transplantbillsfan Posted July 13, 2020 Author Posted July 13, 2020 15 hours ago, Paulus said: That is a ridiculous conclusion. You're just being contrarian. Wattering down a fountain or a fire department. There is just some level of expertise not needed to put out a fire or to read books to kids. At some point 2 discount teachers are far superior than 1 regular priced teacher. Their ceilings are not that high until they teach at college, tbh. Wow you must have had TERRIBLE teachers in grade school! I feel bad for you. All my best teachers were from elementary to High School, not college. That includes the teacher who inspired me to come into the profession. I've seen discount teachers come and go. They get swallowed and eaten up by the demands of the profession and often by the kids they teach themselves. Your extreme ignorance as it relates to the profession is so pathetic I hope all you're doing is playing some ridiculous Persona. If you are, you're doing it well. 15 hours ago, Paulus said: Hiring more will make education worse? Maybe, it'll free current teachers time, so they can do a better job. Further, the vast majority of teachers I have seen are complete boobs. I literally had no idea how utterly moronic grade school teachers were until my little one started school a few years ago. It amazes me how some of them ever got jobs, let alone have the nerve to leave the house. Lastly, if they are already underpaid, then we are not watering down crap, as the free market has already dictated their station. I have no clue what your situation, but 2 things: Sounds like your Confirmation bias of a comparatively minute number of teachers you've interacted with are what you are using as the foundational belief you clearly have of teachers. I will say that in my 16 years of experience teaching it is often the know-it-all parents who view their kids' teachers as "complete boobs" who are the biggest problems for that child and his/her learning. 15 hours ago, Paulus said: Nope, hiring more teachers and capping class sizes, for "Covid" would be great, as people may freak out when they go to lay those teachers off in a year or more. Itll hopefully keep the classroom sizes smaller. Its a classic win, win, win type of scenario. It just won't happen. Not the money to pay for this happening. 1
transplantbillsfan Posted July 13, 2020 Author Posted July 13, 2020 12 hours ago, Joe in Winslow said: Considering you're already paid a twelve month salary for nine months of work, I think we're good. Ummm... No we aren't. This thread is just revealing so much ignorance with regards to teachers it's ridiculous. You brought up one of the most common misconceptions of how we're paid. We're 10 month employees who get paid over a span of 12 months because a percentage of our pay is withheld during the 10 months so we can be paid over the Summer. I've heard of some districts where you have the option to get your full pay through the 10 months, but then you aren't paid through the Summer. There are 12 month employees at schools like Registrars and Librarians who are paid more on the whole because they work 2 extra months, but their wage isn't higher. 1
transplantbillsfan Posted July 13, 2020 Author Posted July 13, 2020 10 hours ago, Chef Jim said: I never said it would be easy. It is complex. Doesn’t mean things can’t be tried. You have an excuse and “we can’t do that” for everything. Have you thought of a solution for ANYTHING? So ***** it. ***** the kids. Sit on your ass until we have a vaccine which could be a long time. At least I’m thinking about solutions. The old saying old goes whether you think you can or can’t you’re right. I’ve not read all your rebuttals so you may have addressed this. But how many hours over the past four months have you spent working on solutions! I was thinking about tents on the fields. Get the communities involved. We can have churches go build schools in poor countries but hwe can’t do anything here?? 10 hours ago, Buffalo Timmy said: I have not read every word of this thread but I went through several of your longer tirades and did not read one suggestion on how to open the school realistically without a huge jump in cost. Also please stop picking on the liberal areas of Florida since they are already our embarrassment. The liberal areas are not capable of social distancing or wearing masks properly, while the rest of the state is doing well. From page 4: On 7/10/2020 at 5:40 PM, transplantbillsfan said: Above my pay grade, but I think what my school is going to do is a good start. Block scheduling where you see 3 periods each day for 80 minutes each. However, only 1/4th of your students come to class in person in order to minimize students on a campus of 2,000+ students and keep students physically apart in the classroom. One day a week (our school chose Wednesday as a day JUST teachers are in the classroo) dedicated solely to distance learning with potentially Individual students coming in for one on one conferences or tutorials. This means I only see my students physically in the classroom once every 2 weeks to start. If that's going well, cut to 50% capacity so you see your students once a week. If that goes well, everyone comes back. I am actually generally okay with that proposal because I understand the circumstances. A number of my coworkers have serious issues about being in the classroom at all. I completely understand their stances even if it's not my personal position. 