Buffalo716 Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 Just now, Putin said: 75 years of planning staying under the radar just went out the toilet ? oy vay zmir There's always 2125 ?? 1
2ForMacAdoo Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 3 hours ago, The Wiz said: OJ Simpson... Not a jew! But guess who is hall of famer Rod Carew. One of the greatest SNL skits of all time. They compiled a book of "Great Jewish athletes". The book was all of two pages long: Rod Carew (a converted Jew through marriage) and Sandy Koufax! Classic.
Stank_Nasty Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 (edited) 6 minutes ago, GoBills808 said: I mostly agree, the caveat being the expectation that various racial groups are as attuned to the issues pertaining to others as their own is frankly unrealistic. If they seriously expect others to educate themselves and speak up for their cause then it needs to be realistic that others can expect the same from them. That seems fairly cut and dry. personally I’ll go about it just trying to be a decent human doing my part here in rural America and wont try to label anyone that may not be comfortable being as vocal about it. Im gonna give Jackson the benefit of the doubt because that’s just me I suppose. It seems like an ill-Informed mistake. But I’m not gonna ignore the obvious hypocrisy that comes with the silence from plenty of vocal figures/athletes. Edited July 8, 2020 by Stank_Nasty 1
Doc Brown Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 22 minutes ago, Putin said: No the fact is he’s BOTH , but probably MORE of the later You're pry right. I just wanted to slip the words my struggle into this thread.
Wizard Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 Certain individuals with specific backgrounds are allowed to say/do things that other people can't at this time. It has happened, currently does, and it will happen throughout history. Right now, people with social media accounts, football fame, money and look like DeSean Jackson are in that category. He is "woke" which translates to "I can say whatever I want." In 15 years, it will be another group, race, philisophy, or a different wealthy group that will be next. 1
Buffalo716 Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 (edited) 4 minutes ago, 2ForMacAdoo said: One of the greatest SNL skits of all time. They compiled a book of "Great Jewish athletes". The book was all of two pages long: Rod Carew (a converted Jew through marriage) and Sandy Koufax! Classic. Koufax didn't pitch game 1 of the world series during Yom Kippur! Balls.. HUGE Edited July 8, 2020 by Buffalo716
GoBills808 Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 Just now, Stank_Nasty said: If they seriously expect others to educate themselves and speak up for their cause then it needs to be realistic that others can expect the same from them. That seems fairly cut and dry. personally I’ll go about it just trying to be a decent human doing my part here in rural America and wont try to label anyone that may not be comfortable being as vocal about it. I think separating the reactionaries from the people we should be focusing on would be a decent start. I like White as a person and a Bill but I don’t expect him to deliver a nuanced take on race relations. I would be interested in Kaepernick’s reaction tbh 3
Putin Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 (edited) 20 minutes ago, GoBills808 said: I think separating the reactionaries from the people we should be focusing on would be a decent start. I like White as a person and a Bill but I don’t expect him to deliver a nuanced take on race relations. I would be interested in Kaepernick’s reaction tbh Kaep is busy saving the children from the sweatshops in China , but I’m sure will hear from him as soon as all the children are safe !! Edited July 8, 2020 by Putin 2
HappyDays Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 He posted a book passage that literally ends with "Hitler was right." What is happening here? He should definitely be cut. Very bizarre.
