Dr.Sack Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 (edited) Josh Allen is either going to improve, regress or flatline. Long term he only sticks around if he improves. As a betting man I say there’s a greater chance he continues the upward trajectory. The year 1 to year 2 jump was notable. Allen seemed more poised and confident operating in the pocket. The next step in his evolution is harnessing his rocket arm and connecting more on deep balls, while taking the Brady approach and carving teams up by taking what the defense gives him. Allen has the size, arm talent and brains to succeed. Things should continue to slow down, and process faster. Expect to see another big jump. Edited July 8, 2020 by Dr.Sack
eball Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 6 minutes ago, Dr.Sack said: Josh Allen is either going to improve, regress or flatline. Long term he only sticks around if he improves. As a betting man I say there’s a greater chance he continues the upward trajectory. The year 1 to year 2 jump was notable. Allen seemed more poised and confident operating in the pocket. The next step in his evolution is harnessing his rocket arm and connecting more on deep balls, while taking the Brady approach and carving teams up by taking what the defense gives him. Allen has the size, arm talent and brains to succeed. Things should continue to slow down, and process faster. Expect to see another big jump. I don't understand why more "expert" prognostications don't follow this line of thinking. It's logical. Nothing about Allen suggests he has "reached his peak" or will regress. Nothing. 1 1
C.Biscuit97 Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 2 minutes ago, eball said: I don't understand why more "expert" prognostications don't follow this line of thinking. It's logical. Nothing about Allen suggests he has "reached his peak" or will regress. Nothing. I will say this with all respect and it’s been my concern all along. When has Allen ever been a dominant player on any level of football? We are expecting a guy playing the hardest position in professional sports to reach a level in the Nfl that he has never reached in the MWC, Junior college, or high school? If you are a dominant college player, it means nothing for nfl success. However how many qbs, who didn’t make 1st or 2nd team in a low level college conference, have ever become nfl stars? Honestly, can anyone name one? Tony Romo was player of the year. Jimmy G was too and broke Romo’s records. Wentz won a national championship. I really do like Allen’s attitude. But he will be the exception to every rule if he becomes a franchise guy.
eball Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 7 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said: I will say this with all respect and it’s been my concern all along. When has Allen ever been a dominant player on any level of football? We are expecting a guy playing the hardest position in professional sports to reach a level in the Nfl that he has never reached in the MWC, Junior college, or high school? If you are a dominant college player, it means nothing for nfl success. However how many qbs, who didn’t make 1st or 2nd team in a low level college conference, have ever become nfl stars? Honestly, can anyone name one? Tony Romo was player of the year. Jimmy G was too and broke Romo’s records. Wentz won a national championship. I really do like Allen’s attitude. But he will be the exception to every rule if he becomes a franchise guy. Ok, here we go again. Tell me why, based upon what you've seen from Allen, that you believe he has reached his peak as an NFL QB. I don't care what his college stats were or what QBs before him did. Those stats are irrelevant. What have you seen that tells you he won't continue to get better?
C.Biscuit97 Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 4 minutes ago, eball said: Ok, here we go again. Tell me why, based upon what you've seen from Allen, that you believe he has reached his peak as an NFL QB. I don't care what his college stats were or what QBs before him did. Those stats are irrelevant. What have you seen that tells you he won't continue to get better? Why didn’t Losman get better? Why didn’t EJ? Why didn’t Tribusky? Why didn’t a million other guys? If you bet on things, you try to make the safest bets possible. With respect, answer my question. What qb had a worse college resume of a 1st round draft pick than Allen did (in the last 7 years because football is completely different now)? Honestly, I can’t think of one. My concern since he was drafted was we want him to be a better player in the nfl than in the MWC. That seems an extremely risky bet. Imo, the team is good enough that we made the playoffs with C level qb play. I don’t want C level qb play from the highest drafted qb in franchise history. this year, hopefully, I don’t want to hear about 4th quarter comebacks. I want Allen to light it up in the first 3 quarters so it’s a blowout in the 4th.
