Billl Posted June 5, 2020 Posted June 5, 2020 2 minutes ago, Augie said: You can say whatever you want. You are wrong. It doesn’t make me uncomfortable at all. It didn’t mess up my life. I hope and pray he’s happy with how it turned out for him. I don’t wish any ill will upon anyone. If I used my platform working at a bank to promote my politics, it would last less than a day. This is not water cooler talk. This is taking the most visible platform available on national TV. If he wants to talk in the showers.....cool. How you do not see the difference. I have no idea. Whatever. Clearly your bank doesn’t have a collective bargaining agreement. NFL players do, so your circumstances are different. 2
Hapless Bills Fan Posted June 5, 2020 Posted June 5, 2020 1 hour ago, Shooter McGavin said: Shame on Drew Brees for expressing his opinion on what the flag personally means to him. He should be crucified for his actions for not having the same opinion as a cookie-cutter progressive! Shame on him! Oh, brother.... Drew Brees is welcome to express his opinion on what the flag personally means to him. He is also welcome to do what he did - which was to express his opinion on what the flag ought to mean to OTHER people and his interpretation of their behavior (disrespectful) And then OTHER people with different opinions are also welcome to express their opinion of his opinion. That is how it works, y'know? 2
Augie Posted June 5, 2020 Posted June 5, 2020 1 minute ago, Billl said: Clearly your bank doesn’t have a collective bargaining agreement. NFL players do, so your circumstances are different. OK, you tell me.....how did that work out for him? He’s not worth the bother.
Hapless Bills Fan Posted June 5, 2020 Posted June 5, 2020 Just now, Billl said: Clearly your bank doesn’t have a collective bargaining agreement. NFL players do, so your circumstances are different. The previous NFL CBA amended in 2014 and the NFLPA approved seems to contain some very broad sweeping language - "It is not enough simply to avoid being found guilty of a crime. We are all held to a higher standard and must conduct ourselves in a way that is responsible, promotes the values of the NFL, and is lawful." "Conduct that undermines or puts at risk the integrity of the NFL, NFL clubs, or NFL personnel. " is prohibited. Basically as far as I can tell, the code of conduct in the NFL CBA is so broad that pretty much any behavior the NFL considers to not promote the values of the NFL or to undermine the NFL can be subject to discipline. 1
first_and_ten Posted June 5, 2020 Posted June 5, 2020 13 hours ago, billrooter said: So as a white person Drew Brees now has no right voicing his opinion, one that I agree with. Racism goes both ways, it just isn't covered so thoroughly by the media when it is the other way around. This is a complete S&it S%how in my opinion. What exactly did he say that was wrong, the National Anthem IMO is never a place to protest? "racism goes both ways"... Thanks for proving that this country has a long way to go. And thanks for the laugh. 2
first_and_ten Posted June 5, 2020 Posted June 5, 2020 13 hours ago, billrooter said: Why because we have different opinions, are you allowed to protest on the job or during the Anthem? IMO it is a slap in the face to everyone who has ever defended our rights. Yes, he is allowed to take a knee if he would like to during the anthem. And no, he isn't allowed to kneel at work because he has a job to do, what he's being paid for. If they do the anthem at his job, yes he does have to right to kneel.
Billl Posted June 5, 2020 Posted June 5, 2020 51 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: The previous NFL CBA amended in 2014 and the NFLPA approved seems to contain some very broad sweeping language - "It is not enough simply to avoid being found guilty of a crime. We are all held to a higher standard and must conduct ourselves in a way that is responsible, promotes the values of the NFL, and is lawful." "Conduct that undermines or puts at risk the integrity of the NFL, NFL clubs, or NFL personnel. " is prohibited. Basically as far as I can tell, the code of conduct in the NFL CBA is so broad that pretty much any behavior the NFL considers to not promote the values of the NFL or to undermine the NFL can be subject to discipline. Pretty sure that kneeling isn’t a “technically he wasn’t CONVICTED of a crime” situation. He isn’t risking the integrity of the league by kneeling. This is impossibly beyond even the broadest interpretation of the agreement.
