Inside Cornelius Bennett’s exclusion from the Wall of Fame

[first_and_ten]

1 hour ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

????

 

for the record, my name is just a pun on Bennett and sea biscuit.  I was young but I remember him being slightly overrated.  Very good but should have been great especially playing with Bruce.  My young mind remembers that our defense was soft and should have been much better with the players we had.

 

I had always felt that it was Walt Corey that held this defense back.He used a basic defense. He didn't want to use a complicated scheme for whatever reason. I think he had the mindset that you need to beat your man one on one. In my humble opinion, if he had used more stunts and complex blitz packages they would have had more success. 

[Bob in STL]

1 hour ago, jwhit34 said:

The Wall of Fame roster is kind of odd:

 

Offense: 12

Defense: 9

Special Teams: 1 (Tasker)

Coaches: 2

Admin: 3 (Wilson, Polian, McGroder)I

Other: 3 (Van Miller, 12th Man, Eddie Abramoski)

War Vet: 1 (Kalsu)

 

That they have as many members who are not in for their play (I include Kalsu in the group since he played in only 14 games) is kind of odd. It is also pretty strange that the committee hasn't met in 3 years. 

 

If you look at the defensive players (B. Smith, Talley, Edgerson, Sestak, Hansen, R. James, Stratton, Saimes, Smerlas), I would say Bennett was definitely better than Hansen, probably better than Stratton and Saimes, and would get the nod over James, who had 2-3 terrific years but a short career. Bennett's best 2-3 years were as good or better than James' best 2-3 years.

 

Talley is beloved because he was the soul of the defense. They had different roles but in 9 years in Buffalo he had 52.5 sacks, 6 Ints., 22 forced fumbles and 19 fumble recoveries. In 12 years Talley had 38.5 sacks, 11 ints., 14 forced fumbles and 12 fumble recoveries. They both averaged 6 tackles a game. 

 

I think Bennett is one of the 5-6 best defensive players in Bills history. Bennett and Moulds should be the next two that go in. 

There are too many on there, but Kalsu is not one of them.  I saw him play as a rookie and he was good and had even more promise.  Then he served.   He belongs on there.  

Edited May 15, 2020 by Bob in STL

[njbuff]

Bigger question should be is..............

 

"Why am I not on the Wall darnit"?

[TroutDog]

2 hours ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

????

 

for the record, my name is just a pun on Bennett and sea biscuit.  I was young but I remember him being slightly overrated.  Very good but should have been great especially playing with Bruce.  My young mind remembers that our defense was soft and should have been much better with the players we had.

Biscuit was awesome! That D had so many great players and he was certainly one. Second coming of LT, certainly not, but he was great in my opinion. 

56 minutes ago, folz said:

 

I was in high school at the start of the Super Bowl years. In the offseason, some of the Bills players would travel around to high schools to play basketball against the faculty of the school for charity. I can't remember every player that came, but it was definitely Andre, Tasker (I remember being shocked that he could dunk), Cornelius, maybe Thurman, and a few others. My buddy and I got to be the announcers for the game and at one point Cornelius scored a layup and I shouted into my mic, "Biscuit for two!" And as that rang out across the PA system in the gym, Cornelius, who was running back up court, looked up at me sternly and shook his head and wagged his finger at me (as if to say, "Don't call me Biscuit"). Not sure why (thought it was his nickname), but I have never referred to him as Biscuit since. ?

 

But, Bennett is definitely Wall of Fame worthy in my opinion. He really was the final piece that put that team over the top into championship-caliber level. I guess it just depends on if the club is ok having his name up there with that past incident. I realize that it's a tough call in these times, but I would be ok with him going up on the "Wall" at this point. To err is human, to forgive, divine.

Very cool story! Thanks for sharing!

[1ManRaid]

33 minutes ago, That's No Moon said:

Really? I haven't sexually assaulted anyone or done jail time. Have you?

 

I say again, he was my favorite player as a kid. He doesn't deserve to be up.

That attitude of "comon who hasn't engaged in a bit of light felonious action" to defend their favorite celebrities is surprising common on social media.

24 minutes ago, Bob in STL said:

There are too many on there, but Kalsu is not one of them.  I saw him play as a rookie and he was good and had even more promise.  Then he served.   He belongs on there.  