eball Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 @C.Biscuit97 why are you hung up on what Allen did in college and not staying on point with what he has done most recently? I don't understand this logic at all. He improved significantly from Y1 to Y2 in the NFL and, again, everything logical suggests he is on an upward climb. We're not talking about somebody with questionable skills or athletic traits that we're hoping somehow makes it. We're talking about a guy who was raw out of college with insane talent and a great work ethic simply continuing to improve. That's a "risky" bet?
loyal2dagame Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 1 hour ago, eball said: Ok, here we go again. Tell me why, based upon what you've seen from Allen, that you believe he has reached his peak as an NFL QB. I don't care what his college stats were or what QBs before him did. Those stats are irrelevant. What have you seen that tells you he won't continue to get better? 1 hour ago, C.Biscuit97 said: Why didn’t Losman get better? Why didn’t EJ? Why didn’t Tribusky? Why didn’t a million other guys? If you bet on things, you try to make the safest bets possible. With respect, answer my question. What qb had a worse college resume of a 1st round draft pick than Allen did (in the last 7 years because football is completely different now)? Honestly, I can’t think of one. My concern since he was drafted was we want him to be a better player in the nfl than in the MWC. That seems an extremely risky bet. Imo, the team is good enough that we made the playoffs with C level qb play. I don’t want C level qb play from the highest drafted qb in franchise history. this year, hopefully, I don’t want to hear about 4th quarter comebacks. I want Allen to light it up in the first 3 quarters so it’s a blowout in the 4th. One thing I'll give to Biscuit, he's been sticking to his guns on Allen for quite a while. While i don't agree with him at all, and hope he's the one with the egg on his face, he hasn't waivered.......
C.Biscuit97 Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 6 minutes ago, loyal2dagame said: One thing I'll give to Biscuit, he's been sticking to his guns on Allen for quite a while. While i don't agree with him at all, and hope he's the one with the egg on his face, he hasn't waivered....... I hope I have egg on my face too. Trust me, it’s not personal. I actually have really grown to like him as a good. He has all the ability in the world. I just don’t think it’s that easy to be a dominant nfl QB, especially when you have shown little evidence of dominating on any level. A top 7 pick should have had some really dominant games in college. Especially in that conference. but seriously, nothing would make me happier than Allen becoming the man. He is in an absolutely great situation. There are no excuses this year.
eball Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 10 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said: I hope I have egg on my face too. Trust me, it’s not personal. I actually have really grown to like him as a good. He has all the ability in the world. I just don’t think it’s that easy to be a dominant nfl QB, especially when you have shown little evidence of dominating on any level. A top 7 pick should have had some really dominant games in college. Especially in that conference. but seriously, nothing would make me happier than Allen becoming the man. He is in an absolutely great situation. There are no excuses this year. I just wonder why you keep hanging your hat on Allen's college stats. Those could be used before he took a snap in the NFL, but now we have nearly 30 starts and a boatload of more relevant information that suggests he does have the ability to take over a game. It seems like you're trying so hard to protect yourself from buying in that you refuse to see what's in front of you. But whatever.
