Florida Bills Fanatic Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 28 minutes ago, JESSEFEFFER said: I'm ok with it. Have an opinion and justify it with some rationale. He mentions his misses on his rankings from last year which is respectable. I think his take on the Diggs trade is way off. Tell us which one of the rookies that were available for the Bills to draft will be as good as or better than Stefon over the next 1, 2 or 4 years. The additional picks were mostly house money anyways and were not of much consequence. We have seen a trend where Beane likes to acquire extra draft capital and then use it to target the guys he believes in. His hit rate has been way better than most and the Bills are in the mix because of it. You're exactly correct. Beane has shown the ability to be right more often than not. King has been better than the average sportswriter over the years but that doesn't make his opinions more valid than Beane's judgement. King creates these rankings as click bait and to remain relevant. I accept them for what they are and move on. 1
iccrewman112 Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 1 hour ago, Ridgewaycynic2013 said: Best owner's haircut, 2017-2019. ? He was doing the quarantine hair it before it was cool. 2
Billl Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 There are 3 teams that I would consider to be elite, and those are KC, SF, and Baltimore. I don’t have any major issue with putting the following teams in any order after that first group: Rams Seahawks Packers Vikings Eagles Cowboys Saints Buccaneers Steelers Browns Broncos Patriots Bills Texans Titans Colts It isn’t unreasonable to think that any of those teams could finish at the top of that list or at the bottom of that list. The league changes so much from one season to the next that it’s also fair to throw in a couple of surprises like he did with the Raiders this year (and the 49ers which he nailed last year). Getting worked up over something like this is like getting mad over someone’s NCAA bracket. Don’t expect the Bills to get treated like Duke unless and until Allen can establish himself as a top QB (without having to add 100 qualifiers about how raw he was, how many drops he had, or who his middle school coach was). 3
MJS Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 So I guess that puts the Bills squarely in contention for the playoffs. That's about where this team is. Until they step it up on offense and start beating good teams, this is where the Bills will be ranked by outsiders. If the Bills have a 10+ win season again and win a playoff game, they'll be ranking the team much higher next year, especially if the offense is good. Elite defense and mediocre offense just isn't sexy these days. 1
y2zipper Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 1 hour ago, GunnerBill said: Agreed. I have the Raiders below .500. They have some talent on offense but Gruden hates Carr and the defense still has lots of holes for me. I think he's way too high on Tennessee and the Raiders, and I like what the raiders did this offseason. The take on Buffalo is fair here. There are expectations, and Allen has to be way better this year. 1
Jammer8732 Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 Well, that was a good season. Let’s take a look on who we drafted in 2021 and where we landed on the 2021 draft report card.
Shaw66 Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 3 hours ago, aristocrat said: That dictated a desperate move by GM Brandon Beane. He dealt first, fifth and sixth-round picks this year and a fourth next year for Stefon Diggs (three-year average: 76 catches, 1,000 yards, eight TDs) and a seven, which is a heavy price, particularly in a year with such strong receiving stock in the draft. Diggs will be judged on whether he can lift an offense in a slumber. But if any of the receivers available with the 22nd pick that Buffalo deal to the Vikes—Justin Jefferson, Brandon Aiyuk, Tee Higgins, Michael Pittman—turn into stars, Diggs had better be one in Buffalo. This kind of a comment demonstrates that King - like many others - is thinking more about writing something that is provocative than is informative. There simply was nothing "desperate" about what Beane did. He had a choice, which was use those picks, combined equal to a #18 pick, to draft one of those rookies, or to take Diggs. If the trade had never happened and the Bills drafted Justin Jefferson, let's say, King wouldn't have called it a "desperate" move, even though the risk is exactly the same. All Beane did was get what he thought was the best receiver available with the draft capital he had. It's just a question of personnel evaluation and making a decision. Some of those decisions work out some don't. King seems to think Beane made the wrong choice, but he doesn't tell us why he thinks that's the case. He doesn't show how the Bills with Jefferson and whomever they might have gotten with the fifth and sixth round picks would have been better than they will be with Diggs. And he doesn't consider what Beane said before the draft, which was that he could consider trading some of his later round picks, because it just isn't likely that guys taken in the later rounds were going to be able to make the roster. That comment was borne out when the Bills used fifth and sixth round picks to take a kicker and a backup QB who has almost no chance of playing this year. Why would the Bills have been better with Jefferson and those picks? It's just a nonsense comment. 3 1
