Drew Brees: Controversial comments

[Kirby Jackson]

I don’t think that everyone can wrap their heads around how Brees is viewed in New Orleans either. Think about the way Buffalo views Jim Kelly and then multiply it by like 20. Brees came to New Orleans in the wake of Katrina. He came here when no one wanted to be here. Brees and the Saints played THE most important role in New Orleans rebuilding. He has given millions and done more for this city than just about anyone.

 

With that being said that’s where the hurt comes in. This city is 60% black. They face these issues on a daily basis. Here’s a guy that has been viewed as nothing but a hero to this group not fighting with them. There is a real disappointment and outrage. They just wanted him to condemn racism and instead he switched the conversation to something that it wasn’t about. Don’t ever meet your heroes. 

Edited June 4, 2020 by Kirby Jackson

[FireChans]

Just now, SWATeam said:

So others are not allowed to give their opinions on your opinions?

They absolutely are. But if we really want progress, you need to try to come to a middle ground. Not destroy the opposition.

[Kirby Jackson]

4 minutes ago, FireChans said:

No, he doesn’t. Not one person who disagrees with what Brees said anything close to defending his comments. They haven’t expressed that they understand where HE’S coming from. It’s been basically blind rage.

 

There’s this idea in this country that if you have “bad opinions,” rather than come to a middle ground, you should be shouted into the stratosphere. Did Ed Reed calling Drew Brees a “sucka” 15 times change anyone’s mind or do anything positive? No.

 

He’s backpedaling because it’s a good PR move.

Where he’s coming from? He was asked about protesting police brutality and he talked about his grandfather in the military. That’s like asking me if I like coffee and I start talking about cleaning supplies. His point was nothing. His answer was “I don’t understand the question.”

[billrooter]

Just now, Gugny said:

 

I "defended your rights," and I never felt a face-slap.

 

Stop telling veterans, or anyone else, how to feel.

 

This isn't about a goddamn flag, an anthem or the military.  You've had four years to figure that out.

 

I am not telling anyone how to feel,   I am voicing my opinion just like you.  I served as well bud.

[Kirby Jackson]

3 minutes ago, billrooter said:

Seems as if alot of people are seeing the so called protests that are going on now doesn't it?

Do you think Kapernick taking a knee had any influence on those protests? Do you think that he had any influence on any of these other athletes speaking up?  

[billrooter]

5 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I understand your point of view.  Understand I come from a family with several military veterans and live in a neighborhood with military vets/current guardsmen and with LEO and LEO relatives, and that many of them (I won't claim I know the opinions of all) do NOT see it that way.

 

They see it as "we put our lives on the line for America" and what America means to them - which means a free country with freedom of speech and space for different opinions.  Revering that is different than forced or mandated reverence for the Flag as a symbol of that country.   Military Veteran and former Navy Chief Warrant Officer Jim Wright put it very well IMHO when he reiterated the phrase "those of us in uniform used to say, “I don’t agree with what you said, but I’ll defend to the death your right to say it.” " 

 

I personally don't think many of our fallen soldiers (and LEO) gave their lives for the flag.  Some gave their lives because they were drafted and had no choice.  Some gave their lives because they saw the military (or becoming a LEO) as their best option to better themselves and their families.  And some gave their lives because they think America is worth fighting for - but to some of them, that America worth fighting for means an America where it's OK to protest, including protesting the anthem or flag.  I personally don't think too many of them gave their lives for a Symbol. 

I do know the Flag is an important symbol to many - I just can't escape the observation that many who seem the frothiest about flag-waving and equating reverence for the Symbol with reverence for the Country, did in fact NOT serve and have NOT put their bodies in harms way for it nor have their family members.  And many who are the frothiest about it also are either ignorant of, or willfully disregard the Flag Code and disrespect the flag in all kinds of ways from putting it on plates and covering it with ketsup to putting it on flip-flops and striding it into the muck.  That actually really bothers me - as in REALLY bothers me - but I usually manage to refrain from opining a gristly fate for those who do stuff I disagree with.

 

There are (IMO) really two broad points of view here - you are encapsulating one of them, and I am (probably not very well) encapsulating another.

 

Returning to football - I think Brees has 100% right to say whatever he likes, but again - freedom of speech does not mean freedom from consequences, from clap-back or disagreement.

 

 

 

You say it just fine and I understand what your saying.

[Blokestradamus]

4 minutes ago, FireChans said:

They absolutely are. But if we really want progress, you need to try to come to a middle ground. Not destroy the opposition.

 

Martin Luther King tried to find the middle ground. That got him blackmailed by the FBI and murdered.

