Rams stadium needs 500 mill more .. hopefully portends well for our situation..

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

11 hours ago, Happy said:

 

Really they should be content with moving back to SD.  Hopefully there is enough of that bridge left that they can cross back over.

South Dakota?  Under the cover of night, ala the Baltimore Colts?  ?

[papazoid]

the whole concept of cost over runs being normal is strange.

 

imagine you get a quote do re-do a bathroom for $10,000 then later on, are told it will now cost $20,000

 

it's crazy....there is no incentive to get the bid right the first time around

[Back2Buff]

Humility should come with this pandemic and the NFL better act accordingly.  Sports can be gone tomorrow and there is no need for these expensive stadiums.  It's a stadium, not a hospital.

 

The good thing that could come out of this for the Bills is that if they are giving 900 million to LA to pay back in 30 years, you have to offer that to the Bills.  I'm not sure of the interest rate, but if they are using prime, its essentially zero % interest right now.  You could probably build a sufficient enough stadium in Buffalo for 1 billion.  Paying back 30 million a year is very doable.

[JohnC]

2 hours ago, K-9 said:

Why? In a nutshell, a palace stadium creates more revenue you don’t have to share.

The problem is that although a palace stadium will theoretically create more revenue it doesn't necessarily mean that the increased revenue is enough to make the exorbitant bond payments to pay for the glitzy palace. You can't fault people for not factoring in their costs the decline of revenue from an unexpected once in a century health cataclysm. The new reality is that the current and subsequent post virus repercussions have changed the economic landscape not only in the sports business but also in many different businesses. The belief that there was always going to be an exponential growth in revenues from the business of the NFL seemed reasonable less than six months ago. That premise no longer holds.   

[Mr. WEO]

16 hours ago, boater said:

Whether this "portends well" is debatable. But it is certainly meaningful in one way or another.

 

Buffalo is susceptible to price overruns on major construction (why would be a discussion for PPP).

 

But you know costs overruns must be clearly on the mind of major players (Pegula's, Poloncarz, Cuomo) when they are looking at all the alternatives.

 

 

I see no connection.  This was an insanely ambitious project unlike anything else ever.  Even Vegas is coming at under 2 billion finished.  LA isn't simply cost overruns, it's poor planning.

 

Anyway, there's zero tax money for a new Bills stadium, no matter what it would cost or not cost. If it wasn't clear before the pandemic, it is now. 

[MarkyMannn]

16 hours ago, 4_kidd_4 said:

We have schools and public services to fund.

 

Stadium is going to take a far back seat to C19 and its after effects

 

Schools funding?  I know a number of school people and not a single one got laid off after classes stopped.  All collected full pay.  They were not affected.  

 

Any one want to chime in with estimates of local, school, county and state tax increases for next year.  Start with around 20%

[Happy]

3 hours ago, Ridgewaycynic2013 said:

South Dakota?  Under the cover of night, ala the Baltimore Colts?  ?

San Diego, where they came from.  They're going back at some point, so why put off the inevitable.

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

10 minutes ago, Happy said:

San Diego, where they came from.  They're going back at some point, so why put off the inevitable.

Understood.  I was stretching the limits of believability with my inane suggestion.  ?

[PromoTheRobot]

1 hour ago, JohnC said:

The problem is that although a palace stadium will theoretically create more revenue it doesn't necessarily mean that the increased revenue is enough to make the exorbitant bond payments to pay for the glitzy palace. You can't fault people for not factoring in their costs the decline of revenue from an unexpected once in a century health cataclysm. The new reality is that the current and subsequent post virus repercussions have changed the economic landscape not only in the sports business but also in many different businesses. The belief that there was always going to be an exponential growth in revenues from the business of the NFL seemed reasonable less than six months ago. That premise no longer holds.   

 

In a way this is great for the Bills. As much as I would have liked a new downtown dome, staying at NewEra makes the most financial sense. The Bills are profitable thanks to a lack of debt service. My only concern are the upper decks. Will they remain standing. Ever feel them move when everyone is jumping up and down? 

[JohnC]

1 minute ago, PromoTheRobot said:

 

In a way this is great for the Bills. As much as I would have liked a new downtown dome, staying at NewEra makes the most financial sense. The Bills are profitable thanks to a lack of debt service. My only concern are the upper decks. Will they remain standing. Ever feel them move when everyone is jumping up and down? 