Maybe I'm in the minority, but I don't think military service should be the automatic pass to esteem and hero status that most seem to feel.  The military spends a crap load of money advertising to reinforce the idea that service is still the pinnacle of nobility and necessary to our safety (hasn't been for decades) because they make that much more money in return.

[Buffalo86]

I can't help but to think our no-huddle / K-gun offense played a big part in our defense not being all that it could have been.  Had Buddy Ryan been our DC, Marchibroda probably would've gotten a punch in the mouth.

[RangerDave]

I'm a big fan of Biscuit, too, but I can't but wonder how the person that he sexually assaulted would feel about seeing his name honored on a Wall of Fame.

[Gugny]

He's a sex offender.  Should not be on the wall.  And OJ should be removed.

 

Have some ***** class, Pegulas.

[Call_Of_Ktulu]

2 hours ago, BillsPride12 said:

My thoughts on the Bennett Wall of Fame thing have always been this:

 

I'm aware of what happened and no I don't condone that by any means but I also think it's a little unfair because none of those other star players were Saints during their playing days, they just might not have gone through an actual legal case regarding some of their misdeeds to society.  From what I see nowadays Cornelius looks like he has grown up and matured just like the rest of those guys.  He was such an important piece to those Super Bowl teams...much more so than a guy like Phil Hansen(nothing against him).  It seems like such a glaring omission to not have the Biscuit recognized when you think back to those glory years.  I would imagine Lawrence Taylor is in the Giants Wall of Fame equivalent  and his off the field problems were well documented so I guess all I'm saying is give Biscuit his due.  The fact he has had to wait this long is punishment enough .  

The thing with Bennett he had a ton of hype coming out of college.  I mean being hyped up as the next Lawrence Taylor level hype so it is true that he didn't quite live up to those expectations.  But he was still a great player.  Not hall of fame great, but definitely wall of fame great.  In the 91 season when Bruce was injured most of the year Biscuit had to anchor the defensive line by himself and was AFC defensive player of the year.  

Do you have make it into the HOF to be on the WOF?

[BillsPride12]

8 minutes ago, Call_Of_Ktulu said:

Do you have make it into the HOF to be on the WOF?

No most of the guys on the WOF were not Hall of Famers

[BillsShredder83]

I cant find specifics on what happened with Bennett and I was very very young! Anyone have a story summary for me and the other younger posters

[That's No Moon]

1 hour ago, 1ManRaid said:

Maybe I'm in the minority, but I don't think military service should be the automatic pass to esteem and hero status that most seem to feel.  The military spends a crap load of money advertising to reinforce the idea that service is still the pinnacle of nobility and necessary to our safety (hasn't been for decades) because they make that much more money in return.

It is wildly unpopular but I'm with you on this. There are bad people in the military just like everywhere else and deifying people who put on a uniform has dangerous consequences. 

 

Do not misinterpret, my family has a strong history of service and I appreciate it but serving does not grant you super citizen status. You are just like the rest of us with the same rights as the rest of us.

[Bob in STL]

1 hour ago, 1ManRaid said:

Maybe I'm in the minority, but I don't think military service should be the automatic pass to esteem and hero status that most seem to feel.  The military spends a crap load of money advertising to reinforce the idea that service is still the pinnacle of nobility and necessary to our safety (hasn't been for decades) because they make that much more money in return.

You are certainly entitled to you opinion.  Everyone should be free to choose who they admire.  
 

Mine opinion is that pretty much everything in the bolded sentence is wrong.  

[offsides#76FredSmerlas]

3 hours ago, ColeB said:

True, Bruce had some incidents with the one I remember most being when he was drunk and fell asleep behind the wheel at a traffic light.

DWI and suspended on drug violation for 4 games

1 hour ago, Gugny said:

He's a sex offender.  Should not be on the wall.  And OJ should be removed.

 

Have some ***** class, Pegulas.

OJ was guilty by public opinion. Most including myself think he is guilty but we don't make that decision so that's probably why he is still on the wall.  I know he did some other stuff that he was convicted of but he never got charged for murder or for abusing his wife.

