 300 times.
eball Posted August 3, 2020 Posted August 3, 2020 1 hour ago, C.Biscuit97 said: Dear lord. You have pathetic standards. Watch other QBs some time. For most qbs, 200 passing yards and 19 points/ game isn’t a celebration. But I have to google Mark Sanchez 4th quarter rating when he had 5 4th qbs comebacks in a season. and maybe if you didn’t slurp him, I would actually like him more. But no one has been consistently wrong than you on this board. You have a problem staying on point.
GoBills808 Posted August 3, 2020 Posted August 3, 2020 15 minutes ago, Billl said: Jackson completed 265 passes. Allen completed 271. An honest evaluation of whether an offense was based more in passing or running would of course use attempts and not completions.
Billl Posted August 3, 2020 Posted August 3, 2020 4 minutes ago, GoBills808 said: An honest evaluation of whether an offense was based more in passing or running would of course use attempts and not completions. I don’t think anyone is saying that Buffalo ran more than Baltimore, but if you want to add the fact that Allen threw 61 more passes than Lamar over the course of the season despite only completing 6 more passes while throwing for fewer yards, that’s fair. I’m not sure that makes Josh look better vis a vis LJ, but whatever. Might as well include Jackson’s league best 36 TDs and only 6 INTs compared to Josh’s 20 and 9 while we're at it. Od all the bizarre narratives I’ve seen from Allen honks the “Jackson’s passing accomplishments should be discounted because he runs so much” is easily tops. There is no QB more dependent on his running production than Allen.
GoBills808 Posted August 3, 2020 Posted August 3, 2020 4 minutes ago, Billl said: I don’t think anyone is saying that Buffalo ran more than Baltimore, but if you want to add the fact that Allen threw 61 more passes than Lamar over the course of the season despite only completing 6 more passes while throwing for fewer yards, that’s fair. I’m not sure that makes Josh look better vis a vis LJ, but whatever. Might as well include Jackson’s league best 36 TDs and only 6 INTs compared to Josh’s 20 and 9 while we're at it. Od all the bizarre narratives I’ve seen from Allen honks the “Jackson’s passing accomplishments should be discounted because he runs so much” is easily tops. There is no QB more dependent on his running production than Allen. Lamar Jackson is more dependent on his running production than Allen. As Bills fans, we have seen a Greg Roman offense that limits the route tree and relies on a high completion percentage. You as a Chiefs fan are probably unaware of the concepts. 61 passes is two games worth of throws. Yes, everyone knows about their respective completion percentages as they've been discussed to death.
thebandit27 Posted August 3, 2020 Posted August 3, 2020 4 minutes ago, GoBills808 said: Lamar Jackson is more dependent on his running production than Allen. As Bills fans, we have seen a Greg Roman offense that limits the route tree and relies on a high completion percentage. You as a Chiefs fan are probably unaware of the concepts. 61 passes is two games worth of throws. Yes, everyone knows about their respective completion percentages as they've been discussed to death. Everyone knows about their respective completion percentages, but what about their respective accuracies? I would wager a nickel or two that very few could tell me how similar their on-target percentages are without looking...moreover, I’d wager a quarter that even fewer could tell me how the two players compared in that metric to 1st ballot HOFers like Brady and Rodgers in 2019...or to, say, Patrick Mahomes.
GoBills808 Posted August 3, 2020 Posted August 3, 2020 1 minute ago, thebandit27 said: Everyone knows about their respective completion percentages, but what about their respective accuracies? I would wager a nickel or two that very few could tell me how similar their on-target percentages are without looking...moreover, I’d wager a quarter that even fewer could tell me how the two players compared in that metric to 1st ballot HOFers like Brady and Rodgers in 2019...or to, say, Patrick Mahomes. I know, of course. I doubt the guy I'm speaking to does, or if he does will endeavor to discount it.
Billl Posted August 4, 2020 Posted August 4, 2020 6 hours ago, GoBills808 said: Lamar Jackson is more dependent on his running production than Allen. As Bills fans, we have seen a Greg Roman offense that limits the route tree and relies on a high completion percentage. You as a Chiefs fan are probably unaware of the concepts. 61 passes is two games worth of throws. Yes, everyone knows about their respective completion percentages as they've been discussed to death. So you’d rather have Josh’s passing numbers than Lamar’s if rushing numbers were equal? 20 TDs and 9 INTs over 38-6?
GoBills808 Posted August 4, 2020 Posted August 4, 2020 1 hour ago, Billl said: So you’d rather have Josh’s passing numbers than Lamar’s if rushing numbers were equal? 20 TDs and 9 INTs over 38-6? Your inability to support your own points is proof enough you aren’t arguing in good faith.
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