There is no doubt that the business climate because of the public health crisis has dramatically changed the situation. But that doesn't change the reality that this very aged stadium is crumbling. The issue is do you invest money in rehabbing the current stadium or do you build a new stadium that is more spartan than some of the newer facilities. If the cost of repeated renovations is comparable or more than the cost of a newer facility does it make sense to put money into a losing proposition?  My sense is that out of necessity the decision is going to be delayed because of the fiscal environment. But that doesn't mean that it can be avoided. 

[4_kidd_4]

1 hour ago, MarkyMannn said:

 

Schools funding?  I know a number of school people and not a single one got laid off after classes stopped.  All collected full pay.  They were not affected.  

 

Yeah bc the 2019-20 budget was already set. And also, hooray for unions!

 

It’s the 2020-21 budget that could be in trouble.

[YoloinOhio]

18 hours ago, Mark Vader said:

The Chargers aren't paying anything?

No. Well, they need to give kroenke the money from their PSL sales. But there is no amount they are required to sell as part of the deal. 

16 hours ago, Happy said:

 

Really they should be content with moving back to SD.  Hopefully there is enough of that bridge left that they can cross back over.

They are locked into the LA stadium lease until 2040

Edited May 15, 2020 by YoloinOhio

[YoloinOhio]

53 minutes ago, Happy said:

San Diego, where they came from.  They're going back at some point, so why put off the inevitable.

Not anytime in the next 20 years 

[Happy]

34 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

Not anytime in the next 20 years 

 

Wow, this is a terrible deal.  I'll bet both sides are going to regret this.

[YoloinOhio]

3 minutes ago, Happy said:

 

Wow, this is a terrible deal.  I'll bet both sides are going to regret this.

The chargers also have two additional 10 year options after 2040 that they control - so it’s a 20-40 year lease agreement for them which they pay $1/year. The nfl strong armed kroenke into the deal and btw kroenke and spanos hate each other 

Edited May 15, 2020 by YoloinOhio

[K-9]

3 hours ago, JohnC said:

The problem is that although a palace stadium will theoretically create more revenue it doesn't necessarily mean that the increased revenue is enough to make the exorbitant bond payments to pay for the glitzy palace. You can't fault people for not factoring in their costs the decline of revenue from an unexpected once in a century health cataclysm. The new reality is that the current and subsequent post virus repercussions have changed the economic landscape not only in the sports business but also in many different businesses. The belief that there was always going to be an exponential growth in revenues from the business of the NFL seemed reasonable less than six months ago. That premise no longer holds.   

That certainly answers the “why not” but I was strictly concentrating on the “why.” 
 

It will be interesting to see which and to what degree those revenue generating corporate sponsors at stadiums around the league have been hurt. 

[Don Otreply]

19 hours ago, Seasons1992 said:

Considering NYS is now in a $61B hole, there are two things that will happen with any new stadium:

 

1. Pegula's are paying for it 100%.

2. They retrofit New Era as-is. 

 

There's no way in the next 3-5 years they would consider building a brand new place.

As much as I have my own desire for a down town stadium, with the current economic situation that is unlikely to get better soon. New Era is where the Bills will be playing for the next two decades at minimum. Imo this stadium discussion is officially shelved for the foreseeable future. Unless Terry and Kim foot the total bill. 
 

Go Bills!!!

Edited May 15, 2020 by Don Otreply

[Saxum]

46 minutes ago, K-9 said:

That certainly answers the “why not” but I was strictly concentrating on the “why.” 
 

It will be interesting to see which and to what degree those revenue generating corporate sponsors at stadiums around the league have been hurt. 

 

See thread:

 

[CIrvine]

Paging Steve Ballmer.

[sullim4]

22 hours ago, matter2003 said:

How the hell can costs go from $2.2 Billion to $5-6 Billion?  Someone is bilking them...

 

This may not sit well with some on here... but contractors aren't exactly known for their ethics and wonderful customer service.  This is particularly true in massive projects like a stadium - you likely have layers of subcontractors in there that all want to fatten their profit margin and so everybody gets their take.  Flaws get exposed in designs, additional mitigation becomes required to get final approval on permits, etc.  All that costs money and contractors can take advantage of the fact that you really have no choice but to pay them more.

 

It's so hard to find good, ethical contractors.  You have to find people that enjoy what they do and make profits because of the quality of their people and their work -- in today's times this is increasingly difficult to find.