Drew Brees: Controversial comments

[Kirby Jackson]

1 minute ago, Needle said:

Bet of the year! Nice odds

Yeah, I like that bet at +300. As calculated as Brees is, those are great odds. He’s going to do whatever makes him look the best. 

[SDS]

Just now, Kirby Jackson said:

Yeah, I like that bet at +300. As calculated as Brees is, those are great odds. He’s going to do whatever makes him look the best. 

well, just to warn you. I think this is a great bet. But given that I lose every bet I am sure of this is horrible news for anyone else who agrees with me. 

[Needle]

1 minute ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Yeah, I like that bet at +300. As calculated as Brees is, those are great odds. He’s going to do whatever makes him look the best. 

I enjoy your personal contributions on experiences that you have had with players. Brees has always struck me as a selfish dude.

[Doc]

I'm in.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

15 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

If you tear down the system and get rid of all the police,  anarchy will ensue

 

The east side of Buffalo, where I am all the time, would turn into a cluster****

 

I would not want to be around that.

 

On the flip side, there needs to be better trained police officers, and the system needs to have a lot of changes on a national scale.. militarization of the police force is not what is needed

 

I don't want to live without a police force, myself.   I think there's pretty overwhelming support for change right now but stopping short of defunding police. 

 

Demilitarizing yes.

 

Imma sound like a broken record here, but while I agree completely on the militarization, and I'm sure in some cases training is at fault (we were discussing in the SB earlier, how some police forces around here expect cadets to fund their own police academy training "on spec" before they hire) - TBH what I see as the problem is the lack of accountability.  98.3% of the police who kill a civilian are never charged with a crime.  I'm sure many of those cases are justified.  But some are pretty egregious.

 

As a history buff, pretty sure you appreciate that history shows when people believe they can do something with impunity, it lessens their deterrence to doing it, even if it's illegal, unjustified, immoral etc.

[HamSandwhich]

Yet another PPP topic, this board is full of politics @SDS

[FireChans]

1 minute ago, HamSandwhich said:

Yet another PPP topic, this board is full of politics @SDS

I’m sure he knows dude. Lol

[Buffalo716]

5 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I don't want to live without a police force, myself.   I think there's pretty overwhelming support for change right now but stopping short of defunding police. 

 

Demilitarizing yes.

 

Imma sound like a broken record here, but while I agree completely on the militarization, and I'm sure in some cases training is at fault (we were discussing in the SB earlier, how some police forces around here expect cadets to fund their own police academy training "on spec" before they hire) - TBH what I see as the problem is the lack of accountability.  98.3% of the police who kill a civilian are never charged with a crime.  I'm sure many of those cases are justified.  But some are pretty egregious.

 

As a history buff, pretty sure you appreciate that history shows when people believe they can do something with impunity, it lessens their deterrence to doing it, even if it's illegal, unjustified, immoral etc.

Well said Hap

 

As usual

[SDS]

1 minute ago, HamSandwhich said:

Yet another PPP topic, this board is full of politics @SDS

Thanks for your observation. Drew’s comments are of a political nature related to sports. That’s on you. 

[Needle]

8 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I don't want to live without a police force, myself.   I think there's pretty overwhelming support for change right now but stopping short of defunding police. 

 

Demilitarizing yes.

 

Imma sound like a broken record here, but while I agree completely on the militarization, and I'm sure in some cases training is at fault (we were discussing in the SB earlier, how some police forces around here expect cadets to fund their own police academy training "on spec" before they hire) - TBH what I see as the problem is the lack of accountability.  98.3% of the police who kill a civilian are never charged with a crime.  I'm sure many of those cases are justified.  But some are pretty egregious.

 

As a history buff, pretty sure you appreciate that history shows when people believe they can do something with impunity, it lessens their deterrence to doing it, even if it's illegal, unjustified, immoral etc.

I'm all for reasonable police reform. Let's face it, some departments probably need to be evaluated from top to bottom.

 

The demilitarizing is a tough thing to sell me. I'm not in favor of a military style police force being used on the regular but hasn't the last two weeks kind of justified having that capability? 

