John from Riverside Posted December 5, 2023 Posted December 5, 2023 1 hour ago, BillsFanNC said: Donald Trump being surrounded by sheep this is the first true you have posted
TheBrownBear Posted December 5, 2023 Posted December 5, 2023 6 minutes ago, BillStime said: Hoax I wish, but this is "my lived experience", dude. Maybe I'm just living in a bubble of it in my personal life since my wife is friends with the founders of BLM, but it is seemingly everywhere around me, including with most of the young folk I work with.
BillStime Posted December 5, 2023 Posted December 5, 2023 13 minutes ago, TheBrownBear said: I wish, but this is "my lived experience", dude. Maybe I'm just living in a bubble of it in my personal life since my wife is friends with the founders of BLM, but it is seemingly everywhere around me, including with most of the young folk I work with. Anecdotal.
L Ron Burgundy Posted December 5, 2023 Posted December 5, 2023 1 hour ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: Your wording was problematic only in the sense that what you thought you were saying, and what you actually said, was not the same thing. If it helps you in some small way to assume I didn't understand what you didn't say, I'm happy to shoulder that burden. We can agree that Jan 6 was a stain on our nation. Interestingly, you stumbled upon something that has been quite troubling to me. You wrote: Thankfully they are observably stupid so you can usually see them coming from far off. If you, a guy who can't remember from one post to another what he wrote, can "see them coming from far off", how did a bunch of crazies overrun the Capitol in less time than it takes to get through the gate(s) at a Bills home game? And, why are three years in with so many questions unanswered as to who was responsible for security, how they completely missed the warning signs even you can see, and what has been done to ensure it never happens again? You are shouldering a burden you have earned and are earning. Perhaps I earn it too by being hyperbolic but i thought you'd comprehend hyperbole. Let's review. I say you can't blame Biden for the economy without also blaming Trump. You interpret that as meaning I'm saying Biden is above reproach. Ah, no. That isn't what the words I used mean or meant. Now in reference to which party has slid more off the deep end. If I say far left twats are mostly online trolls does that mean they all are? I even mentioned that's what I see which is anecdotal. But at no point have they- the far left (i keep typing fart left)- committed acts similar to J6 - and it's not because they are smarter (though they probably are). It's not because they are better people, here I assume they aren't. It's because the loonies don't have the numbers with us like they do with the right. Politicians on your side can't even get elected sometimes unless they play the role of election deniers.
John from Riverside Posted December 5, 2023 Posted December 5, 2023 On 6/10/2020 at 4:37 AM, Reality Check said: Who died that has you so upset? John McCain
Buffarukus Posted December 5, 2023 Posted December 5, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, TheBrownBear said: Thank you for articulating what it feels like to be a disaffected liberal Democrat. There is a growing authoritarianism on the left that is both disheartening and a bit frightening, and there are large swaths of under-40 types on the left who strongly identify as anarchists and/or Marxists, especially young women. My wife, her friends, and basically every late-millennial early Gen-Zer she teaches in her college program ascribe to this new way of thinking. Shutdown, shame and eject any heterodox thought that could possibly challenge current social justice dogma. Go watch the Evergreen State or Yale Halloween struggle session videos. That is the type of illiberalism that is inculcated in young progressives who are now taking the reins of power in our institutions. For anyone not already indoctrinated in their church, this should alarm you. When I rant about this stuff, it has nothing to do with Trump or implicate any sort of support for him or right-wing politics in general. Just because they happen to be correct about Woke insanity, doesn't mean I believe they are correct about much of anything else. As far as I'm concerned, Trump has fascist tendencies and I do not trust him with what remains of our democracy. I will continue to support traditional liberal Democratic ideals, but I won't sit silently while the party is hijacked by formerly fringe weirdos. I think that was the main draw to biden. A classic democrat who everyone remembered had classic liberal views. Maybe going back to that would restore the party and its values but truth be told. There is power in radicalism. Look at how much power the students now hold over teachers. Say the wrong pronoun or have the wrong view on a lesson and you risk your livlihood. Who wouldnt, especially young, love to hold those cards. It should be no suprise the party itself would embrace the "fringe" What i dont understand is what the admistrations have to gain. Kids being brats and wanting power over the teacher is