Stank_Nasty Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 1 minute ago, ScottLaw said: What’s to disagree with? This is an offensive league, until the Bills demonstrate a legitimate offense(it’s been 4 years since they’ve had one) they’ll be doubted. I was disagreeing with his statement that no outsiders view them as a top ten squad yet. that's false. the athletic has them at 6 nfl.com 8th cbs has them at 5 …. and that was literally just a 30 second search.... so yes, I disagree that most outsiders see us much lower than the end of the top ten.
Stank_Nasty Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 1 minute ago, Stank_Nasty said: I was disagreeing with his statement that no outsiders view them as a top ten squad yet. that's false. the athletic has them at 6 nfl.com 8th cbs has them at 5 bleacher report and espn at 11 …. and that was literally just a 30 second search.... so yes, I disagree that most outsiders see us much lower than the end of the top ten. 1 minute ago, ScottLaw said: https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2019/05/13/nfl-power-rankings-fmia-peter-king/ Last years rankings. Somewhere between 8-13 seems right.... all depends on your view of Allen. that's fair 1
FireChans Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 2 hours ago, Shaw66 said: This kind of a comment demonstrates that King - like many others - is thinking more about writing something that is provocative than is informative. There simply was nothing "desperate" about what Beane did. He had a choice, which was use those picks, combined equal to a #18 pick, to draft one of those rookies, or to take Diggs. If the trade had never happened and the Bills drafted Justin Jefferson, let's say, King wouldn't have called it a "desperate" move, even though the risk is exactly the same. All Beane did was get what he thought was the best receiver available with the draft capital he had. It's just a question of personnel evaluation and making a decision. Some of those decisions work out some don't. King seems to think Beane made the wrong choice, but he doesn't tell us why he thinks that's the case. He doesn't show how the Bills with Jefferson and whomever they might have gotten with the fifth and sixth round picks would have been better than they will be with Diggs. And he doesn't consider what Beane said before the draft, which was that he could consider trading some of his later round picks, because it just isn't likely that guys taken in the later rounds were going to be able to make the roster. That comment was borne out when the Bills used fifth and sixth round picks to take a kicker and a backup QB who has almost no chance of playing this year. Why would the Bills have been better with Jefferson and those picks? It's just a nonsense comment. I’m not sure he thinks it was a mistake. He doesn’t say they shouldn’t have done it. They could have stayed pat at 22 and drafted somebody or traded multiple picks for Diggs. A team happy with their offense would have done option 1. A team desperate to improve their offense would do 2. 1 1
Billl Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 10 minutes ago, Stank_Nasty said: I was disagreeing with his statement that no outsiders view them as a top ten squad yet. that's false. the athletic has them at 6 nfl.com 8th cbs has them at 5 …. and that was literally just a 30 second search.... so yes, I disagree that most outsiders see us much lower than the end of the top ten. I think he meant 10th or slightly better which is exactly where most have them. 1
ExWNYer Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 1 hour ago, Shaw66 said: Excellent. Thanks. I very much read it with the first definition which, by the way, is the way it's supposed to be read. Words like this may have a primary and a secondary meaning, and when in doubt the writer should assume that people will go with the primary meaning. "Desperate" comes from "despair" and relates to "desperation," both or which imply some kind of emergency or dire situation. The Bills were not in an emergency situation, the team was not about to go down the drain if they didn't find a receiver. The very fact that the draft was full of receivers meant there was no reason for despair. The Bills didn't act out of desperation. Getting Diggs wasn't some last ditch effort to save a sinking ship. All the Bills did was choose among the available