4 hours ago, Chef Jim said: "You people"? Interesting choice of words. Every household has someone to stay home to take care of the kids during the day too right? Virtual learning is REAL difficult. You're right. You idiots probably would have been more appropriate 1
transplantbillsfan Posted July 13, 2020 Author Posted July 13, 2020 4 hours ago, Penfield45 said: why do you people always have to take things to such extremes? no one is saying this we can open schools 25% capacity and do virtual learning for the first half of the school year. every household has at least 1 smartphone or computer. virtual learning is not difficult Yep. This is exactly what our school is doing. And we'll progress to 50% capacity if it's possible and so on. And our state opens the public school system in 3 weeks. We're the test subjects. 1
leh-nerd skin-erd Posted July 14, 2020 Posted July 14, 2020 13 minutes ago, transplantbillsfan said: Wow you must have had TERRIBLE teachers in grade school! I feel bad for you. All my best teachers were from elementary to High School, not college. That includes the teacher who inspired me to come into the profession. I've seen discount teachers come and go. They get swallowed and eaten up by the demands of the profession and often by the kids they teach themselves. Your extreme ignorance as it relates to the profession is so pathetic I hope all you're doing is playing some ridiculous Persona. If you are, you're doing it well. I have no clue what your situation, but 2 things: Sounds like your Confirmation bias of a comparatively minute number of teachers you've interacted with are what you are using as the foundational belief you clearly have of teachers. I will say that in my 16 years of experience teaching it is often the know-it-all parents who view their kids' teachers as "complete boobs" who are the biggest problems for that child and his/her learning. It just won't happen. Not the money to pay for this happening. You really have some issues with parents, Transpy. Between that and the “glorified babysitter” issue I really wonder how you’re coming off to parents. I think part of the challenge is that you view your commitment to teaching as your noble calling. I can respect that, and if you had a teacher who inspired you to pursue your passion, that’s awesome. I had some great teachers, some not so great ones and many sorta in the middle. The biggest impact in my life was from the coach of one of our sports teams, a good guy who cared an awful lot about the kids and doing the right thing. Though many years later we found out that one of his associates was messing around with at least a couple students, and you have to wonder how he let that happen if he knew. The rumor always circulated about the bad coach, and my family is large so we can look at the same rumor over a decade plus. Many people probably view it more as a vendor/service model, where they pay xxx and the school is expected to deliver yyy. NY specific—-When you factor in mandatory participation for life (or as long as you own your home), the perception that the cost is unreasonably high, the budgeting model murky at best, and the impression that teachers make substantial money with cradle to grave entitlements, why would you think your consumer would not expect or demand an exceptional product? I’ve come to the conclusion that education is just another corporate model. There are winners and losers. If your child is lucky enough to have a series of Transpy or Buffalo T type teachers, maybe you view it as worthwhile cost. If not, if your child experiences apathetic teachers, or teachers who aren’t organized or otherwise very effective, you probably think it’s substantially overpriced. At the end of the day, teachers protect teachers and operate in their best interest more often than not. That’s understandable, but let’s not kid ourselves that part of the allure for many teachers is stable employment, good pay, good benefits and (in NY), a very generous pension that is offered far, far too early to make any reasonable sense to those outside who help to fund it. A few years ago, our district was appealing for 4 additional ‘English as a second language’ teachers. I understand that you may think there is value there, I personally did not. A couple years ago, our district was looking at a $44,000,000 bond (on top of the $110,0000,000 annual budget) to upgrade