Rank the AFC Teams as of Now

[GunnerBill]

52 minutes ago, eball said:

I've spoken to Ravens fans who refer to their offense as a "house of cards."

 

And the "card" that you can't touch, but for the whole lot falling down, really is the traditional run game. If you can take that away it forces them into 2nd and 3rd and long scenarios. And that is where you can do a good job of clogging those passing lanes in the middle of the field that Jackson loves to exploit and force him to throw outside the numbers. Of course there will always be 4 or 5 3rd and longs in a game that Jackson converts with his legs - so what? Ignore those, they will happen. Take the traditional run game away and get them into 2nd and 8 or worse 3 times per drive. You will get them off the field. That is why I disagree with those who don't think JK Dobbins was a necessary pick. He absolutely was because if Ingram slows down - and he definitely did late last season - it makes Jackson's job much harder.

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

On 4/26/2020 at 3:28 AM, Big Blitz said:

1. Chiefs (the champs)

2. Ravens 

3. Bills 

4. Steelers 

5. Broncos 

6. Titans

7. Texans

8. Patriots

9. Browns 

10. Colts 

11. Raiders

12. Jets

13. Dolphins 

14. Chargers 

15. Jaguars 

16. Bengals 

 

 

Seems mostly right.  I think Browns could surprise with with some better coaching and QB play.  Chargers could definitely sneak in a WC if they roll with Tyrod.  There's a lot of talent on the offense there with allen, ekeler, williams, Henry - as well as improvements along the oline.  The defense will be good there if they can stay healthy.  

2 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

And the "card" that you can't touch, but for the whole lot falling down, really is the traditional run game. If you can take that away it forces them into 2nd and 3rd and long scenarios. And that is where you can do a good job of clogging those passing lanes in the middle of the field that Jackson loves to exploit and force him to throw outside the numbers. Of course there will always be 4 or 5 3rd and longs in a game that Jackson converts with his legs - so what? Ignore those, they will happen. Take the traditional run game away and get them into 2nd and 8 or worse 3 times per drive. You will get them off the field. That is why I disagree with those who don't think JK Dobbins was a necessary pick. He absolutely was because if Ingram slows down - and he definitely did late last season - it makes Jackson's job much harder.

 

I'd also be concerned about losing Yanda, who was basically their best player.

[Greg S]

https://forums.jetnation.com/topic/151849-jets-have-he-worst-roster-in-the-division-by-far/

 

From a Jets board. They are reviewing the rosters of the AFC East. Some posters are realistic others delusional. A poster named SAR should just be read for comedy relief. I don't know what football he watches but it isn't the NFL that is played on planet Earth.

[Straight Hucklebuck]

1 hour ago, atlbillsfan1975 said:

And they also got beat at home in the playoffs, pretty soundly too. That reigning MVP looked pretty bad. Let’s see how Lamar does this year. 
To say the Bills aren’t in Baltimore’s league is laughable. 

The Bills went 10-6, scored 314 points.

 

The Ravens went 14-2, scored 531 points. We struggled with the Texans, they smoked the Texans by 34 points. They also crushed New England, a team Brandon Beane acknowledged the Bills couldn’t beat, and they also beat the 49ers. 
 

It’s just my opinion, but given their acquisitions in FA, their full compliment of draft picks, we are solidly behind them in the AFC, at minimum until Josh Allen shows a higher gear. 
 

Edited April 27, 2020 by Straight Hucklebuck

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

1 hour ago, eball said:

 

I do believe the Bills' OL will be better even with mostly the same pieces, for reasons of continuity and experience as you note.  I also believe the added weapons of Diggs and Moss take pressure off the line.  It's fine if you disagree with me that the Bills' roster from top to bottom matches up with anyone -- it's an opinion.

 

Do you expect Lamar Jackson to equate or exceed what he did last year, now that two teams in December (and January) were pretty effective slowing him down and the rest of the NFL now has a blueprint?  Jackson's inability (thus far) to make "big time" throws from the pocket is a weakness that Josh Allen doesn't have.

 

Baltimore is a force to be reckoned with as long as Harbaugh is there -- he's a top 5 HC in the league -- but despite the incredible season Jackson had last year I don't believe he is some sort of transcendent QB who is changing the game.  The Ravens went "all in" on that run-oriented offense and I believe the rest of the league will catch up.  Is it wishful thinking?  We'll see.  I've spoken to Ravens fans who refer to their offense as a "house of cards."

