Poll: Josh Allen's asset value

[Alphadawg7]

7 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

You could go on and on but they didn't get 2 first round picks for the guys you listed, so I'm not sure why you would go on and on....we are talking about 2 firsts.  If you want to talk about something else, go yell at someone else.

 

Beane would not trade Allen that's right.  He knows that the 1st round picks would likely be low enough not to match value for what they invested.  Teams that are going to deal multiple 1st round picks in next year's draft will be doing so to  move up to get Lawrence.

 

You dont think the difference between Rob Johnson and Josh Allen isnt worth another first round pick?  LMAO.  So you think Allen belongs in the same convo with Rob Johnson, and those other scrubs in terms of value????  HAHAHA come on dude.  WOW

 

If you think its UNREASONABLE to assume Allen would have MORE trade value than Rob Johnson, Rick Mirer, etc then you probably shouldn't evaluate QB's and their value anymore because that is utterly ridiculous.  

Edited July 1, 2020 by Alphadawg7

[Mr. WEO]

5 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

 

 

If you think its UNREASONABLE to assume Allen would have MORE trade value than Rob Johnson, Rick Mirer, etc then you probably shouldn't evaluate QB's and their value anymore because that is utterly ridiculous.  

 

 

Good think I didn't say I didn't say any of this then....   

 

I'll repeat it for you again,.I say the Bills would not get 2 first round picks for him.  Could they get a 1st and something else?  No doubt.

 

It's interesting that you cite some of the worst trades ever to make your point.

 

 

Edited July 1, 2020 by Mr. WEO

[Alphadawg7]

1 minute ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

Good think I didn't say I didn't say any of this then....   

 

I'll repeat it for you again,.I say the Bills would not get 2 first round picks for him.  Could they get a 1st and something else?  No doubt.

 

 

 

Well that would be the same value as Rob Johnson, Rick Mirer, etc...so you ARE saying he is not MORE valuable in trade than those scrubs were if you are saying he would get the SAME value in trade.  

Edited July 1, 2020 by Alphadawg7

[Billl]

2 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Well that would be the same value as Rob Johnson, Rick Mirer, etc...so you ARE saying he is not MORE valuable in trade than those scrubs were if you are saying he would get the SAME value in trade.  

You’re looking at their value with hindsight.  Let’s do the opposite.  If Tom Brady was only worth a sixth round pick, how can Allen even be worth a seventh?  See how dumb that sounds?

[Alphadawg7]

3 minutes ago, Billl said:

You’re looking at their value with hindsight.  Let’s do the opposite.  If Tom Brady was only worth a sixth round pick, how can Allen even be worth a seventh?  See how dumb that sounds?

 

Bahahahaha what a ridiculous response.  Tom Brady was DRAFTED for a 6th round pick, NOT TRADED ONCE HE PLAYED IN THE NFL.  

 

LMAO wow.  What does teams drafting a QB on draft night when all are crap shoots and question marks have to do with trading a 2nd year QB coming off a 10 win season, 30 TD's and a playoff appearance for a team whose only made the playoffs one other time in almost 20 years????  Not to mention on a cheap rookie contract for 3 more seasons LMAO.

 

The only thing dumb was your reply lol

Edited July 1, 2020 by Alphadawg7

[Alphadawg7]

I miss the days when you could see the people who voted for each choice.  Love to see the foolish people who chose "2nd rounder or later" for Allens trade value.  Its so utterly ridiculous to suggest his value is no better than Josh Rosens, or worse than losers like Rob Johnson were.  They should have to publicly face their shame for such an egregious answer lmao.  

 

And it doesn't even matter what Allen does from this point on, talking straight about todays trade value.  No one in their right mind who knows anything about football will believe for one second that Allen couldn't fetch more than a second rounder.  That is simply NOT the reality of the NFL, and never has been.  

[Billl]

3 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Bahahahaha what a ridiculous response.  Tom Brady was DRAFTED for a 6th round pick, NOT TRADED ONCE HE PLAYED IN THE NFL.  

 

LMAO wow.  What does teams drafting a QB on draft night when all are crap shoots and question marks have to do with trading a 2nd year QB coming off a 10 win season, 30 TD's and a playoff appearance for a team whose only made the playoffs one other time in almost 20 years????  

 

You see how DUMB that sounds LMAO

The Saints signed Brees as a free agent and gave up zero draft compensation.  How can Allen be worth a bag of footballs if Brees wasn’t even worth a seventh round pick?
 