facilities, new roofing on a couple of the buildings, a new computer lab so we could be “state of the art”, etc. However, the actual need was for $35,000,0000....the other $9m was a fudge factor “just in case”. Interestingly, the plan was for the district to just use the extra $9,000,000 for whatevs the district decided in the likely event it was not needed. The bond was rejected, the superintendent sent out an email complaining about the last minute disinformation campaign that mischaracterized the slush fund. IMO, it’s that type of institutional arrogance (admin, not teacher) that drives some of the push-back you likely receive. As @Chef Jimboyardee stated earlier, for most of us, push back is just another day at the office. Btw, again, NY Specific...I’m wondering what is going to happen to the $$$$ allocated to services and busing that obviously have not been used. According to our superintendent, facilities costs/busing are a HUGE cost to the taxpayer. That money should be refunded, or at least a detailed accounting should take place so it doesn’t disappear into the netherworld, like the $9m that was going to be gobbled up. In the end, don’t take it so personally. 1
Chef Jim Posted July 14, 2020 Posted July 14, 2020 1 hour ago, transplantbillsfan said: Well I've learned a lot about you in our dialogue in this thread. Unfortunately, none of it is good. Why use this comment of mine to give this reply. Do you not agree with my assessment of why she died?
B-Man Posted July 14, 2020 Posted July 14, 2020 Back to the thread...................... MSNBC Clip: But remember the NARRATIVE.............This is ALL about Trump sending kids to their death just for him. . 2 1 1
Paulus Posted July 14, 2020 Posted July 14, 2020 57 minutes ago, transplantbillsfan said: Wow you must have had TERRIBLE teachers in grade school! I feel bad for you. All my best teachers were from elementary to High School, not college. That includes the teacher who inspired me to come into the profession. I've seen discount teachers come and go. They get swallowed and eaten up by the demands of the profession and often by the kids they teach themselves. Your extreme ignorance as it relates to the profession is so pathetic I hope all you're doing is playing some ridiculous Persona. If you are, you're doing it well. I have no clue what your situation, but 2 things: Sounds like your Confirmation bias of a comparatively minute number of teachers you've interacted with are what you are using as the foundational belief you clearly have of teachers. I will say that in my 16 years of experience teaching it is often the know-it-all parents who view their kids' teachers as "complete boobs" who are the biggest problems for that child and his/her learning. It just won't happen. Not the money to pay for this happening. Yeah, I get you. No bias from you... Smaller classroom sizes are what I want, as they have already pinched more than they can chew where mine goes. Making it worse are the CA teachers unions who literally defended a teacher who fed ***** to his students. Nah, they don't get a pass from me. They are usually pretty disgustingly lazy people, who are given their jobs because they can serve no other purpose for society. There are some good ones mixed in there but the majority are parasitic turds who know they can't be fired. At least here in CA. If you're relying on the state to teach your children, in this day and age, you're a boob.
Orlando Buffalo Posted July 14, 2020 Posted July 14, 2020 55 minutes ago, transplantbillsfan said: From page 4: You're right. You idiots probably would have been more appropriate I am sorry but seeing students once every two weeks in class is not similar to everyday. Seeing them once a week like your phase 2 is not similar to everyday. In order to get to your phase 3 it will be sometime. We will not see eye to eye on this and I accept that, but your standard for class and mine are not similar.
Cinga Posted July 14, 2020 Posted July 14, 2020 2 hours ago, transplantbillsfan said: Ummm... No we aren't. This thread is just revealing so much ignorance with regards to teachers it's ridiculous. You brought up one of the most common misconceptions of how we're paid. We're 10 month employees who get paid over a span of 12 months because a percentage of our pay is withheld during the 10 months so we can be paid over the Summer. I've heard of some districts where you have the option to get your full pay through the 10 months, but then you aren't paid through the Summer. There are 12 month employees at schools like Registrars and Librarians who are paid more on the whole because they work 2 extra months, but their wage isn't higher. I'm calling bullschiff on this. If you are only paid for 10 months, you would then qualify for unemployment for the other 2 months. Do you keep your benefits during those 2 months? Does your healthcare switch to Cobra automatically and then back?
