Inside Cornelius Bennett’s exclusion from the Wall of Fame

[machine gun kelly]

I liked Bennett As a player, but don’t think he should be on the wall, but then I don’t like we have 31 names up there.  It should be incredibly special.  I know I’ll get roasted for this opinion, but I think people on the wall should be borderline HOF.

[JMF2006]

12 hours ago, That's No Moon said:

Really? I haven't sexually assaulted anyone or done jail time. Have you?

 

I say again, he was my favorite player as a kid. He doesn't deserve to be up.

 

If you read my post it says......   of some sort

 

No I have never sexually assaulted some one or done jail time.

 

If Ray Lewis can be in the HOF after what he allegedly did Biscuit  should be forgiven and put on the Bills WOF.

[Rochesterfan]

39 minutes ago, machine gun kelly said:

I liked Bennett As a player, but don’t think he should be on the wall, but then I don’t like we have 31 names up there.  It should be incredibly special.  I know I’ll get roasted for this opinion, but I think people on the wall should be borderline HOF.

 

I won’t roast you at all - it is a fine opinion.

 

For me the Wall does not represent HOF style greatness - that is what the HOF is for.  For me it should be for legacy type players that did something special in their time in Buffalo.  For most players that is - playing a long time at a high level (like HOF caliber) or being very good and making an iconic style play (like Stratton) or even being a player that gave your life for you country like (Kalsu).  
 

The only real player I question on the Wall was Phil Hansen - he gave his heart to the team for a number of years, but he never made the iconic play or long term excellence that should be needed.  You can easily tell the story of the Bills franchise and leave Hansen out and it would have no impact. I am on the fence about Smerlas (one of my favorite Bills growing up) as he was iconic for various reasons (look at that ‘stache), but he is really more a foot note in history.

 

Now as to the original post about Bennett - I could go either way.  His career gave Him enough during his time in Buffalo that he was a better player than some on the Wall, but he was behind 2 other WOFers from that era.  There was also the run in with the law that impacts his status.  He does some more iconic style of plays (Sacks of Elway, etc), but if leadership feel the charges overweigh that - I am fine.  He is a man that based solely on the play on the field is more deserving that some already on the Wall, but taken in total - I get it and i have no issue keeping him off the Wall.

 

I have the same feeling about OJ.  He deserves to be there based upon his play on the field - same with the HOF, but if he was just becoming eligible now with what we know - I don’t think he gets on the Wall.  The HOF is another story as they let Ray Lewis in - so I can’t say the HOF would keep OJ out, but I think they would have serious talks with the Wall about not being included.

Edited May 16, 2020 by Rochesterfan

[TH3]

11 hours ago, BillsShredder83 said:

I cant find specifics on what happened with Bennett and I was very very young! Anyone have a story summary for me and the other younger posters

Sexually assaulted a girl in the a$&. He was huge...she had to get stitches.

 

 

[Ethan in Cleveland]

14 hours ago, jwhit34 said:

The Wall of Fame roster is kind of odd:

 

Offense: 12

Defense: 9

Special Teams: 1 (Tasker)

Coaches: 2

Admin: 3 (Wilson, Polian, McGroder)

Other: 3 (Van Miller, 12th Man, Eddie Abramoski)

War Vet: 1 (Kalsu)

 

That they have as many members who are not in for their play (I include Kalsu in the group since he played in only 14 games) is kind of odd. It is also pretty strange that the committee hasn't met in 3 years. 

 

If you look at the defensive players (B. Smith, Talley, Edgerson, Sestak, Hansen, R. James, Stratton, Saimes, Smerlas), I would say Bennett was definitely better than Hansen, probably better than Stratton and Saimes, and would get the nod over James, who had 2-3 terrific years but a short career. Bennett's best 2-3 years were as good or better than James' best 2-3 years.

 

Talley is beloved because he was the soul of the defense. They had different roles but in 9 years in Buffalo he had 52.5 sacks, 6 Ints., 22 forced fumbles and 19 fumble recoveries. In 12 years Talley had 38.5 sacks, 11 ints., 14 forced fumbles and 12 fumble recoveries. They both averaged 6 tackles a game. 