 

 

Edited June 6, 2020 by Needle

[SDS]

2 minutes ago, Needle said:

I'm all for reasonable police reform. Let's face it, some departments probably need to be evaluated from top to bottom.

 

The demilitarizing is a tough thing to sell me. I'm not in favor of a military style police force being used on the regular but hasn't the last two weeks kind of justified having that capability? 

 

Justified or cause?

[GregPersons]

8 minutes ago, Needle said:

I'm all for reasonable police reform. Let's face it, some departments probably need to be evaluated from top to bottom.

 

The demilitarizing is a tough thing to sell me. I'm not in favor of a military style police force being used on the regular but hasn't the last two weeks kind of justified having that capability? 

 

The military style police force — also let's remember they are not soldiers, they are civil servants, like mail carriers, playing commando with our tax money — is what has instigated the violence. 99 out of 100 times. The idea that cops need this is pure propaganda, from the cops.

 

If you are only looking at cable or TV news or Facebook, you're getting the impression that cops are belted with bricks and whatever else, and the kneeling photos. Social media has first hand accounts all over the place of what's happening in the streets. Unarmed protestors and shield/helmet/SWAT gear/armed officers.

 

And they really want you to think it's the unarmed protestors starting these fights. And people are willing to believe it. It's not true. 

 

All we saw, all week, was cops & mayors pouring gasoline on the flames. In response to protests of police brutality, police brutally beat the protestors. Multiple cities, tons of examples. Twitter and Instagram, browse around.  Notice too, the videos of the cop cars on fire. Are any of those recent models? Why are they all old? Have you seen the videos from NY protests of plain-clothes officers trying to blend in as the protestors and then being the ones trying to rile up the mob? There's so many out there. It's intense.

 

Bottom line. We don't need an occupying force. Why? By the way, for what its worth, my brother works as a military officer and spent several tours in Iraq. He noted to me this week that the police they trained in Iraq handled de-escalation and handling prisoners better than we're seeing from Joe Cop in Anywhere USA. 

 

We don't need idiots pretending to be soldiers in Minneapolis. We need people from the community who understand the community and know how to keep people safe while allowing all of their constitutional freedoms — including and especially the right for assembly and protest.

Edited June 6, 2020 by GregPersons

[Needle]

4 minutes ago, SDS said:

Justified or cause?

I saw a number of city departments outnumbered by people brazenly committing crimes. I saw the vast majority of departments show tremendous patience. They literally had Molotov cocktails being thrown at them in NYC.

[kota]

not sure why anyone is surprised by his comments.  

[Logic]

I see that there are conversations happening involving the comparative merits of defunding, demilitarization, and abolition of police forces. I just wanted to contribute this graphic and link to the discussion, because I think it's very interesting. It is admittedly from the perspective of police abolitionists.

I also want to point out that defunding and abolition are not as preposterous as some would have us believe. Because we have all only ever lived in a carceral society, it can be hard to envision what true defunding and/or abolition of police and the prison industrial complex would look like. To be clear, it does NOT mean total lawlessness and anarchy in the streets. Most police abolitionists envision a transition away from the police as we know them and toward a collection of more highly specialized units. It also means a transition from incarceration-based punishments to things like rehabilitation, counseling, mediation, and restorative justice. The long term goal is to get to criminals and potential criminals and address their underlying pathos early on, rather than throwing them in jail, which we have seen over time to not be an effective way to deter them from repeating their criminal behaviors in the future. 

First, a link to an article called "What a world without cops would look like" : https://www.motherjones.com/crime-justice/2020/06/police-abolition-george-floyd/

Second, this chart, which is in the form of a zoom-in-able PDF file:

https://static1.squarespace.com/static/59ead8f9692ebee25b72f17f/t/5b65cd58758d46d34254f22c/1533398363539/CR_NoCops_reform_vs_abolition_CRside.pdf
 

[RaoulDuke79]

3 minutes ago, Logic said:

I see that there are conversations happening involving the comparative merits of defunding, demilitarization, and abolition of police forces. I just wanted to contribute this graphic and link to the discussion, because I think it's very interesting. It is admittedly from the perspective of police abolitionists.