Cinga Posted July 14, 2020 Posted July 14, 2020 Don't think this has been posted yet: German study finds no evidence coronavirus spreads in schools Quote The study, the largest carried out on schoolchildren and teachers in Germany, found traces of the virus in fewer than 1 per cent of teachers and children. Scientists from Dresden Technical University said they believe children may act as a “brake” on chains of infection. Prof Reinhard Berner, the head of pediatric medicine at Dresden University Hospital and leader of the study, said the results suggested the virus does not spread easily in schools. “It is rather the opposite,” Prof Berner told a press conference. “Children act more as a brake on infection. Not every infection that reaches them is passed on.” 1 1
transplantbillsfan Posted July 14, 2020 Author Posted July 14, 2020 (edited) 6 hours ago, Chef Jim said: Quit your whining. Every other industry in the country has figured these things out. Our HR has spent hundreds of hours on this. I was getting emails from my HR director at 9pm and I know she was in when I get in at 7am. Schools have their unique challenges but it's times like these that the cream rises and these things get worked on and figured out. You on the other hand likely will hide under your desk and whimper like a baby. No every other industry HASN'T figured these things out, hence the explosion in cases across the country and some of these industries on the brink of a 2nd shutdown. Edited July 14, 2020 by transplantbillsfan 1
transplantbillsfan Posted July 14, 2020 Author Posted July 14, 2020 (edited) 6 hours ago, Chef Jim said: No it's easy to say when lots have already figured it out. The fact I have not kids has nothing to do with it. You whine about the poor teachers. When restaurants opened back up do you have any clue as to how many people come through a restaurant door. The staff was dying to get back to work and they came back. Grocery store workers NEVER stopped working. The workers at the gym bust their backs keeping it clean and monitoring to make sure we all have masks on the whole time. I already told you what I do. I'm a manager. I'm a problem solver who despises the excuse makers of the world. It's hard. I get it. But I thrive on that *****. We all had 100's of questions. We worked tirelessly to come up with answers. The game changes almost every wee so we have to adapt. Some of the teachers here and the other whiners on the board aren't even trying to work it out. If you took the time you'd have an answer for almost every question you posed above. Here I have a question for you because maybe I've misread you and we've been arguing about something we actually agree on. I really think deep down you understand that teachers working 17 hour days with ALL students in a school coming in at staggered times each an every day isn't feasible, isn't fair, and just plain isn't happening, so: Do you believe the only answer is to get ALL students back on campus each and every day for full, in-person instruction? Edited July 14, 2020 by transplantbillsfan 1
transplantbillsfan Posted July 14, 2020 Author Posted July 14, 2020 4 hours ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: You really have some issues with parents, Transpy. Between that and the “glorified babysitter” issue I really wonder how you’re coming off to parents. Don't worry. Good Teacher = Good Actor I'm a good teacher. Parents like me. Even the ones who annoy the hell outta me. 4 hours ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: I think part of the challenge is that you view your commitment to teaching as your noble calling. I can respect that, and if you had a teacher who inspired you to pursue your passion, that’s awesome. I had some great teachers, some not so great ones and many sorta in the middle. The biggest impact in my life was from the coach of one of our sports teams, a good guy who cared an awful lot about the kids and doing the right thing. Though many years later we found out that one of his associates was messing around with at least a couple students, and you have to wonder how he let that happen if he knew. The rumor always circulated about the bad coach, and my family is large so we can look at the same rumor over a decade plus. Not a clue what you're trying to accomplish saying this. Are you seriously trying to accuse me of messing around with students? Seems to be your implication otherwise I don't see the point of you tossing this word salad my way. 4 hours ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: Many people probably view it more as a vendor/service model, where they pay xxx and the school is expected to deliver yyy. NY specific—-When you factor in mandatory participation for life (or as long as you own your home), the perception that the cost is unreasonably high, the budgeting model murky at best, and the impression that teachers make substantial money with cradle to grave entitlements, why would you think your consumer would not expect or demand an exceptional product? You're going to have to explain this to me because I don't get what you're saying. Now teachers make substantial money with cradle to grave entitlements? How does this fit in with any overall point? 