 

I think Bennett is one of the 5-6 best defensive players in Bills history. Bennett and Moulds should be the next two that go in. 

Talley is top of the list of most overrated Bills. Bennett 

, Schobel, Fred Jackson, Moulds,  and Ruben Brown are deserving of the wall. 

2 hours ago, machine gun kelly said:

I liked Bennett As a player, but don’t think he should be on the wall, but then I don’t like we have 31 names up there.  It should be incredibly special.  I know I’ll get roasted for this opinion, but I think people on the wall should be borderline HOF.

1 hour ago, Rochesterfan said:

 

I won’t roast you at all - it is a fine opinion.

 

For me the Wall does not represent HOF style greatness - that is what the HOF is for.  For me it should be for legacy type players that did something special in their time in Buffalo.  For most players that is - playing a long time at a high level (like HOF caliber) or being very good and making an iconic style play (like Stratton) or even being a player that gave your life for you country like (Kalsu).  
 

The only real player I question on the Wall was Phil Hansen - he gave his heart to the team for a number of years, but he never made the iconic play or long term excellence that should be needed.  You can easily tell the story of the Bills franchise and leave Hansen out and it would have no impact. I am on the fence about Smerlas (one of my favorite Bills growing up) as he was iconic for various reasons (look at that ‘stache), but he is really more a foot note in history.

 

Now as to the original post about Bennett - I could go either way.  His career gave Him enough during his time in Buffalo that he was a better player than some on the Wall, but he was behind 2 other WOFers from that era.  There was also the run in with the law that impacts his status.  He does some more iconic style of plays (Sacks of Elway, etc), but if leadership feel the charges overweigh that - I am fine.  He is a man that based solely on the play on the field is more deserving that some already on the Wall, but taken in total - I get it and i have no issue keeping him off the Wall.

 

I have the same feeling about OJ.  He deserves to be there based upon his play on the field - same with the HOF, but if he was just becoming eligible now with what we know - I don’t think he gets on the Wall.  The HOF is another story as they let Ray Lewis in - so I can’t say the HOF would keep OJ out, but I think they would have serious talks with the Wall about not being included.

What is Ferguson’s iconic moment? Injuring his ankle in 1980?

[Phil The Thrill]

This is a really tough one and I’m not sure what the right answer is.  On one hand, based on his play there’s no doubt CB deserves to be on the wall.  But the charge against him was pretty bad and is probably taken more seriously in 2020 than it was back in 1997. 

 

Marv’s point that Bennet paid his debt to society by serving jail time and also staying trouble free for 23 years is worth considering as well.  
 

I think in the end, the potential backlash and negative PR that the Bills would face for putting CB on the wall, would greatly outweigh any of the benefits.  So IMO the decision to exclude him is playing it safe from a PR standpoint.  

16 hours ago, Niagara Bill said:

Yes OJ and should be IMHO.

Bennett was simply one of the very top linebacker athletes of his time. A great steal by Polian.Speed, power length. BUT second in importance at LB to Talley.

The difference is that OJ was on the Wall already before the 1993 Brentwood murders.  I highly doubt they would put him on the Wall after the trial.  

[2ForMacAdoo]

8 hours ago, Paup 1995MVP said:

Thanks for those numbers on Bennett and Talley.  Two great LB's.  Two great leaders.   Bennett should most definitely be on the wall.  He made so many big plays.  And lets not forget the blocked FG return for the TD against Denver in 1990 that started us on our way to the SUPER BOWL.  Lets hope Edmunds and Millano can play near those two's level.  Millano is not quite that level of an athlete.  But lets hope Edmunds gets there some day.