pretty normal but the admistration backing it and going against the staff? The gov allowing all police to be painted with one singular brush until it is politically inconvenient regardless of effects. Im not against non violent criminals recieving some leniency. Im not against changes to immigration laws to make it easier but now entering illegally isnt even concidered a crime to dems. Im still against racism in all forms including against whites. Its somthing to see when liberals no longer view the teaching of MLK of content of character to focus SOLEY on race only to call others racist and im def skeptical against the gov regardless which side is in charge. the democrats have gone to far and anyone who doesnt see it never held liberal principals. They were just on a team. Cheering with poms poms who they root for regardless of ideas being twisted and corrupted. As long as its winning against the other side. Maybe its because i live in a deep blue state so all i see day to day is liberal effects but i am also not hearing compelling arguments about the right that come close to comparison. I saw this a few minutes ago and think its fitting for the thread. Edited December 5, 2023 by Buffarukus 1
L Ron Burgundy Posted December 5, 2023 Posted December 5, 2023 3 hours ago, Buffarukus said: I talk about what liberalism stood for. How it no longer resembles itself and has flipped its values. Instead you pull out the comparison to MAGA. Its gross? The fact i can go to a store today and see isles that have to be locked up due to lax crime laws and normalization of looting. I Read repeatedly as those same soft punishments on crime that release someone on the street who ends up finally taking lives. Immigration flooding cities where nyc mayor is slashing budgets, less libraries and police. Coming to a city near me, and has...read about the migrants delivered to my side of the state. Again with no federal action to stop the problem they caused and seemigly condone. https://abc7ny.com/nyc-asylum-seekers-erie-county-migrant-shelters-ny/13745257/ "Eric County Executive Mark Poloncarz referenced two sex crimes involving migrants in his decision to request New York City no longer send migrants to the county. Poloncarz said Mayor Eric Adams agreed to the pause." I can go on. I did. But this isnt small "cutural bs" just because you do not have the capacity to care about the effects or dont believe they are true. These are major shifts in society whether you acknowledge them or not. Then when i ask for a comparison, i get the below. So i give examples and get "these things should not mix" no real examples of negatives happening today that i asked for. I gave you abortion/ contraception banning. Got anything substantial besides i dont like this If it ends up more in gov policy. If not, what are you really standing on? Im not sure what you get in your feed. I also dont care. I think your a adult who can make a logical distinction between bs and truth. what you think should be directed toward X to make ignoring authors or topics easier. But thats not what the left wants. They want to decide for me. They dont seem concerned about gov encroachment in those decisions for others. They think words are violece and every voice that opposess theirs should no longer have one...for our saftey. I dont see those calls from the right. Very liberal of them. Just not seeing the threat you do from that side and you have not articulated much substance as real world effects. It mostly sounds like fear of what may happen. Yes, comparing Liberalism to Maga/Trumpism I find disturbing. There has been no bigger liar in the history of our country as that POS. And I have believed all politicians are liars for as far as i can remember. To say anything like that you must believe some or all of the BS he is spewing. In terms of Christian Nationalism....I hoped my answer would suffice so i didnt have to type out a novel. It's surprising you need to have reasons spelled out on why having a religion elevated over others is wrong in our country. I'm against historical revisionism - we are a secular country period, and I certainly don't want policy or law being aligned with the Christian interpretation of morality. For Christian Nationalists, being American is closely tied to being a Christian. They often may see cultural and religious diversity as a threat to our national identity. I could go on, and on. The very idea being against the principles of our country should suffice. For the bolded above, what do you want to do about misinformation? Freedom of Speech is tied in here and if you look close you'll find an alarming rate that the people that cry most about freedom of speech just want freedom to lie without consequence. Worse than J6 will happen if we don't figure something out but I dont claim to have an answer here. Curious what you think. I mentioned my feed because I had something flow through, a video showing J6 was completely faked, everything including Ashli Babbitt. It was good production value too not some POS garbage. I mention this because the comments had plenty of people believing it, and calling for revolution. That there is a problem.