Hapless Bills Fan Posted June 5, 2020 Posted June 5, 2020 3 minutes ago, Billl said: Pretty sure that kneeling isn’t a “technically he wasn’t CONVICTED of a crime” situation. He isn’t risking the integrity of the league by kneeling. This is impossibly beyond even the broadest interpretation of the agreement. I ain't a lawyer, but "promotes the values of the NFL" can quite possibly mean anything the commissioner wants it to mean. My point being, the NFL CBA is not as spelled-out as some of the other professional sports CBAs, so I'm not sure it can be counted upon to be protective. 1
Billl Posted June 5, 2020 Posted June 5, 2020 1 minute ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: I ain't a lawyer, but "promotes the values of the NFL" can quite possibly mean anything the commissioner wants it to mean. My point being, the NFL CBA is not as spelled-out as some of the other professional sports CBAs, so I'm not sure it can be counted upon to be protective. Sure, but it’s not analogous to working at a bank. That’s a false equivalency.
NoHuddleKelly12 Posted June 5, 2020 Posted June 5, 2020 19 minutes ago, Billl said: Pretty sure that kneeling isn’t a “technically he wasn’t CONVICTED of a crime” situation. He isn’t risking the integrity of the league by kneeling. This is impossibly beyond even the broadest interpretation of the agreement. Depends on how the phrase “integrity of the league” is interpreted, imho. It could also encompass the financial wherewithal of the league for example, which between sponsorships/fan attendance being affected goes to the heart of what Goodell gets paid to protect the shield from—the owners’ bottom line is paramount. Also, as Hap pointed out, “values” as dictated by the NFL is about as nebulous as it gets. Terrible bargaining at the time by the NFLPA.
Billl Posted June 5, 2020 Posted June 5, 2020 1 minute ago, NoHuddleKelly12 said: Depends on how the phrase “integrity of the league” is interpreted, imho. It could also encompass the financial wherewithal of the league for example, which between sponsorships/fan attendance being affected goes to the heart of what Goodell gets paid to protect the shield from—the owners’ bottom line is paramount. Also, as Hap pointed out, “values” as dictated by the NFL is about as nebulous as it gets. Terrible bargaining at the time by the NFLPA. Every word you said is true. Still not the same as saying “I can’t protest while working as a teller at a bank”. Not in any way compatible.
Tcali Posted June 5, 2020 Posted June 5, 2020 15 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said: Oh man, seeing as the last 2 Brees threads were shut down I’m sure this one will last... While I do think that we should have this discussion on here it can’t be on the main board. It’s WAY too divisive of a topic. Maybe PPP? Either way, this topic is going to do nothing but divide up the board and people are going to say some uncomfortable/uneducated stuff. I’ll just leave on this. Brees has never been the person that everyone thought. He has maintained a squeaky clean image but was never “Breesus” as some believed. There are some skeletons in that closet that have been tucked away. This may not end well for Drew... Someone cant speak out patriotically without digging up dirt for leverage? Thank you Drew for speaking out. But bad move kissing the arses of the PC crowd.
Augie Posted June 5, 2020 Posted June 5, 2020 1 hour ago, first_and_ten said: "racism goes both ways"... Thanks for proving that this country has a long way to go. And thanks for the laugh. We really do have a long way to go, that’s certainly true. I hate this thread, because I hate the reality....but do you really think racism does not go both ways? I’m hoping I misunderstood, honestly. I can give countless situations where I or my family were disadvantaged, endangered or threatened because of the color of our white skin. Anything from AAU basketball to regularly doing community work in underprivileged neighborhoods where I was threatened to a guy I previously liked at work telling me he was getting a Pitt to put fear in the eyes of guys like me. This is a mess, and I’m bowing out here for now. 1
Tcali Posted June 5, 2020 Posted June 5, 2020 (edited) 11 hours ago, nedboy7 said: I said it. You are the one wishing he wouldn't bring it to "work". Why? Obviously it bothers you. Own it. And yes politics are talked at work all the time. No one gets fired. It is called having respect for other opinions. He is not taking a ***** on the flag. He is kneeling. Is that less respectful than standing drunk for the flag? They have a right to kneel.But people cant also think they are spoiled rich punks. And when everyone kneels and puts pressure on others to do the same that is not bravery at all. People really dont want to be lectured to by kids playing a kids game. Do I support their right to do it ? yes Edited June 5, 2020 by Hapless Bills Fan Politicized language 1