That blocked FG return for the TD against Denver in 1990 was epic. We were sitting in the opposite endzone and I don't ever remember screamimg any louder at any Bills game (or any sports event for that matter) his entire 80 yard run down the sideline. As the great Van Miller would say, it was pandemonium, fandemonium. At the end of that run, I don't know who was more gassed, Cornelius or us! To me, Cornelius was an elite football player and put that team over the top. He is more deserving than Talley to be on the Wall and for me it isn't even close. Playmaker.

[4_kidd_4]

Stop livin in the paaaasst maaaan.

 

Will we ever get past the 90’s obsession? Good times indeed, but it’s ancient history at this point. 

 

Bennett did terrible things = Bennet not on wall.

 

Kudos to Ralph for having conviction in an era where these clowns are put on pedestals and everyone makes excuses for them because they can play a game.

 

“The Atlanta linebacker Cornelius Bennett was sentenced to 60 days in jail for sexual misconduct, four weeks after his wife gave birth to a daughter.“

 

“The case involved a woman in her 20's, whom Bennett had known for a number of years. The woman, who went to Bennett's hotel room at his invitation, was treated for trauma and skin cuts after their sexual encounter.”
 

Stop making excuses for what turned out to be another NFL violent rockhead. 

[Niagara Bill]

9 hours ago, Phil The Thrill said:

This is a really tough one and I’m not sure what the right answer is.  On one hand, based on his play there’s no doubt CB deserves to be on the wall.  But the charge against him was pretty bad and is probably taken more seriously in 2020 than it was back in 1997. 

 

Marv’s point that Bennet paid his debt to society by serving jail time and also staying trouble free for 23 years is worth considering as well.  
 

I think in the end, the potential backlash and negative PR that the Bills would face for putting CB on the wall, would greatly outweigh any of the benefits.  So IMO the decision to exclude him is playing it safe from a PR standpoint.  

The difference is that OJ was on the Wall already before the 1993 Brentwood murders.  I highly doubt they would put him on the Wall after the trial.  

True about the timing of the Brentwood "How to get away with murder" timing.

But CB did not committ murder...but it was serious for sure. Personally I had dismissed Bennett from wall as a result...don't need the controversy,  we had enough with Flutie Johnson...?

[Niagara Bill]

8 hours ago, 4_kidd_4 said:

Stop livin in the paaaasst maaaan.

 

Will we ever get past the 90’s obsession? Good times indeed, but it’s ancient history at this point. 

 

Bennett did terrible things = Bennet not on wall.

 

Kudos to Ralph for having conviction in an era where these clowns are put on pedestals and everyone makes excuses for them because they can play a game.

 

“The Atlanta linebacker Cornelius Bennett was sentenced to 60 days in jail for sexual misconduct, four weeks after his wife gave birth to a daughter.“

 

“The case involved a woman in her 20's, whom Bennett had known for a number of years. The woman, who went to Bennett's hotel room at his invitation, was treated for trauma and skin cuts after their sexual encounter.”
 

Stop making excuses for what turned out to be another NFL violent rockhead. 

Hey maaaann, if I choose to remember one of the best era of football in Buffalo I will and others will.

20 years from now I hope you can remember fondly the exploits of Josh, Diggs, Oliver, Milano, Tre, Devin...like we remember Jim, Andre, Bruce, Thurman, Pete, Darryl, Mark, Steve....Marv, Bill, 

Remember...while today we call it the Bills Mafia, .....the mafia started a long time ago...and we do not live in the past, we just respect the players and fans from the past. 

If you didn't have Abe Lincoln, you wouldn't have Donald Trump...oops bad metaphor

 

 

[Helpmenow]

31 minutes ago, Moonzoo said:

Put CB up. The WOF should not be governed by St. Peter.

Agree

[Johnny Hammersticks]

Biscuit punched my older brother right in the mouth at a bar on Chippewa back during the SB years.  My brother is a wise ass, so I’m sure he deserved it though ?

[njbuff]

Remember, Bennett carried a pretty bad Bills D in 1991 when Bruce was out most of the year. And when Bruce came back in 1991, he wasn't his stellar self.

 

Bennett could have won NFL DMVP if it wasn't for Pat Swilling.