Alphadawg7 Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 3 hours ago, ALLEN-2-DIGGS-TD!! said: What a joke no way Dallas, Steelers and Raiders are ahead of us. That's ok we will make believers out of them. Im ok with Pitt and Dallas being ranked ahead of us...I dont entirely agree, but its not aggregious, both have great rosters right now and both have QB's most people on the outside see as more established and better as of today (before the season begins). Personally, I think us, Dallas and Pitt (assuming Big Ben is healthy all year) are all playoff teams without question...barring injuries of course. So, however they rank that group of 3 is like splitting hairs IMO. But Raiders? Look, I dont think the Raiders are a bad team...they may even surprise this year and be a challenger for the wildcard. But they are not a playoff lock, and there is no way in hell they are a better team right now before the season begins than the Bills. Its just not even debatable. They are not a top 10 team...they could be a top 10 team, we wont know until the season begins. But based on what we know today, they are not deserving of being ranked in the top 10 nor ahead of us. We on the other hand are certainly a top 10 team. In fact, I would have no issue if he simply swapped our position with the Raiders position. 4
MassHog Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 Bringing up Allen throwing 40 less yards a game than Minshew is dumb. The bills were in/leading most of their games. The Jaguars were behind A LOT. Allen made a lot of throws when it mattered, which is why he led the league in game winning drives. 2
Billl Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 1 hour ago, Shaw66 said: This kind of a comment demonstrates that King - like many others - is thinking more about writing something that is provocative than is informative. There simply was nothing "desperate" about what Beane did. He had a choice, which was use those picks, combined equal to a #18 pick, to draft one of those rookies, or to take Diggs. If the trade had never happened and the Bills drafted Justin Jefferson, let's say, King wouldn't have called it a "desperate" move, even though the risk is exactly the same. All Beane did was get what he thought was the best receiver available with the draft capital he had. It's just a question of personnel evaluation and making a decision. Some of those decisions work out some don't. King seems to think Beane made the wrong choice, but he doesn't tell us why he thinks that's the case. He doesn't show how the Bills with Jefferson and whomever they might have gotten with the fifth and sixth round picks would have been better than they will be with Diggs. And he doesn't consider what Beane said before the draft, which was that he could consider trading some of his later round picks, because it just isn't likely that guys taken in the later rounds were going to be able to make the roster. That comment was borne out when the Bills used fifth and sixth round picks to take a kicker and a backup QB who has almost no chance of playing this year. Why would the Bills have been better with Jefferson and those picks? It's just a nonsense comment. It was absolutely a desperate move, and there’s nothing wrong with that. Buffalo’s window has officially opened, and the team was desperate for a #1 WR now as opposed to someone who might someday become one. Beane traded a TON of assets in order to acquire Diggs precisely because he was desperate. He determined that there was little to no chance of winning a championship with the popgun offense they had in 2019. After watching the Chiefs put 51 points up against the Texans, I don’t know what other conclusion a competent GM could have reached. You can quibble over the word if that’s what floats your boat, but trading that much draft capital and cap space is a move from a team desperate for a play making WR. 1
GunnerBill Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 4 minutes ago, Billl said: It was absolutely a desperate move, and there’s nothing wrong with that. Buffalo’s window has officially opened, and the team was desperate for a #1 WR now as opposed to someone who might someday become one. Beane traded a TON of assets in order to acquire Diggs precisely because he was desperate. He determined that there was little to no chance of winning a championship with the popgun offense they had in 2019. After watching the Chiefs put 51 points up against the Texans, I don’t know what other conclusion a competent GM could have reached. You can quibble over the word if that’s what floats your boat, but trading that much draft capital and cap space is a move from a team desperate for a play making WR. Yea people read "desperate" different ways. You look at the dictionary it gives two meanings: 1. "feeling or showing a hopeless sense that a situation is so bad as to be impossible to deal with" 2. "having a great need or desire for something" The first of those does not describe where the Bills were with the Diggs trade. The second definitely does though. If you read the word with the first meaning in mind then yes, you will feel it is inappropriate. If you read it the second way (which is how I read it initially, but then when I read posts here I did check myself and think "yea you could read that differently") then you won't have a problem with that statement. 1 1
Chandler#81 Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 4 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said: That’s ridiculous. I’m not sure I’d have the Raiders at 28 lol. 13 is too low on the Bills too. They’re the 3rd best team in the AFC. Yeah, but.. We could win the Division and not reach 10 wins because of the difficult schedule the AFC East plays, regarding currently very good opponents and lots of frequent flyer miles. That, to me, is why the Division games will be so impactful this year. I don’t see a WC coming from our Division -even with an additional team added to the playoffs. The pundits have set the bar so high for the Bills this coming season, that an 8-8 record while winning the Division will be cause for great animosity and consternation. Not that I GAF(art) Just get in and do some damage!
stinky finger Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 Peter King is tone deaf. And I’m just talking about his assessment of the Diggs trade. Nevermind his absurd ranking.