leh-nerd skin-erd Posted December 5, 2023 Posted December 5, 2023 1 hour ago, L Ron Burgundy said: You are shouldering a burden you have earned and are earning. Perhaps I earn it too by being hyperbolic but i thought you'd comprehend hyperbole. Let's review. I say you can't blame Biden for the economy without also blaming Trump. You interpret that as meaning I'm saying Biden is above reproach. Ah, no. That isn't what the words I used mean or meant. Wrong. You never suggested Biden was above reproach, and I never suggested you did. I responded multiple times that my issue was your comment on how it was unfair to Biden, like he lost first lead in the middle school production of House of Cards. He’s president, it’s completely fair to blame him based on 200+ years of American history. 1 hour ago, L Ron Burgundy said: Now in reference to which party has slid more off the deep end. If I say far left twats are mostly online trolls does that mean they all are? I even mentioned that's what I see which is anecdotal. But at no point have they- the far left (i keep typing fart left)- committed acts similar to J6 - and it's not because they are smarter (though they probably are). It's not because they are better people, here I assume they aren't. It's because the loonies don't have the numbers with us like they do with the right. Politicians on your side can't even get elected sometimes unless they play the role of election deniers. I understand your position. I don’t think it’s a coincidence you keep typing “fart left”, your argument stinks. ✌️
BillStime Posted December 5, 2023 Posted December 5, 2023 1 hour ago, Buffarukus said: Well, um… this is weird. G.O.P. Plans to Drop Presidential Primaries in 4 States to Impede Trump Challengers Republicans to scrap primaries and caucuses as Trump challengers cry foul State GOP cancels 2020 presidential primary Trump says state Republican parties are canceling primaries because they ‘don’t want to waste their money Boy do their keepers depend on their sheep not having any brain cells or memory.
Buffarukus Posted December 5, 2023 Posted December 5, 2023 11 hours ago, L Ron Burgundy said: Yes, comparing Liberalism to Maga/Trumpism I find disturbing. There has been no bigger liar in the history of our country as that POS. And I have believed all politicians are liars for as far as i can remember. To say anything like that you must believe some or all of the BS he is spewing. Well im not even sure what you consider liberalism since you havent made much of a argument on the subject. Freedom of speech, not judging others by race,wanting negotiations for peace over war. (at least in the Ukraine). Being highly skeptical of gov...read any of my posts on covid while "liberals" devoted loyalty to the CDC and actions giving gov supreme power. On and on. Beliefs i held 20 years ago. Beliefs that did not flip with the democratic party. My first post in this thread was on how people who believe trump is dismantling deep state are pretty foolish. You push me in the devout trump role because its easier to dismiss and stereotype for your argument. 11 hours ago, L Ron Burgundy said: In terms of Christian Nationalism....I hoped my answer would suffice so i didnt have to type out a novel. It's surprising you need to have reasons spelled out on why having a religion elevated over others is wrong in our country. I'm against historical revisionism - we are a secular country period, and I certainly don't want policy or law being aligned with the Christian interpretation of morality. For Christian Nationalists, being American is closely tied to being a Christian. They often may see cultural and religious diversity as a threat to our national identity. I could go on, and on. The very idea being against the principles of our country should suffice. Again, things you THINK will happen. Western society was built with christian values in mind. Of coarse there should be separation. That doesnt mean good qualities and values are not the basis of things you enjoy today. So with hundreds of years of history with christians as the majority, republicans ALWAYS using faith as a way to get elected and you not giving much of reasoning how its any more dangerous. Its really hard to see points that arent made. Novel or not. 11 hours ago, L Ron Burgundy said: For the bolded above, what do you want to do about misinformation? Freedom of Speech is tied in here and if you look close you'll find an alarming rate that the people that cry most about freedom of speech just want freedom to lie without consequence. Worse than J6 will happen if we don't figure something out but I dont claim to have an answer here. Curious what you think. I mentioned my feed because I had something flow through, a video showing J6 was completely faked, everything including Ashli Babbitt. It was good production value too not some POS garbage. I mention this because the comments had plenty of people believing it, and calling for revolution. That there is a problem. I like Xs community note method the most so far but i dont personally have a account. There are alot of people with specific skill sets able to detect bs. Their knowledge should not be buried in a comment but instead easily displayed. Id also like companies to bring back (thumbs down ect) ratings. Kind of a quick check of sorts. Somthing has to be done about bots because it gives the perception of majority in info and completely negates ratings. But mostly i think a straight forward terms of service needs to be clear and concise. The country has a first ammendment and we need to navigate how to keep it in tact. Not disregard it and hand the keys to people who can manipulate information how they see fit? Do you understand what that means. My question to you is who exactly do you trust to censor you? how will you ever know when they are irresponsible with the task if you get no info telling you. 1