[Paup 1995MVP]

On 5/16/2020 at 9:05 AM, 2ForMacAdoo said:

That blocked FG return for the TD against Denver in 1990 was epic. We were sitting in the opposite endzone and I don't ever remember screamimg any louder at any Bills game (or any sports event for that matter) his entire 80 yard run down the sideline. As the great Van Miller would say, it was pandemonium, fandemonium. At the end of that run, I don't know who was more gassed, Cornelius or us! To me, Cornelius was an elite football player and put that team over the top. He is more deserving than Talley to be on the Wall and for me it isn't even close. Playmaker.

That was an amazing play and overall comeback in that game.  Bennett was an elite player.  Talley was pretty dam good also.  Maybe not as good an athlete.  But a very good football player and great team leader.  

 

I love your user name.  I remember Bob MacAdoo as a kid.  Wow could he shoot.  He was tremendous.  Did he lead the league in scoring 3 years in a row in the mid 70's?  How good a jump shot did he have!!

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

17 hours ago, Moonzoo said:

Put CB up. The WOF should not be governed by St. Peter.

Then you need to convince the committee looking after the Wall.

[Helpmenow]

Best all around linebacker the bills have had

[Clutchwarfare]

I might have missed it because I couldn't read every single post here, but has anyone addressed the fact that the accuser was later arrested in a massive crack cocaine distribution ring?

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/bennetts-accuser-arrested/

Edited May 17, 2020 by Clutchwarfare
Link added

[Kirby Jackson]

On 5/16/2020 at 5:29 AM, machine gun kelly said:

I liked Bennett As a player, but don’t think he should be on the wall, but then I don’t like we have 31 names up there.  It should be incredibly special.  I know I’ll get roasted for this opinion, but I think people on the wall should be borderline HOF.

I may get roasted for this but he was the 4th best player on those Super Bowl teams (ahead of Kelly). It was Bruce, (space), (space), Thurman, Reed, Bennett. His career is absolutely WOF worthy but I 100% get why he isn’t up there. 

1 hour ago, Ridgewaycynic2013 said:

Then you need to convince the committee looking after the Wall.

Edited May 17, 2020 by Kirby Jackson

[Thurman#1]

On 5/16/2020 at 6:42 AM, GaryPinC said:

Yeah, as many great plays as that defense could make we can thank Walt Corey for them being soft.  Saw an interview back then in the USA Today, Walt didn't believe in giving them a lot of rules, stunts, responsibilities and to me that's why we were soft.  He liked to just "line them up and let 'em play".

 

Part of the blame also falls on Marv Levy, despite the score of the first super bowl our defense got badly outplayed there and in the next 2 , (the entire team folded its tents in second half #4) and Levy never made the coaching change.  Definition of insanity, IMO.  Drove me crazy at the time, I'll always believe that D could have been far more elite.  Never bought the "no huddle means the defense spends more time on the field.  True to a degree, but a shut-down D is a shut-down D.

 

 

Not so much, IMO.

 

Much more about being built to stop the pass rather than the run due to being in a division filled with deadly passing attacks, the Fins in particular. And because of that our DL in particular was built small through the middle.

 

How many 3-4 defences - then or ever - have we seen with the nose tackle, Jeff Wright for us, being 274 pounds? That's the main problem with us being soft against the run against power rush teams, which is what we faced in those Super Bowls.

[BillsPride12]

6 minutes ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

Not so much, IMO.

 

Much more about being built to stop the pass rather than the run due to being in a division filled with deadly passing attacks, the Fins in particular. And because of that our DL in particular was built small through the middle.

 

How many 3-4 defences - then or ever - have we seen with the nose tackle, Jeff Wright for us, being 274 pounds? That's the main problem with us being soft against the run against power rush teams, which is what we faced in those Super Bowls.

The irony is we had two Stout Nose Tackles both right before the Super Bowl runs and after(Smerlas and Ted Washington).  Imagine one of them in place of Jeff Wright during the Super Bowl years.