That’s your argument in reverse.

 

[boater]

Financially, Josh Allen is a salary cap bargain compared to other starting QBs. That alone increases his value. A salary cap strapped team would give a first to sign him.

 

Unpopular prediction: Josh plays 5 mediocre years in Buffalo, then moves on.

[GoBills808]

5 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

I miss the days when you could see the people who voted for each choice.  Love to see the foolish people who chose "2nd rounder or later" for Allens trade value.  Its so utterly ridiculous to suggest his value is no better than Josh Rosens, or worse than losers like Rob Johnson were.  They should have to publicly face their shame for such an egregious answer lmao.  

 

And it doesn't even matter what Allen does from this point on, talking straight about todays trade value.  No one in their right mind who knows anything about football will believe for one second that Allen couldn't fetch more than a second rounder.  That is simply NOT the reality of the NFL, and never has been.  

Oh I think we know exactly who voted for 2nd or later

[Alphadawg7]

12 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

Oh I think we know exactly who voted for 2nd or later

 

Except there is 30 of them now, like WTF hahaha.  Must be all the flat earth people hahaha

 

13 minutes ago, Billl said:

The Saints signed Brees as a free agent and gave up zero draft compensation.  How can Allen be worth a bag of footballs if Brees wasn’t even worth a seventh round pick?
 

That’s your argument in reverse.

 

 

NO thats not even remotely the same argument.  Do you know what a trade is?  GEEZUS 

 

You just compared a mediocre QB with a major injury to end his season to his throwing shoulder by the way that there was no guarantee he could even be the same mediocre QB he was before the injury.  Brees was NOT "Brees" when he was a free agent.  None the less, its one million percent irrelevant as its not even a trade.

 

I love you keep ignoring ACTUAL TRADES of QB's to make fake arguments to support your biased negative opinion on Allen though

Edited July 1, 2020 by Alphadawg7

[BullBuchanan]

Outside of extremely high potential QBs, the trade value for most NFL players is ludicrously low. Hopkins, the best WR in the league, was traded for a 2nd round pick and a flash in the pan RB. Most NFL teams seem to think that the grass is always greener when it comes to the draft. I see Josh worth a 2nd rounder or maybe a late first with something going back to the other team.

Edited July 1, 2020 by BullBuchanan

[Mr. WEO]

41 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Well that would be the same value as Rob Johnson, Rick Mirer, etc...so you ARE saying he is not MORE valuable in trade than those scrubs were if you are saying he would get the SAME value in trade.  

 

I'm saying...right now, the Bills would not get 2 firsts for Allen.  I selected 1st round 8-32., simply because anyone in top 2-7 who wants a QB would be trading up.

 

 

I don't know how to help you any more.

[GoBills808]

16 minutes ago, BullBuchanan said:

Outside of extremely high potential QBs, the trade value for most NFL players is ludicrously low. Hopkins, the best WR in the league, was traded for a 2nd round pick and a flash in the pan RB. Most NFL teams seem to think that the grass is always greener when it comes to the draft. I see Josh worth a 2nd rounder or maybe a late first with something going back to the other team.

Rosen was traded for a 2nd

[Alphadawg7]

1 hour ago, BullBuchanan said:

Outside of extremely high potential QBs, the trade value for most NFL players is ludicrously low. Hopkins, the best WR in the league, was traded for a 2nd round pick and a flash in the pan RB. Most NFL teams seem to think that the grass is always greener when it comes to the draft. I see Josh worth a 2nd rounder or maybe a late first with something going back to the other team.

 

So let me get this straight...you sighted a WR to show the value of a QB's trade value?  LMAO.  A position that is notoriously had low trade value in relation to talent?  OK, got it.  Geezus...you and Billll should date since neither seem to understand the concept of evaluating like transactions.  Rob Johnson says hi by the way.

Edited July 1, 2020 by Alphadawg7

[GoBills808]

6 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

So let me get this straight...you sighted a WR to show the value of a QB's trade value?  LMAO.  A position that is notoriously had low trade value in relation to talent?  OK, got it.  Geezus...you and Billll should date since neither seem to understand the concept of evaluating like transactions.  Rob Johnson says hi by the way.

Not to mention he was also shipped out for pennies on the dollar due to friction with the HC/GM...bad comparison imo.