Augie Posted June 5, 2020 Posted June 5, 2020 (edited) 14 minutes ago, Billl said: Every word you said is true. Still not the same as saying “I can’t protest while working as a teller at a bank”. Not in any way compatible. Do you think you CAN or SHOULD BE able to protest as a bank teller? That represents the bank in the eyes of the public. What if you have Democrats next to Republicans in adjoining windows? (HINT: they BOTH get fired.) It makes me curious, what do you do for a living? . Edited June 5, 2020 by Augie 1
Doc Brown Posted June 5, 2020 Posted June 5, 2020 We're 23 pages in and it hasn't been moved to ppp yet. This is the progress Kaepernick was hoping for. 1
Paup 1995MVP Posted June 5, 2020 Posted June 5, 2020 2 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said: Drew Brees has done a lot of good things. I don’t believe Drew Brees is a good person. Those things aren’t the same. He’s charitable. He’s a phony. Those are both true. He just had a rare misstep in the public eye. He accidentally showed everyone who he is. He’s done that a few times (suing his mom, Focus on Family, anthem protest). This isn’t “out of character” for Brees; this is who he is. He usually just is better at protecting his image. Why is Drew Brees not a good person? I personally do not know a lot about the man. He sure has been an iconic figure in New Orleans since Hurricane Katrina. And didn't he and his wife donate a ton of money to help fight the Corona Virus in Louisiana? He comes off as a good family man kind of guy. Great football player, leader on the team. What am I missing? He certainly has a right to be against people not standing for the National Anthem. And for the life of me I can not see why that view would be considered racist in the slightest. Americans should all be patriotic. Doesn't matter what color race religion you are. This is the greatest country in the world. And I am wayyyy fukin proud whenever I see the Stars and Stripes flying, whether from the back of a car, someone's house, or from a building, anywhere!! It is for ALL Americans of all walks of life and all races. And if people have a problem with loving the American Flag and all that it stands for, I have a big problem with you. Don't burn it, don't desecrate it, don't disrespect it. Period. The American flag does not discriminate. It loves all who are Americans. This is a GREAT country. It is not a perfect country. (there is no such thing) Sure there are some bad cops. And some are racist. Similar to the rest of society. And the cops in Minnesota certainly deserved to be punished to the fullest extent of the law for the horrible crime they committed against George Floyd. It was absolutely despicable. But that in no way diminishes our country and the good that the overwhelming majority of people stand for and believe in every day regardless of their color. Not the anarchy that has enveloped many areas by a small portion of misguided souls. Because regardless of what the media wants to portray on the news and all other platforms, the overwhelming majority of people just want to live their lives, stay healthy and make a god dam living.
78thealltimegreat Posted June 5, 2020 Posted June 5, 2020 My problem with Colin kneeling was never his protest it was him wearing Che’ Guevara T-shirts...for those don’t remember history Che’ ironically used secret police to stomp down opponents and many times throw them in jail or worse...so dude was a massive massive hypocrite more then anything
Augie Posted June 5, 2020 Posted June 5, 2020 (edited) 34 minutes ago, Tcali said: They have a right to kneel.But people cant also think they are spoiled rich punks. And when everyone kneels and puts pressure on others to do the same that is not bravery at all. People really dont want to be lectured to by kids playing a kids game. Do I support their right to do it ? yes right on Augie...Hiopefully some day minorities will realize that the social justice warriors kissing their arses are like the flatterers that Dante talks about in his writings.Phonies all of them. My first generation Lebanese wife grew up a Catholic in rural South Carolina. Her grandfather had a crossed burned in his front yard. He scared them off with a shot gun, put out the fire and took the “perfectly good wood” to the barn to be be repurposed. I learned today, after 35 years of marriage, her high school coach nicknamed her “A-Rab”. That is what he called her every day. I asked why I had never heard that, and she said she hated it so much she just pushed ahead, determined that much more to succeed. She has been a HIGHLY successful professional. Jerks are everywhere. YOU decide how you move forward in life. You may get some breaks, you may not, but you make your own decisions. . Edited June 5, 2020 by Augie 1
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