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 2 hours ago, C.Biscuit97 said: Darnold’s numbers have been horrid? He essentially has the same passing stats as Allen. While this may be... Maybe he's talking the potential out of the draft. Josh was rated below Baker, Sam and Lamar. Sam's fist career pass was a pick 6 1
NoHuddleKelly12 Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, SlimShady'sSpaceForce said: While this may be... Maybe he's talking the potential out of the draft. Josh was rated below Baker, Sam and Lamar. Sam's fist career pass was a pick 6 Well said. No question Darnold was viewed as the more finished product coming into the draft, and if there numbers are now virtually neck & neck, that's more of a statement on JA being more capable than perhaps he was given credit for out the gate? https://jetswire.usatoday.com/2018/05/04/uscs-clay-helton-sam-darnold-is-ready-to-lead-the-jets/ https://www.dailynews.com/2017/12/28/miller-uclas-josh-rosen-and-uscs-sam-darnold-are-ready-ripe-for-the-nfl/ 1 hour ago, C.Biscuit97 said: I hope I have egg on my face too. Trust me, it’s not personal. I actually have really grown to like him as a good. He has all the ability in the world. I just don’t think it’s that easy to be a dominant nfl QB, especially when you have shown little evidence of dominating on any level. A top 7 pick should have had some really dominant games in college. Especially in that conference. but seriously, nothing would make me happier than Allen becoming the man. He is in an absolutely great situation. There are no excuses this year. Well.... Edited July 8, 2020 by NoHuddleKelly12 1 1
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 7 minutes ago, NoHuddleKelly12 said: Well.... LOL AMEN to that. I had a 24 hour bug last week. I tried not to get too worried. Just now, Doc said: Bill Barnwell is the worst. Not when he rated Josh better than Faker and Darnold and questions LJ's 2 big playoff flops 1
NoHuddleKelly12 Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 8 minutes ago, SlimShady'sSpaceForce said: LOL AMEN to that. I had a 24 hour bug last week. I tried not to get too worried. Glad it wasn't THAT. It's weird to have hands start cracking from too much soap/sanitizer when not in dry winter months! Stay safe out there bro. 1
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 Just now, NoHuddleKelly12 said: Glad it wasn't THAT. It's weird to have hands start cracking from too much soap/sanitizer when not in dry winter months! Stay safe out there bro. You too bud. I may be in my early 60's but I am (I think I am) relatively healthy and have OP. OP blood types are less likely to test positive . 1 1
C.Biscuit97 Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 1 hour ago, SlimShady'sSpaceForce said: While this may be... Maybe he's talking the potential out of the draft. Josh was rated below Baker, Sam and Lamar. Sam's fist career pass was a pick 6 That might have been SD’s best game of his career. its word to say but Allen is in a better situation than Darnold. Plus, he lost a bunch of games due to mono. I’m not saying he is better than Allen. But do I think if Darnold was our qb last year would we make the playoffs? Absolutely. 1
Doc Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 58 minutes ago, SlimShady'sSpaceForce said: Not when he rated Josh better than Faker and Darnold and questions LJ's 2 big playoff flops I didn't read the article and give him the click bump. I thought you said he rated Josh the worst?
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 59 minutes ago, Doc said: I didn't read the article and give him the click bump. I thought you said he rated Josh the worst? at the Draft. or thats what I meant 1 hour ago, SlimShady'sSpaceForce said: Not when he rated Josh better than Faker and Darnold and questions LJ's 2 big playoff flops 1
thebandit27 Posted July 8, 2020 Posted July 8, 2020 5 hours ago, C.Biscuit97 said: Why didn’t Losman get better? Why didn’t EJ? Why didn’t Tribusky? Why didn’t a million other guys? If you bet on things, you try to make the safest bets possible. With respect, answer my question. What qb had a worse college resume of a 1st round draft pick than Allen did (in the last 7 years because football is completely different now)? Honestly, I can’t think of one. My concern since he was drafted was we want him to be a better player in the nfl than in the MWC. That seems an extremely risky bet. Imo, the team is good enough that we made the playoffs with C level qb play. I don’t want C level qb play from the highest drafted qb in franchise history. this year, hopefully, I don’t want to hear about 4th quarter comebacks. I want Allen to light it up in the first 3 quarters so it’s a blowout in the 4th. The questions I’ll ask in response: 1) have you seen significant improvement from Allen since his rookie season? 2) given what you’ve seen from him, what makes it likely that he will not continue to improve? 3) if he does not improve from where he is, can the Bills win a Super Bowl with him? 4) given what you’ve seen from him, what makes it likely that he will continue to improve? 5) if he does improve from where he is, can the Bills win a Super Bowl with him?
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