receivers. You are exactly right. King stated, "That dictated a desperate move by GM Brandon Beane." False. Had he stated, "GM Brandon Beane desperately needed to make a move to improve the offense", that would be true...whether via trade or the draft. It may seem like semantics but, although they desperately needed to do something, the trade was not a "desperate move". Far from it. That, in a nutshell, is the difference between the two definitions provided by @GunnerBill. If King meant it under the guise of definition #2, then it is just lazy &/or poor sentence structure. If he meant it as he wrote it under the guise of definition #1, then he is blatantly off base. Either way, he is wrong. 1 1 1
LABILLBACKER Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 7 hours ago, ALLEN-2-DIGGS-TD!! said: What a joke no way Dallas, Steelers and Raiders are ahead of us. That's ok we will make believers out of them. Add Tennessee and Tannehill to that group. Buffalo at the very least should be somewhere between 8-10. At least King got NE pretty accurate. 1
NoHuddleKelly12 Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 I normally agree with a lot of Peter King's takes, but he's flat wrong about the value of assets for the Diggs trade, as well as this ranking, imho. That said, IIRC, when he was interviewed shortly after his initial post-FA reviews by OBD, he admitted that the relative steal by the Cards from the Texans for Hopkins perhaps didn't help as to his opinion of the price paid by the Bills subsequently for Diggs--who knows. But we are about to earn front-runner status on the field, I have no doubt of that. 1
Shaw66 Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 52 minutes ago, ExWNYer said: You are exactly right. King stated, "That dictated a desperate move by GM Brandon Beane." False. Had he stated, "GM Brandon Beane desperately needed to make a move to improve the offense", that would be true...whether via trade or the draft. It may seem like semantics but, although they desperately needed to do something, the trade was not a "desperate move". Far from it. That, in a nutshell, is the difference between the two definitions provided by @GunnerBill. If King meant it under the guise of definition #2, then it is just lazy &/or poor sentence structure. If he meant it as he wrote it under the guise of definition #1, then he is blatantly off base. Either way, he is wrong. Exactly. I agree that it would be fine to say "the Bills desperately needed to do something." That's typical hyperbole that we use all the time, and that usage cues the reader that "desperate" in this context is meant to imply the second of Gunner's definitions. Semantics, for sure, but King gets paid a lot of money to get it right, both his football information and his writing. He got lazy. 1
Shaw66 Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 9 minutes ago, NoHuddleKelly12 said: I normally agree with a lot of Peter King's takes, but he's flat wrong about the value of assets for the Diggs trade, as well as this ranking, imho. That said, IIRC, when he was interviewed shortly after his initial post-FA reviews by OBD, he admitted that the relative steal by the Cards from the Texans for Hopkins perhaps didn't help as to his opinion of the price paid by the Bills subsequently for Diggs--who knows. But we are about to earn front-runner status on the field, I have no doubt of that. Right. A lot's been said about the Hopkins trade. One reason the trade compensation for him was so low was the size and term of his contract. Hopkins is going to cost a lot of money soon. The other thing, which I think has only been hinted at, is that I think Hopkins isn't exactly a team guy. I know that sounds funny when said in comparison to Diggs, but I think people are going to see that Hopkins has a me-first passion, while Diggs actually has a win-at-any cost passion. That is, Hopkins is a more successful version of Sammy Watkins, and it's interesting that they came out of the same program. 1
Don Otreply Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 8 hours ago, Captain Hindsight said: What exactly about the Raiders is good? Good question, no one seems to have an answer... Go Bills!!!
Buffalo_Stampede Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 He's got us as the 6th best team in the AFC. I'll take it. We still have to prove that the offense can improve.