 

Fred Hampton tried to find the middle ground. That got him executed in his own home by his own government.

 

The burden is not on black people or minorites to stop racism. ***** your middle ground.

[Kirby Jackson]

4 minutes ago, FireChans said:

They absolutely are. But if we really want progress, you need to try to come to a middle ground. Not destroy the opposition.

I agree here but the problem is all voices aren’t the same. Drew Brees’ voice on the subject is one of the most important. He, along with Brady and Rodgers are the most recognizable white athletes in the country. They are considered leaders. His voice is WAY more important than yours or mine.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

5 minutes ago, FireChans said:

No, he doesn’t. Not one person who disagrees with what Brees said anything close to defending his comments. They haven’t expressed that they understand where HE’S coming from. It’s been basically blind rage.

 

There’s this idea in this country that if you have “bad opinions,” rather than come to a middle ground, you should be shouted into the stratosphere. Did Ed Reed calling Drew Brees a “sucka” 15 times change anyone’s mind or do anything positive? No.

 

He’s backpedaling because it’s a good PR move.

 

Yes, a lot of the reaction to Brees comments has been blind rage, but for someone who is not tone-deaf is that not to be expected given the current context - where a man died in broad daylight in the presence of 4 police officers, one of whom knelt with his knee on the man's throat for >7 minutes while others apparently held him down.  People are understandably angry about that.  People are enraged.  That's the problem with feelings of rage and long-standing frustration - they erupt, they are not neatly bounded by logic or grammar.

 

Your comments about Ed Reed are correct.

 

It's equally true that Drew Brees comments didn't change anyone's mind or do anything positive.

 

Kaep started his protest - well, here, I think it may be appropriate to return to what he said at the time, 2016, and what the SF49ers said.  Remember the context - in 2016, among other things, a former police officer in St Louis was acquitted of murder for shooting a man through his car window, after being recorded during the pursuit "we're killing this *****, don't you know" and after being allowed to contaminate the scene by going to his cruiser, reaching into his personal bag in the back, and entering the car of the man he shot.  A gun was found in the car that had the officer's DNA but not the DNA of the deceased; the officer had been allowed to enter the car and "safe" the gun that was allegedly there during the pursuit, without wearing gloves.  [I have a close friend whose brother is a recently retired high officer in the StLPD who can say that all of this is 100% against proper crime scene procedure and proper procedure for an officer-involved shooting.]  So yeah, this kind of thing. 

And that was 2016, and it's 2020 now, and nothing has changed, and in some ways things have backslid, gotten worse.  Consent decrees to reform police have been voided,  Justice Department programs to investigate PDs have ended, that kind of thing.

 

Anyway, here's what Kaep originally said and what the 49ers originally said:

"I am not going to stand up to show pride in a flag for a country that oppresses black people and people of color," Kaepernick told NFL Media in an exclusive interview after the game. "To me, this is bigger than football and it would be selfish on my part to look the other way. There are bodies in the street and people getting paid leave and getting away with murder."

The 49ers issued a statement about Kaepernick's decision: "The national anthem is and always will be a special part of the pre-game ceremony. It is an opportunity to honor our country and reflect on the great liberties we are afforded as its citizens. In respecting such American principles as freedom of religion and freedom of expression, we recognize the right of an individual to choose and participate, or not, in our celebration of the national anthem."

Niners coach Chip Kelly told reporters Saturday that Kaepernick's decision not to stand during the national anthem is "his right as a citizen" and said "it's not my right to tell him not to do something."

 

Emphasis mine - the club and the coach originally pointed out that American principles allow an individual the right to choose to participate or not.

 

Somehow that changed over the next few months.

 

I personally support the right of the NFL Owners to mandate employee behavior during the anthem on their property and their dime, but let's remember at the very start,  the right of an individual to respectfully choose not to participate was recognized by the club and its coach.  And many who object to Kaepernick's behavior aren't doing so on the former grounds, they're doing so on the grounds that it's somehow "unAmerican" or disrespectful of rights our military fought and died for.  To the contrary.

 

 

[SCBills]

I disagree with Drew Brees and believe his view is coming from a place of privilege and perhaps ignorance.... that said, I think we all know where Drew Brees heart is and these forced apology tours anytime someone goes against the progressive mainstream are beyond obnoxious.  

[Dr. K]

I think the U.S. is a great country and is exceptional in many ways. The flag, however, has nothing to do with the military or with soldiers or with wars or armies. It is a symbol of the nation as a whole. In the beginning the framers of the Constitution did not even want a standing army because they thought having thousands of soldiers in peacetime would present a threat to the government and freedom (as it's been proven in many countries, where the army is often involved in coups and political infighting).