Buffarukus Posted December 5, 2023 Posted December 5, 2023 (edited) 12 hours ago, BillStime said: Well, um… this is weird. G.O.P. Plans to Drop Presidential Primaries in 4 States to Impede Trump Challengers Republicans to scrap primaries and caucuses as Trump challengers cry foul State GOP cancels 2020 presidential primary Trump says state Republican parties are canceling primaries because they ‘don’t want to waste their money Boy do their keepers depend on their sheep not having any brain cells or memory. As usual billstime avoids all points made and delivers another im rubber your glue. Pluck out any info just to add a whatabout. Ill say that is extremely fed up for GOP or DEMs to pull. Can you? Of coarse not. I could post links of green party being removed by dems. What happened to tulsi and bernie by the DNC..on and on. You know continue the whatabouts. But there is only one authoritarian mentioned by you. Meanwhile. Biden truley believes deep in his soul in every vote mattering. He is LITTERALY defending the fabric of american democracy in this election. Until it doesnt suit him that is. Then he will implement jim crow 3.0 all over democrat voters 😅 Edited December 5, 2023 by Buffarukus
L Ron Burgundy Posted December 6, 2023 Posted December 6, 2023 12 hours ago, Buffarukus said: Well im not even sure what you consider liberalism since you havent made much of a argument on the subject. Freedom of speech, not judging others by race,wanting negotiations for peace over war. (at least in the Ukraine). Being highly skeptical of gov...read any of my posts on covid while "liberals" devoted loyalty to the CDC and actions giving gov supreme power. On and on. Beliefs i held 20 years ago. Beliefs that did not flip with the democratic party. My first post in this thread was on how people who believe trump is dismantling deep state are pretty foolish. You push me in the devout trump role because its easier to dismiss and stereotype for your argument. Again, things you THINK will happen. Western society was built with christian values in mind. Of coarse there should be separation. That doesnt mean good qualities and values are not the basis of things you enjoy today. So with hundreds of years of history with christians as the majority, republicans ALWAYS using faith as a way to get elected and you not giving much of reasoning how its any more dangerous. Its really hard to see points that arent made. Novel or not. I like Xs community note method the most so far but i dont personally have a account. There are alot of people with specific skill sets able to detect bs. Their knowledge should not be buried in a comment but instead easily displayed. Id also like companies to bring back (thumbs down ect) ratings. Kind of a quick check of sorts. Somthing has to be done about bots because it gives the perception of majority in info and completely negates ratings. But mostly i think a straight forward terms of service needs to be clear and concise. The country has a first ammendment and we need to navigate how to keep it in tact. Not disregard it and hand the keys to people who can manipulate information how they see fit? Do you understand what that means. My question to you is who exactly do you trust to censor you? how will you ever know when they are irresponsible with the task if you get no info telling you. What i consider liberalism? There are many types. None conform with maga. Maga only touts freedom of speech so that they can spread misinformation. See; 90% of the words trump speaks, J6 and the roots of why it occurred, conspiracy-mongering conservatives who believe a cabal of pedos is controlling the dem party (it gets crazier but i'll stop there) etc etc etc etc. Oh Jewish space lasers, i have to include that. Western society was not built on Judeo Christian values otherwise we'd be governed by the bible or the torah and slavery would be very legal. Western society took much more from the greeks than Judaism/Christianity. That's a line Shapiro and Peterson use to pump up the masses. Specifics that Christian Nationalists push for aside from abortion are prayer in school, opposition to lgbt rights, maintaining religious monuments on public property etc. It always starts with small things then progresses. Their goal - some do not deny - is to incorporate Christianity into our government. Some of this is hyperbole but that doesn't matter. These convos are all the same to me. I point out the worst in your party. You guys point out the worst in mine. It's a bit banal. The guy you're running for president has suggested suspending the constitution. And you seem to be cool with that. Or at least not in the least indignant.