 

Baltimore is good - They should've played KC in the championship.  That contrasting style would've been interesting to watch.

 

I do think buffalo did a nice job when playing him.  A couple big plays sunk them.  There were a few games where he played like out of his mind, and others where the defense put him in really good situations.  But man, guy accounted for 500 total yards in the titans playoff game and they somehow scored 12 points.  4 turnovers on downs, 2 picks, and the fumble.  I personally think roman had a pretty bad game called in that one too.

 

 

10 minutes ago, Greg S said:

https://forums.jetnation.com/topic/151849-jets-have-he-worst-roster-in-the-division-by-far/

 

From a Jets board. They are reviewing the rosters of the AFC East. Some posters are realistic others delusional. A poster named SAR should just be read for comedy relief. I don't know what football he watches but it isn't the NFL that is played on planet Earth.

 

Theyre... fine i guess - but in an AFC with some relatively loaded rosters, they're going to struggle with consistency.  Gase isn't a great head coach either so they'll surprise some weeks and beat top level competition, and fail other weeks against mediocre teams.

[Straight Hucklebuck]

1 hour ago, eball said:

I do believe the Bills' OL will be better even with mostly the same pieces, for reasons of continuity and experience as you note.

 

Jackson's inability (thus far) to make "big time" throws from the pocket is a weakness that Josh Allen doesn't have.

 

I've spoken to Ravens fans who refer to their offense as a "house of cards."

We’ll see on the Bills offensive line. Beane has done a good job getting an influx of players in so that true camp battles can be had. I’m not as sold that the same players brought back will play much better than we’ve seen, with the exception of Ford. 
 

Where does Josh Allen have a book of “big time” throws from the pocket? His best two of the year were the Cowboys game with the Beasley throw and the throw out his own end zone. 
 

The Ravens have an identity an draft accordingly. 
 

Likewise the Bills have an offensive scheme and have Coaching continuity.

 

Listen, we act like Allen offers ceiling that Lamar Jackson doesn’t have, but we’ve yet to see that in actual games. This is all a feeling based on the “tools” section of a scouting report, not actual games. 

[GunnerBill]

21 minutes ago, dneveu said:

 

I'd also be concerned about losing Yanda, who was basically their best player.

 

Agree he is a significant loss. They took the guard out of Michigan and they typically have success with those lower round OL. But yes, that is a legit worry.  

[Talley56]

I honestly believe the Bills can be better than the Chiefs.  They are the champs, yes, but I still think they have a lot of question marks on defense.  They looked very beatable quite often last year.

[Straight Hucklebuck]

17 minutes ago, Talley56 said:

I honestly believe the Bills can be better than the Chiefs.  They are the champs, yes, but I still think they have a lot of question marks on defense.  They looked very beatable quite often last year.

You can’t be serious. 
 

Mahomes is off to the best QB start to a career in NFL history. 
 

As good as the Bills defense is, no way are they keeping the Chiefs to under 17 points so that Allen and the offense can muster 19 for the win.

 

 

Edited April 27, 2020 by Straight Hucklebuck

[Stank_Nasty]

9 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

Yea... not sure how anyone could argue this.

 

In an offensive league, the Ravens offense was dynamic last season and the Bills offense was the opposite. 

 

The matchup between the two teams last season wasn't as close as the score indicated as Allen and the offense were mostly dreadful. Bills got fortunate with some ridiculous calls down the stretch to make it close. 

 

Chiefs and the Ravens are the class of the AFC until proven otherwise. 

So the bills get the ball down one score with about 70 yds to go and time to do it(all factors before a couple bad calls on the ravens), and it “wasn’t as close as the score indicated”.....
 

.... that’s pure unadulterated horse****. 

4 minutes ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

You can’t be serious. 
 

Mahomes is off to the best QB start to a career in NFL history outside. 
 

As good as the Bills defense is, no way are they keeping the Chiefs to under 17 points so that Allen and the offense can muster 19 for the win.

 

 

So this is you assuming an offense with a more seasoned qb, Stefon freaking diggs, and a non-geriatric RB2. Is still gonna manage 19 game?