[Mr. WEO]

1 hour ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

So let me get this straight...you sighted a WR to show the value of a QB's trade value?  LMAO.  A position that is notoriously had low trade value in relation to talent?  OK, got it.  Geezus...you and Billll should date since neither seem to understand the concept of evaluating like transactions.  Rob Johnson says hi by the way.

 

You keep comparing Allen for 2 first round picks with some of the worst QB trades in NFL history, as though GM's are dying to do that over and over. 

 

Trust me, it's not helping your argument.

[Alphadawg7]

5 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

You keep comparing Allen for 2 first round picks with some of the worst QB trades in NFL history, as though GM's are dying to do that over and over. 

 

Trust me, it's not helping your argument.

 

Comparing REALITY is not helping the argument?  Ok.  The reality is that consistently NFL GM's keep paying premiums for weak QB's, unproven QB's, QB's that show glimpses of potential, etc.  Its the nature of the NFL.  You keep denying it. Whether its trades or egregious contracts, GM's have CONSISTENTLY over paid for QB's, ones without even the fraction of success Allen has had already.  You are the one who is not once helped your argument in this regard.

 

And I never said he would for sure fetch 2 first rounders...I said he would for sure fetch more than just 1 first only, and that could be other picks included besides another first.  I said its certainly possible he could get 2 first rounders...and there is factual proof of this.  Beane would NOT under any circumstance trade Allen today right now for 2 first rounders.  You know it, and I know it.  That means there is ONE team already (who knowns him best) that already has a higher value on him than 2 first rounders.  And there are several other GM's around the league who gush about Allen and his potential.  Just like there are some who are not sold on him and wouldn't do it.  Only takes ONE GM to make the trade, and if you think there is NOT one GM who would pay more than just a single first as compensation, then you are just too blind in your negative biased opinion of Allen to see it.  

Edited July 1, 2020 by Alphadawg7

[BullBuchanan]

1 hour ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

So let me get this straight...you sighted a WR to show the value of a QB's trade value?  LMAO.  A position that is notoriously had low trade value in relation to talent?  OK, got it.  Geezus...you and Billll should date since neither seem to understand the concept of evaluating like transactions.  Rob Johnson says hi by the way.

You clearly missed the entire point. Guys like Rob Johnson and Matt Shaub were traded based on sky high potential, which I explicitly called out. What they did or did not end up doing int heir careers is immaterial to the point. Josh Allen is far more of a known quantity in terms of where people would place his ceiling, but also still very much a project with an unknown floor. The Josh Rosen trade isn't a perfect example, but it isn't a terrible one either, given that he was a "barely driven off the lot" QB who many teams would've taken in the first 15 picks a year earlier. This wouldn't be  at all similar to the Jay Cutler or Carson Palmer where both were Pro Bowlers.

It has nothing to do with Allen's ability - it's the way the NFL works most of the time. 

2 hours ago, GoBills808 said:

Rosen was traded for a 2nd

Exactly.

[Mr. WEO]

1 hour ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Comparing REALITY is not helping the argument?  Ok.  The reality is that consistently NFL GM's keep paying premiums for weak QB's, unproven QB's, QB's that show glimpses of potential, etc.  Its the nature of the NFL.  You keep denying it. Whether its trades or egregious contracts, GM's have CONSISTENTLY over paid for QB's, ones without even the fraction of success Allen has had already.  You are the one who is not once helped your argument in this regard.

 

And I never said he would for sure fetch 2 first rounders...I said he would for sure fetch more than just 1 first only, and that could be other picks included besides another first.  I said its certainly possible he could get 2 first rounders...and there is factual proof of this.  Beane would NOT under any circumstance trade Allen today right now for 2 first rounders.  You know it, and I know it.  That means there is ONE team already (who knowns him best) that already has a higher value on him than 2 first rounders.  And there are several other GM's around the league who gush about Allen and his potential.  Just like there are some who are not sold on him and wouldn't do it.  Only takes ONE GM to make the trade, and if you think there is NOT one GM who would pay more than just a single first as compensation, then you are just too blind in your negative biased opinion of Allen to see it.  

 

No, there's not.  You made that up.  You have no idea what Beane would do with an offer of 2 firsts (what if one of them is #1, for instance?).

 

And no matter what value BEANE assigns  to Allen --that has no bearing on what someone else would pay.  Does that really need to be pointed out to you?  

 

Anyway, since he would not be offered to firsts, of course Beane would never trade Allen (not now at least).

[GreggTX]

No one in their right mind is giving a 1st round pick for Allen until he can prove himself. He has yet to do that and he has a long way to go.