4 hours ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: I’ve come to the conclusion that education is just another corporate model. There are winners and losers. If your child is lucky enough to have a series of Transpy or Buffalo T type teachers, maybe you view it as worthwhile cost. If not, if your child experiences apathetic teachers, or teachers who aren’t organized or otherwise very effective, you probably think it’s substantially overpriced. At the end of the day, teachers protect teachers and operate in their best interest more often than not. That’s understandable, but let’s not kid ourselves that part of the allure for many teachers is stable employment, good pay, good benefits and (in NY), a very generous pension that is offered far, far too early to make any reasonable sense to those outside who help to fund it. So first of all, I don't have a clue to any of your NY references to teachers because that's not where I teach. But I do believe overall, as a whole, you get what you pay for. I will reveal more about myself by saying I graduated from one of the best High Schools in the region in the 90s: Webster High School. I really did have mostly excellent teachers. My Wind Ensemble (band) teacher was old and nearly retiring and I know she was making 6 figures. We were one of the better schools academically--public, charter or private. I teach in Hawai'i and we max out at a salary somewhere around $90,000 at this point. That might sound like a lot to you. If it does, you haven't been to Hawai'i, and more specifically, O'ahu. We don't have one of the best public school systems in the country. We're closer to the bottom than the top. Now I was fortunate enough to somehow be hired to a fantastic public school in the state that consistently ranks as the #1 or #2 public High School every year, but that was luck. We have a siphoning faculty where approaching half of it rotates in and out because our district has a military base we serve and so a lot of military spouses come to our school for 3 year stints. Other schools aren't nearly as lucky and suffer because they can't draw more teachers in. That felt unnecessarily revealing. 4 hours ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: A few years ago, our district was appealing for 4 additional ‘English as a second language’ teachers. I understand that you may think there is value there, I personally did not. A couple years ago, our district was looking at a $44,000,000 bond (on top of the $110,0000,000 annual budget) to upgrade facilities, new roofing on a couple of the buildings, a new computer lab so we could be “state of the art”, etc. However, the actual need was for $35,000,0000....the other $9m was a fudge factor “just in case”. Interestingly, the plan was for the district to just use the extra $9,000,000 for whatevs the district decided in the likely event it was not needed. The bond was rejected, the superintendent sent out an email complaining about the last minute disinformation campaign that mischaracterized the slush fund. IMO, it’s that type of institutional arrogance (admin, not teacher) that drives some of the push-back you likely receive. As @Chef Jimboyardee stated earlier, for most of us, push back is just another day at the office. We're teachers not Administration. I would NEVER want to be an Administrator of any sorts, period. If people hate teachers because of poor Administrations or Adminisrative choices, I view that as an unfair correlation. I don't know how many ESL students you have, but living in Hawai'i I see them all the time. I think those teachers can be unbelievably valuable to helping students assimilate rapidly into our country and culture by becoming extremely comfortable with the language. I've had students who were ESL I never would have guessed because they so quickly became fluent. If there are a lot of ESL students in your area and you value assimilating immigrants into our language and culture, ESL teachers are incredibly valuable. 4 hours ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: Btw, again, NY Specific...I’m wondering what is going to happen to the $$$$ allocated to services and busing that obviously have not been used. According to our superintendent, facilities costs/busing are a HUGE cost to the taxpayer. That money should be refunded, or at least a detailed accounting should take place so it doesn’t disappear into the netherworld, like the $9m that was going to be gobbled up. In the end, don’t take it so personally. I don't disagree that money should be accounted for or allocated towards things like devices for distance learning in the Fall. I don't know why you think I take anything here personally. I don't. 1