 

speaking of “you can’t be serious” ..... also I’m not saying the bills will be better than the chiefs. But assuming the bills offense merely holds serve is sorta silly IMO. 

Edited April 27, 2020 by Stank_Nasty

[Greg S]

1 minute ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

You can’t be serious. 
 

Mahomes is off to the best QB start to a career in NFL history outside. 
 

As good as the Bills defense is, no way are they keeping the Chiefs to under 17 points so that Allen and the offense can muster 19 for the win.

 

 

 

The Chiefs being the champs and the Ravens are the two teams that the Bills will have to get by if they want to win the AFC. I am glad they get the Chiefs at home though. Win that game and that gives them the tiebreaker if it comes to that. Hopefully the Bills can win the division and get a home playoff game before worrying about the Chiefs/Ravens.

[Straight Hucklebuck]

5 minutes ago, Stank_Nasty said:

So the bills get the ball down one score with about 70 yds to go and time to do it(all factors before a couple bad calls on the ravens), and it “wasn’t as close as the score indicated”.....
 

.... that’s pure unadulterated horse****. 

So this is you assuming an offense with a more seasoned qb, Stefon freaking diggs, and a non-geriatric RB2. Is still gonna manage 19 game?

 

speaking of “you can’t be serious” ..... also I’m not saying the bills will be better than the chiefs. But assuming the bills offense merely holds serve is sorta silly IMO. 

Hey Bills fans, I know we’re really excited about Diggs and Allen, but Mahomes and their HOF Coach and skill players have put up 76 aerial touchdowns vs 18 interceptions in two years en route to an MVP and Super Bowl Championship.
 

Can we show a little humility and acknowledge real results as opposed to romancing our first round collapse against Houston?

 

Let’s put up back to back winning seasons and get out of the first round before declaring that we could give the Chiefs problems huh?
 

 

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

21 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Agree he is a significant loss. They took the guard out of Michigan and they typically have success with those lower round OL. But yes, that is a legit worry.  

 

I also always worry that romans like - over-preparedness tends to run them into problems.  I still see them as a playoff team though.

[eball]

19 minutes ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

Listen, we act like Allen offers ceiling that Lamar Jackson doesn’t have, but we’ve yet to see that in actual games. This is all a feeling based on the “tools” section of a scouting report, not actual games. 

 

Umm, go look at Allen's passing stats in the short/intermediate range last season and in the red zone.  Really the only area in which he "struggled" was the deep passing game; he got better everywhere else.  I will be proven right or wrong in time, but I still say if we look at these two QBs three years from now (after each has completed five seasons) I don't think it will be an "easy" call to take Jackson first.

 

You also mentioned in this thread that the Bills won't beat the Chiefs because they won't hold KC to 17 points -- implying the Bills' offense will not improve despite what Beane has done to improve the O's potential explosiveness by adding Diggs, Moss, etc.  Are you saying you do not expect Allen to continue to develop?  If not, why not?

 

[Stank_Nasty]

11 minutes ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

Hey Bills fans, I know we’re really excited about Diggs and Allen, but Mahomes and their HOF Coach and skill players have put up 76 aerial touchdowns vs 18 interceptions in two years en route to an MVP and Super Bowl Championship.
 

Can we show a little humility and acknowledge real results as opposed to romancing our first round collapse against Houston?

 

Let’s put up back to back winning seasons and get out of the first round before declaring that we could give the Chiefs problems huh?
 

 

Again. Hinting towards the bills offense being as subpar as this years is just downright foolish. 
 

if you wanna somehow turn that into me slighting the chiefs then that’s on you. I didn’t  take that route. 

Edited April 27, 2020 by Stank_Nasty

[GunnerBill]

7 minutes ago, dneveu said:

 

I also always worry that romans like - over-preparedness tends to run them into problems.  I still see them as a playoff team though.

 

I think Roman is outstanding. Always have. He got run out of two spots by Head Coaches who couldn't get out of their own way. I think the Ravens are the team to beat, I really do. I acknowledge how special the Chiefs are but repeating in the NFL hasn't been done for a long time because it is really hard. If someone had a gun to my head right now and told me to name the Superbowl Champions for the 2020 season I'd say Baltimore.