I also want to point out that defunding and abolition are not as preposterous as some would have us believe. Because we have all only ever lived in a carceral society, it can be hard to envision what true defunding and/or abolition of police and the prison industrial complex would look like. To be clear, it does NOT mean total lawlessness and anarchy in the streets. Most police abolitionists envision a transition away from the police as we know them and toward a collection of more highly specialized units. It also means a transition from incarceration-based punishments to things like rehabilitation, counseling, mediation, and restorative justice. The long term goal is to get to criminals and potential criminals and address their underlying pathos early on, rather than throwing them in jail, which we have seen over time to not be an effective way to deter them from repeating their criminal behaviors in the future. 

First, a link to an article called "What a world without cops would look like" : https://www.motherjones.com/crime-justice/2020/06/police-abolition-george-floyd/

Second, this chart, which is in the form of a zoom-in-able PDF file:

https://static1.squarespace.com/static/59ead8f9692ebee25b72f17f/t/5b65cd58758d46d34254f22c/1533398363539/CR_NoCops_reform_vs_abolition_CRside.pdf
 

Utopia is an awesome theory.

[FireChans]

7 minutes ago, Logic said:

I see that there are conversations happening involving the comparative merits of defunding, demilitarization, and abolition of police forces. I just wanted to contribute this graphic and link to the discussion, because I think it's very interesting. It is admittedly from the perspective of police abolitionists.

I also want to point out that defunding and abolition are not as preposterous as some would have us believe. Because we have all only ever lived in a carceral society, it can be hard to envision what true defunding and/or abolition of police and the prison industrial complex would look like. To be clear, it does NOT mean total lawlessness and anarchy in the streets. Most police abolitionists envision a transition away from the police as we know them and toward a collection of more highly specialized units. It also means a transition from incarceration-based punishments to things like rehabilitation, counseling, mediation, and restorative justice. The long term goal is to get to criminals and potential criminals and address their underlying pathos early on, rather than throwing them in jail, which we have seen over time to not be an effective way to deter them from repeating their criminal behaviors in the future. 

First, a link to an article called "What a world without cops would look like" : https://www.motherjones.com/crime-justice/2020/06/police-abolition-george-floyd/

Second, this chart, which is in the form of a zoom-in-able PDF file:

https://static1.squarespace.com/static/59ead8f9692ebee25b72f17f/t/5b65cd58758d46d34254f22c/1533398363539/CR_NoCops_reform_vs_abolition_CRside.pdf
 

What’s your position on gun law reform?

[Logic]

2 minutes ago, RaoulDuke79 said:

Utopia is an awesome theory.

I can guarantee, based on the speed of your response, that you didn't bother reading the article or the chart.

That's fine. 

Keep happily supporting the system that perpetuates police brutality and the use of military force against black citizens and peacefully assembled protestors. I and others, meanwhile, would prefer to at least entertain alternative ideas.

 

1 minute ago, FireChans said:

What’s your position on gun law reform?

You seem to have a habit of asking a question either unrelated or only tangentially related to the posts that I make.

I'd be happy to answer that, but first:

What's YOUR position on the material to which you just replied?

[FireChans]

6 minutes ago, Logic said:

You seem to have a habit of asking a question either unrelated or only tangentially related to the posts that I make.

I'd be happy to answer that, but first:

What's YOUR position on the material to which you just replied?

I think I won’t even begin to consider it if the person who raises it as a possibility is also for the disarmament of the citizens of this country. 

[RaoulDuke79]

L

13 minutes ago, Logic said:

I can guarantee, based on the speed of your response, that you didn't bother reading the article or the chart.

That's fine. 

Keep happily supporting the system that perpetuates police brutality and the use of military force against black citizens and peacefully assembled protestors. I and others, meanwhile, would prefer to at least entertain alternative ideas.

My apologies....I should have waited another 30 minutes to reply. I'm glad you came to the conclusion that you did that I support police brutality in such a quick manner as well. Where do we go from here?......Also, while we're at it, weren't you one of the guys who was adamantly opposed to people going out and congregating during this whole covid thing? Surely you can't be fond of these protests. Its going to a terrible strain on the hospitals and such.

Edited June 7, 2020 by RaoulDuke79