[Gugny]

32 minutes ago, Offside#76FredSmerlas said:

DWI and suspended on drug violation for 4 games

OJ was guilty by public opinion. Most including myself think he is guilty but we don't make that decision so that's probably why he is still on the wall.  I know he did some other stuff that he was convicted of but he never got charged for murder or for abusing his wife.

 

He's a murderer.  Stop it.

[K-9]

5 hours ago, Niagara Bill said:

Yes OJ and should be IMHO.

Bennett was simply one of the very top linebacker athletes of his time. A great steal by Polian.Speed, power length. BUT second in importance at LB to Talley.

I love Talley as much as the next guy, but signing Bennett immediately changed the power structure in the AFCE because we could get to the passer and the road to the AFCE led through the arm of Marino.  Shula himself even said so. 

Edited May 16, 2020 by K-9

[Lurker]

5 hours ago, jwhit34 said:

It is also pretty strange that the committee hasn't met in 3 years. 

 

The committee was basically Ralph and everyone else he named to it...

 

2 hours ago, BillsShredder83 said:

I cant find specifics on what happened with Bennett and I was very very young! Anyone have a story summary for me and the other younger posters

 

Size ten salami in a size six *******...

 

Edited May 16, 2020 by Lurker

[Zona]

I remember Bennett's first game. It was against Denver. He didn't start, and the announcers kept talking about "when will see Bennett"?

 

The defense was ok, not great. No pressure on Denver qb at all.

 

Then Bennett came on the field on a first down. First play, he was single blocked and and got great pressure.

 

Second down, he was double teamed by the rb or a te. He still got by and got great pressure again.

 

Third down, they double team him with two lineman, roll the qb away from him, and he still chased him around.

 

I knew then that our team was going to be awesome. He was without a doubt, the reason we became a yearly sb team. Our pass rush was now scary.

 

And I don't think he belongs on the wall. And o.j should be removed.

[Paup 1995MVP]

6 hours ago, jwhit34 said:

The Wall of Fame roster is kind of odd:

 

Offense: 12

Defense: 9

Special Teams: 1 (Tasker)

Coaches: 2

Admin: 3 (Wilson, Polian, McGroder)

Other: 3 (Van Miller, 12th Man, Eddie Abramoski)

War Vet: 1 (Kalsu)

 

That they have as many members who are not in for their play (I include Kalsu in the group since he played in only 14 games) is kind of odd. It is also pretty strange that the committee hasn't met in 3 years. 

 

If you look at the defensive players (B. Smith, Talley, Edgerson, Sestak, Hansen, R. James, Stratton, Saimes, Smerlas), I would say Bennett was definitely better than Hansen, probably better than Stratton and Saimes, and would get the nod over James, who had 2-3 terrific years but a short career. Bennett's best 2-3 years were as good or better than James' best 2-3 years.

 

Talley is beloved because he was the soul of the defense. They had different roles but in 9 years in Buffalo he had 52.5 sacks, 6 Ints., 22 forced fumbles and 19 fumble recoveries. In 12 years Talley had 38.5 sacks, 11 ints., 14 forced fumbles and 12 fumble recoveries. They both averaged 6 tackles a game. 

 

I think Bennett is one of the 5-6 best defensive players in Bills history. Bennett and Moulds should be the next two that go in. 

Thanks for those numbers on Bennett and Talley.  Two great LB's.  Two great leaders.   Bennett should most definitely be on the wall.  He made so many big plays.  And lets not forget the blocked FG return for the TD against Denver in 1990 that started us on our way to the SUPER BOWL.  Lets hope Edmunds and Millano can play near those two's level.  Millano is not quite that level of an athlete.  But lets hope Edmunds gets there some day.

[Buftex]

9 hours ago, Gregthekeg said:

Ummmm not they are anything the same, in scope or magnitude, but wasnt/isnt OJ on the wall....?

OJ was on the wall before his alleged crime.  I would imagine, had he not already been up on the wall prior, he wouldn't be under consideration for inclusion on the wall.  I may be mis-remembering this as fact, as opposed to rumor...but I could have sworn that when the Pegulas first purchased the team, there was a notion that the new owners would remove Simpson from the wall...but it was met with much backlash.