Billl Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 Posters here will argue for months that Allen is a great QB who was held back by his WRs. Then after Beane traded 5 draft picks for Diggs, those same posters will swear the Bills weren’t desperate for a WR.
Shaw66 Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 32 minutes ago, GunnerBill said: Yea people read "desperate" different ways. You look at the dictionary it gives two meanings: 1. "feeling or showing a hopeless sense that a situation is so bad as to be impossible to deal with" 2. "having a great need or desire for something" The first of those does not describe where the Bills were with the Diggs trade. The second definitely does though. If you read the word with the first meaning in mind then yes, you will feel it is inappropriate. If you read it the second way (which is how I read it initially, but then when I read posts here I did check myself and think "yea you could read that differently") then you won't have a problem with that statement. Excellent. Thanks. I very much read it with the first definition which, by the way, is the way it's supposed to be read. Words like this may have a primary and a secondary meaning, and when in doubt the writer should assume that people will go with the primary meaning. "Desperate" comes from "despair" and relates to "desperation," both or which imply some kind of emergency or dire situation. The Bills were not in an emergency situation, the team was not about to go down the drain if they didn't find a receiver. The very fact that the draft was full of receivers meant there was no reason for despair. The Bills didn't act out of desperation. Getting Diggs wasn't some last ditch effort to save a sinking ship. All the Bills did was choose among the available receivers.
Shaw66 Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, Billl said: It was absolutely a desperate move, and there’s nothing wrong with that. Buffalo’s window has officially opened, and the team was desperate for a #1 WR now as opposed to someone who might someday become one. Beane traded a TON of assets in order to acquire Diggs precisely because he was desperate. He determined that there was little to no chance of winning a championship with the popgun offense they had in 2019. After watching the Chiefs put 51 points up against the Texans, I don’t know what other conclusion a competent GM could have reached. You can quibble over the word if that’s what floats your boat, but trading that much draft capital and cap space is a move from a team desperate for a play making WR. You think it was desperation because you buy the concept of a window. I assume you believe the Bills have a 2-3 year window to win, after which they will have to start rebuilding. McBeane have been very clear that they are not operating the team on that concept. Their intention is to get good and stay good. Have a 12-15 "window" with Allen. They're building a team that they want to win for the next 10-15 years. Getting Diggs was not done because they thought some window might close before a first round pick got good. In fact, if they WERE operating on the window mentality, then the move definitely was NOT desperate. The move was smart team building - trading to picks to get the best players in the window is absolutely the right thing to do. Those late-round picks are useless if the window is now. Beane took Diggs because the chances are he will be better in 2020 than any player the Bills could have drafted, and also because he's young enough that he could be good for another 5-6 years, which isn't bad compared to the 6 or 7 or 8 good years he might get out of a guy he drafts (after that guy doesn't contribute very much his rookie season). Beane doesn't act out of desperation. Edited June 3, 2020 by Shaw66
HOUSE Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 Did you guys ever save these rankings? Always good for a Christmas Day laugh... I believe Cleveland was ranked #6 last year 1
Stank_Nasty Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 3 hours ago, MJS said: So I guess that puts the Bills squarely in contention for the playoffs. That's about where this team is. Until they step it up on offense and start beating good teams, this is where the Bills will be ranked by outsiders. If the Bills have a 10+ win season again and win a playoff game, they'll be ranking the team much higher next year, especially if the offense is good. Elite defense and mediocre offense just isn't sexy these days. this is honestly one of the lowest offseason power rankings ive seen for buffalo since the season ended. so I guess i'd have to disagree with you here. from all I've seen the general consensus seems to be right at the tail end of the top ten.
Billl Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 (edited) 9 minutes ago, HOUSE said: Did you guys ever save these rankings? Always good for a Christmas Day laugh... I believe Cleveland was ranked #6 last year No, the Browns were 11th. He caught hell last year for having SF too high at 7. KC was number 1, btw. He’s as good at this as anyone in the biz. Edited June 3, 2020 by Billl 3
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