ColoradoBills Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 4 hours ago, Billl said: Posters here will argue for months that Allen is a great QB who was held back by his WRs. Then after Beane traded 5 draft picks for Diggs, those same posters will swear the Bills weren’t desperate for a WR. The 6th rounder for a 7th rounder swap put me over the edge. Beane was Flimflammed! 2
HappyDays Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 I am amazed at how much value is placed on 1st round picks by pundits. What is the hit rate of late 1st rounders? It has to be less than 50%, right? If we had drafted Justin Jefferson we would be beyond happy if he ended up as good as Diggs. And I dont buy the "short term desperation move" narrative. Diggs is 26. He has at least another 5 years in his prime. Yeah the Bills were desperate for receiving help but this was a prudent move, not a desperate one. Desperate would be trading multiple high picks. You can't always trade away your 1st round pick for a proven player but this was a one time deal at a position of need. 1
JoPoy88 Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 13 minutes ago, HappyDays said: I am amazed at how much value is placed on 1st round picks by pundits. What is the hit rate of late 1st rounders? It has to be less than 50%, right? If we had drafted Justin Jefferson we would be beyond happy if he ended up as good as Diggs. And I dont buy the "short term desperation move" narrative. Diggs is 26. He has at least another 5 years in his prime. Yeah the Bills were desperate for receiving help but this was a prudent move, not a desperate one. Desperate would be trading multiple high picks. You can't always trade away your 1st round pick for a proven player but this was a one time deal at a position of need. it’s because phone-it-in personalities like peter king fall for the same mystery box fallacy that so many here do. There is absolutely no guarantee any of those receivers he named become as good or better than diggs. If fact, given how good diggs already is at 26, chances are none of them will. But King’s a lost soul at this point. For all those other outlets’ preseason rankings mean nothing, King’s mean less than nothing. Disappointing people still give him clicks 2 decades after he peaked. 1
stinky finger Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 5 hours ago, Shaw66 said: Excellent. Thanks. I very much read it with the first definition which, by the way, is the way it's supposed to be read. Words like this may have a primary and a secondary meaning, and when in doubt the writer should assume that people will go with the primary meaning. "Desperate" comes from "despair" and relates to "desperation," both or which imply some kind of emergency or dire situation. The Bills were not in an emergency situation, the team was not about to go down the drain if they didn't find a receiver. The very fact that the draft was full of receivers meant there was no reason for despair. The Bills didn't act out of desperation. Getting Diggs wasn't some last ditch effort to save a sinking ship. All the Bills did was choose among the available receivers. This^ And we did well to get a ready made, young, reasonably priced top end WR vs drafting. Smart move, as I see it. 4 hours ago, ScottLaw said: https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2019/05/13/nfl-power-rankings-fmia-peter-king/ Last years rankings. 10 of his top 15 were playoff teams. Only Tennessee(25) and Buffalo(23) were off.... and this was before Luck retired as he had the Colts third. Obviously he was way off on the Rams, Chargers, Bears, and Browns.(Though he admitted they were a risky team and was 100% accurate on why he thought so) Somewhere between 8-13 seems right.... all depends on your view of Allen. 8-13? You coming around on Josh?
stinky finger Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 2 hours ago, Shaw66 said: Exactly. I agree that it would be fine to say "the Bills desperately needed to do something." That's typical hyperbole that we use all the time, and that usage cues the reader that "desperate" in this context is meant to imply the second of Gunner's definitions. Semantics, for sure, but King gets paid a lot of money to get it right, both his football information and his writing. He got lazy. Pete has lost lost a LOT off his fastball. 1 hour ago, ColoradoBills said: The 6th rounder for a 7th rounder swap put me over the edge. Beane was Flimflammed! Textbook bamboozled, I say! Semantics, I'm quite sure..... 1 1
ExWNYer Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 56 minutes ago, JoPoy88 said: it’s because phone-it-in personalities like peter king fall for the same mystery box fallacy that so many here do. There is absolutely no guarantee any of those receivers he named become as good or better than diggs. If fact, given how good diggs already is at 26, chances are none of them will. But King’s a lost soul at this point. For all those other outlets’ preseason rankings mean nothing, King’s mean less than nothing. Disappointing people still give him clicks 2 decades after he peaked. 35 minutes ago, inaugural balls said: Pete has lost lost a LOT off his fastball. But he's still the king of peters everywhere. 1
ganesh Posted June 4, 2020 Posted June 4, 2020 15 hours ago, ALLEN-2-DIGGS-TD!! said: What a joke no way Dallas, Steelers and Raiders are ahead of us. That's ok we will make believers out of them. We need consistency at the QB position. Josh Allen will have it this year. We will be ahead of all of them for the next decade... He is dead on that for 68 minutes we had zero TDs in a playoff game against a very ordinary defense. That is inexcusable.
transplantbillsfan Posted June 4, 2020 Posted June 4, 2020 Can we just play already. 13th is ridiculous.
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