transplantbillsfan Posted July 14, 2020 Author Posted July 14, 2020 4 hours ago, Buffalo Timmy said: I am sorry but seeing students once every two weeks in class is not similar to everyday. Seeing them once a week like your phase 2 is not similar to everyday. In order to get to your phase 3 it will be sometime. We will not see eye to eye on this and I accept that, but your standard for class and mine are not similar. Get over yourself. My standards for my class are VERY different from what I view necessarily happening as a result of this Pandemic, at least to begin the school year. And I don't see my students every day in a NORMAL year. It's 3 times a week in a 5 day week and 2 times a week in a 4 day holiday week. You seem to be at an alternative High School where you see your kids every day. Most schools aren't like that. 1
transplantbillsfan Posted July 14, 2020 Author Posted July 14, 2020 (edited) 3 hours ago, Cinga said: I'm calling bullschiff on this. If you are only paid for 10 months, you would then qualify for unemployment for the other 2 months. Do you keep your benefits during those 2 months? Does your healthcare switch to Cobra automatically and then back? Then why does our state's pay scale have "10 Month Employee" and "12 Month Employee" separately? Look it up bro it's easy for you to find for almost any state. Don't be lazy and make a baseless accusation without even an attempt to gain some knowledge. Teachers are 10 month employees. I don't have answers to all your questions. I'm a teacher, not an unemployment expert. But if you're smelling bullschiff maybe it's because you just schiffed your pants. Edited July 14, 2020 by transplantbillsfan 1
Chef Jim Posted July 14, 2020 Posted July 14, 2020 8 hours ago, transplantbillsfan said: No every other industry HASN'T figured these things out, hence the explosion in cases across the country and some of these industries on the brink of a 2nd shutdown. They have figured out how to get back to work. Please post a link showing that the explosion of cases have originated from places of employment.
GOBUFFALO716 Posted July 14, 2020 Posted July 14, 2020 6 minutes ago, Chef Jim said: They have figured out how to get back to work. Please post a link showing that the explosion of cases have originated from places of employment. Tuna And Jell-O Pie There are certain things that just are not supposed to be together, and the tuna-gelatin combination here is one of these unholy pairings. This gnarly pie somehow won a Betty Crocker cooking contest in 1956, and features a pie base that is basically lemon jello mixed with tomato sauce, vinegar, onion, celery, and spices. To ensure that you get sick after your meal, the recipe calls for a healthy dollop of tuna on top. Writers of the 1965 version of Betty Crocker's Dinner in A Dish called it, "pretty as can be." Yeah, no. This thing looks unnatural and would probably make aliens afraid of us.
Chef Jim Posted July 14, 2020 Posted July 14, 2020 8 hours ago, transplantbillsfan said: Here I have a question for you because maybe I've misread you and we've been arguing about something we actually agree on. I really think deep down you understand that teachers working 17 hour days with ALL students in a school coming in at staggered times each an every day isn't feasible, isn't fair, and just plain isn't happening, so: Do you believe the only answer is to get ALL students back on campus each and every day for full, in-person instruction? Please point out where I said 17 hours a day. I didn’t and sorry asking you to work longer than usual hours isn’t fair. How many hours have you worked since March! How many hours do you work during the months is June and July? Life isn’t fair sometimes. During times like this many of us are asked to go way above and beyond. The answer to your question is yes! Maybe 6x12’s is not the answer but I feel the answer is there. Tents in the athletic fields/parking lots. Reach out to FEMA for trailers. Reach out to local RV stores to borrow RV’s. Have the community build makeshift structures. I’ve thrown out lots of ideas and every one of them has been met with a “we can’t do that!!” I don’t read all your rants but I haven’t seen you say how much time you and your other teachers/administrators/community leaders have spent working on solutions. How much time have you spent on it. Sounds like I have more than you.
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