HardyBoy Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 2 hours ago, Coach Tuesday said: This is a very uninformed, negligent take. That said, the Black community has a troubling history of anti-Semitism and homophobia. It’s a fair criticism of the Left that it tends to have a real blind spot for these issues. But it’s a really weak take to suggest that the entire anti-racist movement is somehow delegitimized because one Black dude said something bigoted. Also, as a Jew, while his statements piss me off, I find them so insane that I can’t get too worked up about them. The whole thing sounds mental. Yeah, so this is long and a bit meta...I feel the same way btw on it not really getting me worked up because it's just so far out there and has me concerned he is having mental issues. Here's the long part: I wonder how much of this also plays into him being a minority and really not having that much actual agency to cause impacts. It honestly might be proving we have systemic racism. I promise I'm not trying to bend over backwards to make this about him actually being the victim here, it's just that what he said is so universally agreed on as being ridiculous that people aren't going to start a fight with each other on it, and that is what I find super interesting. So think of any statement as a ball, and the nature of the words describe the size of that ball. Totally neutral words/statements are tiny, say golf ball size for this example, and really powerful words/statements are huge, say a big beach ball. How much impact that ball has when it hits something is not described by the size of the ball alone...just like a single person screaming vile words in a room alone has no impact, the size of an individuals reach matters a ton, and in my example is how hard/dense the ball is. It is the difference between being hit by a hard baseball and a soft baseball...same words, same size ball, but because one has few people that will not just be able to hear the words, but also take action on those words (and the key is those people's actions will have actual impact). Compare that to someone who says the same words, but the people listening actually have the agency to make things happen. For example, if I'm calling on people to protest with social disobedience by walking on a highway to disrupt traffic and I have a reach of 10,000 who are super commited, but they are all in their 90s and in wheelchairs, I have a lot of reach, but ultimately those people have little agency. On the other hand, if someone else only has 100 people who listen, but they are both willing and able to walk on a highway, well you can close a highway with that reach, even though it is much less substantial (so I guess size of the ball is a factor of how powerful the words are and reach multiplied by agency, which gives you density). What I'm trying to say, first the words Jackson is saying are so out there that the people he is reaching with those words are really small, and the agency of the people who he is able to reach is small (would have to think you are in pretty rough financial shape if that type of scapegoating connects with you enough to take action, and money is power in our society). Brees on the other hand, the people resonating with what he said actually have true power (and I'm not looking to judge what he said, I have a personal opinion, but I'm focusing on the conceptual basis of why we might not be seeing the same level of pushback). The President of the United States might retweet what Brees said for crying outloud (that softball of saying he might retweet Jackson's tweet as well is so tempting as a joke, but I'll just tease it, because genuinely not looking to make this specific post about the validity of what people are saying, just why there might be more pushback based on the agency of the people that are impacted by the words). There are a lot of very powerful, extremely rich people who agree with Brees, so his words while having less size (using what you think is Hitler is way way bigger than words about the flag...and not saying what Brees said is positive or negative...size is not a factor of positive or negative, because I think the size of the words are equal regardless of the perspective of if they are seen as positive or negative by different groups, and that could be super interesting to see if words have the same size for people looking at it from different perspectives...would think equal sized balls on both sides lol, of an argument would magnify the reach), have more impact...the ball Brees' words generate is smaller, but so much more dense...like getting hit by a basketball vs a lacrosse ball going at the same speed. Anyway, that's my theory of why what Jackson said isn't getting more traction. The people who are reached by the words and moved to take action do not have the agency to really make any change, so it is ignored. I would imagine the majority of people who would be in that group are of lower socio-economic status, and likely black (admittedly assuming here), and poor black people have some of the lowest amount of agency in the country I would expect, which is exactly the reason for the fight to end systemic racism, because this should be a huge deal, but in my mind it is the lack of power the people listening to that message have is not a threat to enough people...wild, isn't that kind of the thing the Black Panthers and Malcolm X were saying and the reason for open carrying as a means of peaceful, though adversarial, protest? So I actually came up with a lot of that theory solving stuff in Excel and seeing a common concept in how I was solving increasingly complex problems and using that concepts to solve problems I couldn't solve in the past. I'm starting to take a graph theory course online too, because while I stumbled on it on my own, I think there is basically a whole wing of math dedicated to it. 1 1