Buffarukus Posted December 6, 2023 Posted December 6, 2023 (edited) 16 hours ago, L Ron Burgundy said: What i consider liberalism? There are many types. None conform with maga. Maga only touts freedom of speech so that they can spread misinformation. See; 90% of the words trump speaks, J6 and the roots of why it occurred, conspiracy-mongering conservatives who believe a cabal of pedos is controlling the dem party (it gets crazier but i'll stop there) etc etc etc etc. Oh Jewish space lasers, i have to include that. Well liberalism history was always more of a absolute in its defense of speech. The saying " i may not agree with what you say but i defend your right to say it" was a widely known core belief. I grew up where "we must ban that rock and roll rap devil music" was used by the christian right while the ACLU defended kkk. Ect ect. The thoughts on censorship were completly reversed. You allow people to speak so you can easily identify them. You let ideas get challenged in the open so the truth can challenge it. Unfortunately in the cyber world those ideas can be walled off into echo chambers but that does not mean you turn to flat out censorship tactics. If its a crime..absolutley. othewise, make the words go away is extremely lazy and incredibly dangerous way to deal with a problem humans have been dealing with since we can communicate. Again, who do you trust to do it responsibly? A gov that constantly shifts its beliefs based on a 4 year election cycle. You want the liar trump helping pull those levers? While libs are cheering as bidens thumbs the scale with no regard to that threat to them. Some faceless guys with their own motives in a room at a tech platform get to do it all while manipulating terms of service that they intentionally make vague. while they enjoy power no other media gets. 16 hours ago, L Ron Burgundy said: Western society was not built on Judeo Christian values otherwise we'd be governed by the bible or the torah and slavery would be very legal. Western society took much more from the greeks than Judaism/Christianity. That's a line Shapiro and Peterson use to pump up the masses. Specifics that Christian Nationalists push for aside from abortion are prayer in school, opposition to lgbt rights, maintaining religious monuments on public property etc. It always starts with small things then progresses. Their goal - some do not deny - is to incorporate Christianity into our government. Some of this is hyperbole but that doesn't matter. A bit off topic I am really perplexed by the lefts hyperbolics of threat to lgbt they see everywhere. As if they are in this role that makes them the only thing standing in the way of lgbt annihilation. Meanwhile trump was the first president to recognize their right to marriage. Lgbt have existed and flourished my entire lifetime. Entire section of my city dedicated to their way of life. Parades every year with no hate or violence for decades with right christian pandering presidents taking office. Tv shows, actors, musicians even before me getting mass acceptance and fans. So now the fight boils down to a derivative of pronouns and children? Its really silly that is now the "existential threat" and " litterally killing people". The large majority are liberatrian and simply dont want it pushed on them or their family. As for monuments and religion as a whole I agree. But you have to recognize the "new liberal" has taken on identity politics in all its forms as a religion. To the point they force workers, students ect to adhear to under penalty of punishment. A teacher should not require prayer, segregation, lifestyle or race choices. Personal beliefs or religion has no place being forced on anyone especially if they are in power over them. From talking to you i think we agree on this a bit but seems you are more concerned with the one "recognized" as a devout faith. 16 hours ago, L Ron Burgundy said: These convos are all the same to me. I point out the worst in your party. You guys point out the worst in mine. It's a bit banal. The guy you're running for president has suggested suspending the constitution. And you seem to be cool with that. Or at least not in the least indignant. I agree. I think alot of people look past each others points. Its why i required specifics. I certainly gave them. I understand where your coming from and they are concerns for me as well. I think im just more concerned about threat in front of me and you are more concerned about a encroaching one over the horizon. For many of your points ill def be on your side if they have the same result. Im no trump fan but i am against the "woke" for reasons i explained about core beliefs. I simply dont see or heard of the issues you speak of causing significant societal issues. I have no problem admitting if i did. Either way id rather spend time writing a novel trying to articulate points with someone to understand them then send a one sentence insult. So hopefully you dont consider our descussion a waste of time. Edited December 6, 2023 by Buffarukus 1
Joe Ferguson forever Posted December 18, 2023 Posted December 18, 2023 https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/trump-quotes-putin-condemning-american-democracy-praises-autocrat-orban/ar-AA1lBJvy u good with this, PPP magas? what say y'all?
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