 

It's only been since Vietnam that we have had these huge displays of flags and soldiers at sporting events in the U.S., to the point where many people have come to automatically associate the flag with the military, and to think that waving the flag at every possible opportunity is the only way you show your patriotism. I think it's a sign of our uneasiness about patriotism that we have come to insist on all of these public displays, and to treat the flag as if it were a holy object. If a country is secure in the love of its people, if it is a foregone conclusion that it stands for equality and justice for all, then it does not need to shout about the flag at every public opportunity.

 

To make an analogy to faith in God, Jesus said, (Matthew 6:5), "And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites. are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and. in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward."

 

In other words, when your faith is strong, and you are confident in the rightness of your belief, you do not need to go around in public making a big deal of how much you believe. To do so is ostentatious, can even bespeak a kind of paranoia, and become a kind of bullying. For example, the largest and most organized displays of public patriotism I can think of in the 20th century took place in Nazi Germany and the Soviet Union.

 

When somebody silently kneels during the national anthem, or otherwise uses the flag in protest, they are not dishonoring the nation, they are hoping to hold the nation to account for injustices done under that flag. We may not agree with them, but to get bent out of shape about it is a sign of insecurity or desire to dominate. 

Edited June 5, 2020 by Dr. K

[LB3]

Drew's biggest mistake was apologizing. He stated how he felt about kneeling for the anthem. The thought police will never forgive him either way. In addition to looking insensitive to many, now he looks like a coward to many.

[1st Ammendment NoMas]

Personally, the responses of other NFL players were more derogatory and offensive than Brees comment. He was flat out attacked for not blindly towing the liberal line.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 minute ago, LB3 said:

Drew's biggest mistake was apologizing. He stated how he felt about kneeling for the anthem. The thought police will never forgive him either way. In addition to looking insensitive to many, now he looks like a coward to many.

 

That's one way to look at it.  Another way to look at it is that it takes a big person to acknowledge when you're wrong.

[IDBillzFan]

36 minutes ago, Blokestradamus said:

 

Martin Luther King tried to find the middle ground. That got him blackmailed by the FBI and murdered.

 

 

Are you honestly arguing that MLK did it wrong, and because he sought a middle ground, he didn't accomplish much?

 

Because that's kind of what you're saying. 

[LB3]

4 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

That's one way to look at it.  Another way to look at it is that it takes a big person to acknowledge when you're wrong.

You really think his beliefs changed in one day? 

[Andrew Son]

6 minutes ago, BillsRdue said:

Personally, the responses of other NFL players were more derogatory and offensive than Brees comment. He was flat out attacked for not blindly towing the liberal line.

Then feel free to "attack" them.

[BillsShredder83]

1 hour ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Oh man, seeing as the last 2 Brees threads were shut down I’m sure this one will last...

 

While I do think that we should have this discussion on here it can’t be on the main board. It’s WAY too divisive of a topic. Maybe PPP? Either way, this topic is going to do nothing but divide up the board and people are going to say some uncomfortable/uneducated stuff. 
 

I’ll just leave on this. Brees has never been the person that everyone thought. He has maintained a squeaky clean image but was never “Breesus” as some believed. There are some skeletons in that closet that have been tucked away. This may not end well for Drew...

Whats in that closet?

[Mr. WEO]

First that birthmark on his face and now this.  

 

Guy can't catch a break.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

Just now, BillsRdue said:

Personally, the responses of other NFL players were more derogatory and offensive than Brees comment. He was flat out attacked for not blindly towing the liberal line.

 

Maybe he was flat-out attacked for being totally tone-deaf to issues that hit very very close to home for many of those players. 

 

I would wager that most of them have personally experienced or have family that have personally experienced what they believe to be racial profiling or racially biased policing.  A number may have lost friends to same. 

 

Wealth and privilege don't protect - the wife of a HOF retired football player once told me she was scared when my kid and her kid were out doing friend things late at night (movies, fast food, etc).  My kid is white.  She was concerned certain police would pull them over and cause injury to her kid because he was with a white kid.  It's not for me to tell her her fears were mistaken, though thankfully nothing happened.

 

 

 

 

1 minute ago, BillsShredder83 said:

Whats in that closet?

 

I had the same question

 

Just now, Mr. WEO said:

First that birthmark on his face and now this.  

 

Guy can't catch a break.

 

He doesn't have to catch a break, he just has to time his throws correctly with the break.  See what I did there?