Hapless Bills Fan Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 55 minutes ago, Stank_Nasty said: If they seriously expect others to educate themselves and speak up for their cause then it needs to be realistic that others can expect the same from them. That seems fairly cut and dry. There's the point of current scope/impact? If a Jewish person were filmed with an antisemite cop kneeling on his neck for 8 minutes 40 seconds, I absolutely think it's reasonable to expect people who want justice for themselves and theirs to speak out against it. But is that happening somewhere now and I missed it? I don't think it's reasonable to expect someone to follow the random words of every person (or even every football player) who shares their race and speak out against everything despicable that comes out on social media. Quote personally I’ll go about it just trying to be a decent human doing my part here in rural America and wont try to label anyone that may not be comfortable being as vocal about it. Im gonna give Jackson the benefit of the doubt because that’s just me I suppose. It seems like an ill-Informed mistake. But I’m not gonna ignore the obvious hypocrisy that comes with the silence from plenty of vocal figures/athletes. We agree completely on the first. I'm willing to wait and see if Jackson's apology is sincere and will be backed by actions. Where we disagree is whether silence = "obvious hypocrisy." I think it's a form of "whataboutism" type response - if you object to A, whatabout B? you're a hypocrite unless you speak out against instances of (whatever litmus test someone derives). It seems to me it's typically very inconsistently applied. Apparently some people and causes merit agency in choosing what and when they'll speak out, while others get told they're hypocrites if they speak out about one thing and not another. Well ***** that and the horse it rode in on. 3 1
2ForMacAdoo Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 30 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said: Koufax didn't pitch game 1 of the world series during Yom Kippur! Balls.. HUGE Or as "Feel the Burn" Bernie would say: "YUUUUGE"
KD in CA Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 3 hours ago, thebandit27 said: Well, ESPN’s Matthew Berry and former NFLer turned podcaster Geoff Schwartz have more or less put NFL players on blast regarding Jackson’s post. Safe to say that Jews across the NFL world are watching and taking note of whether the players mean what they say. My guess is that Jews have long since gotten used to no one doing anything about this type of stuff. Career ending if you say it about certain groups, virtually ignored if you say it about Jews. Jackson cut? Don't make me laugh. 1
Hapless Bills Fan Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 Apparently the NFL has spoken, condemning the posts: https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/29422431/eagles-desean-jackson-says-hate-jewish-community-posting-anti-semitic-messages The NFL released a statement Tuesday calling Jackson's comments "highly inappropriate, offensive and divisive" and saying they "stand in stark contrast to the NFL's values of respect, equality and inclusion." The league said it has been in contact with the Eagles on the matter. 1
Buffalo716 Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 (edited) 25 minutes ago, 2ForMacAdoo said: Or as "Feel the Burn" Bernie would say: "YUUUUGE" I thought that was Billy fucillo ? Lol Edited July 8, 2020 by Buffalo716
HardyBoy Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 1 minute ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Apparently the NFL has spoken, condemning the posts: https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/29422431/eagles-desean-jackson-says-hate-jewish-community-posting-anti-semitic-messages The NFL released a statement Tuesday calling Jackson's comments "highly inappropriate, offensive and divisive" and saying they "stand in stark contrast to the NFL's values of respect, equality and inclusion." The league said it has been in contact with the Eagles on the matter. Yeah, so this seems like it is already in exponetial growth, just in the early phases so far. This statement from the nfl is going to give it a ton of visibility to people outside the football world.
Call_Of_Ktulu Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 Just because Brees doesn’t kneel does not mean he is racist. Brees has helped so many people in New Orleans and he didn’t do it because of someone’s skin color. Brees helped his community through action, action that really helped thousands of people. Actions that speak way louder than any words. Brees feels a certain way about how you should respect the flag just like Kim Pegula will not kneel because of how she respects the flag. Twitter and social media like it make me sick. 3
Putin Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 2 minutes ago, Call_Of_Ktulu said: Just because Brees doesn’t kneel does not mean he is racist. Brees has helped so many people in New Orleans and he didn’t do it because of someone’s skin color. Brees helped his community through action, action that really helped thousands of people. Actions that speak way louder than any words. Brees feels a certain way about how you should respect the flag just like Kim Pegula will not kneel because of how she respects the flag. Twitter and social media like it make me sick. WELL SAID !!!!
KD in CA Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 12 minutes ago, HardyBoy said: Yeah, so this seems like it is already in exponetial growth, just in the early phases so far. This statement from the nfl is going to give it a ton of visibility to people outside the football world. Hardly....the statement is more like a way to close the book on it.
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