[Straight Hucklebuck]

2 minutes ago, eball said:

 

Umm, go look at Allen's passing stats in the short/intermediate range last season and in the red zone.  Really the only area in which he "struggled" was the deep passing game; he got better everywhere else.  I will be proven right or wrong in time, but I still say if we look at these two QBs three years from now (after each has completed five seasons) I don't think it will be an "easy" call to take Jackson first.

 

You also mentioned in this thread that the Bills won't beat the Chiefs because they won't hold KC to 17 points -- implying the Bills' offense will not improve despite what Beane has done to improve the O's potential explosiveness by adding Diggs, Moss, etc.  Are you saying you do not expect Allen to continue to develop?  If not, why not?

 

Allen improved relative to his rookie self.

 

2018 was 175 ypg, 1 TD and 1 Int per game.
 

Last year it was 190 yards a game and 1.5 TDs while cutting down the interceptions and keeping his rushing TDs in play. 

 

What he needs to do now is improve his play verses the NFL standard. 
 

In 2018, the Bills averaged 15 ppg with a laughable talent base, in 2019 it jumped up 19.5 ppg with Brown and Beasley and flushing McCoy out the door. We could see a jump to 24 - 25 ppg this season. 
 

But one thing that is true is that Allen has never put up numbers in college or so far in the pros that predict a top flight offense, capable of scoring 28-32 ppg.

 

He has yet to break fully from his Scouting Reports which said elite tools but raw. He still functions as a game manager, not a playmaker. 

[Talley56]

30 minutes ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

You can’t be serious. 
 

Mahomes is off to the best QB start to a career in NFL history. 
 

As good as the Bills defense is, no way are they keeping the Chiefs to under 17 points so that Allen and the offense can muster 19 for the win.

 

 

I am very serious, yes, Mahomes is really good, as is the whole KC offense.  But, as I mentioned in my post, their defense had a lot of question marks.  Last year they lost to the Texans and Colts and, even though the Bills lost to the Texans in the playoffs, I still think they were better than both teams.  KC is be no means invincible.

[Straight Hucklebuck]

2 minutes ago, Talley56 said:

I am very serious, yes, Mahomes is really good, as is the whole KC offense.  But, as I mentioned in my post, their defense had a lot of question marks.  Last year they lost to the Texans and Colts and, even though the Bills lost to the Texans in the playoffs, I still think they were better than both teams.  KC is be no means invincible.

I think you’re selling Mahomes short. 
 

Right now his first two seasons are Dan Marino in terms of numbers.

 

He’s way past “really good”. 
 

He’s playing at a HOF level.

 

The Bills still largely have to win the same way. They need to get teams into a tight, low scoring game and win 19-16 until proven otherwise. 
 

There should be development with Allen and Diggs, but I highly doubt we see an offense around 30 ppg, I don’t think Allen projects as that kind of QB. 

[eball]

3 minutes ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

Allen improved relative to his rookie self.

 

2018 was 175 ypg, 1 TD and 1 Int per game.
 

Last year it was 190 yards a game and 1.5 TDs while cutting down the interceptions and keeping his rushing TDs in play. 

 

What he needs to do now is improve his play verses the NFL standard. 
 

In 2018, the Bills averaged 15 ppg with a laughable talent base, in 2019 it jumped up 19.5 ppg with Brown and Beasley and flushing McCoy out the door. We could see a jump to 24 - 25 ppg this season. 
 

But one thing that is true is that Allen has never put up numbers in college or so far in the pros that predict a top flight offense, capable of scoring 28-32 ppg.

 

He has yet to break fully from his Scouting Reports which said elite tools but raw. He still functions as a game manager, not a playmaker. 

 

Good response.  That jump by nearly 5 pts last year came without ONE defensive or ST touchdown, which is almost unheard of, particularly for a defense as good as Buffalo's.

 

If you've read anything I posted about Allen in the past, the general theme is that he began even his college career behind the eight ball because he did not grow up as the kid "groomed" to be a quarterback.  He had to beg for a scholarship, and don't tell me he got great QB coaching at Wyoming.  He finally started receiving top level QB coaching when he began working with Jordan Palmer, then got Daboll as an OC, and last year Dorsey was added to the mix.  He is still learning but the rate at which he is improving is notable.  I see a guy with an incredible work ethic and desire to be great, matched up with unbelievable natural talent.  I will be shocked, not surprised, if the numbers aren't significantly better this year and beyond.