Defensive Backs in Top 10 of Round 1

[Bill from NYC]

I was not surprised to see the Jaguars and the Lions draft Top 10 first round DBs. Why not? Because one can make a case that these particular teams are long time second rate organizations. Their drafts are every bit as bad as ours in the "bad old days" or so it would seem.

The Lions were just so bad that they picked at #3. Could one even imagine how many problems they had to pick so early? They have a QB with a monster arm and there were receivers galore. They probably could have traded down and selected Lamb, Ruggs or Jeudy AND acquired extra picks but no; they really had to take that corner at #3. There were very good blockers available, and they could have even taken a QB to eventually replace Stafford. Incredible.

 

The Jags are another team that historically drafts poorly. They have issues galore. Their method of fixing said issues? A DB at #9. While unquestionably stupid, it was not quite on the same level of idiocy displayed by the ever horrible Lions, who would even appear to be tanking for Trevor.

 

I am on record as being skeptical of the trade for Diggs, but it looks wonderful compared to the above decisions.

 

GO BILLS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

 

Edited April 24, 2020 by Bill from NYC

[CaptnCoke11]

Miami killed it too.. Tua is a question mark at best, average OT and a project CB.  Just a terrible organization. 

[Bill from NYC]

4 minutes ago, CaptnCoke11 said:

Miami killed it too.. Tua is a question mark at best, average OT and a project CB.  Just a terrible organization. 

I am a huge fan of Tua but either way, taking a chance on a qb who might be great does make sense.  The owner will make a TON of money if Tua pans out too so yeah, I can relate to the move but a corner at #3? Yikes!

[jrober38]

The way most NFL teams build their franchises is inherently flawed. 

 

If you're a team like Detroit, what are you doing? As you said, what does a CB do to move the needle? Probably not much.

 

If you're in that position, why are you still married to Stafford, and why are you not tearing that thing down, stock piling picks and going after a franchise QB?

 

On the flip side I like where Miami is going. They got their QB, they got a 20 year old LT with enormous upside and they got a corner which was obviously a coveted position last night. They have some pieces and I think they're about to go on a similar path to the one we had when we first drafted Josh. 

[Bill from NYC]

6 minutes ago, jrober38 said:

The way most NFL teams build their franchises is inherently flawed. 

 

If you're a team like Detroit, what are you doing? As you said, what does a CB do to move the needle? Probably not much.

 

If you're in that position, why are you still married to Stafford, and why are you not tearing that thing down, stock piling picks and going after a franchise QB?

 

On the flip side I like where Miami is going. They got their QB, they got a 20 year old LT with enormous upside and they got a corner which was obviously a coveted position last night. They have some pieces and I think they're about to go on a similar path to the one we had when we first drafted Josh. 

Bravo!!!

[jrober38]

11 minutes ago, Bill from NYC said:

Bravo!!!

 

I think the same applies to a few teams in the top 16 though. 

 

The Giants are adding key pieces, I mentioned I like what the Dolphins are doing, maybe Washington although I don't believe Haskins is ever going to be the guy, the Panthers look like they'll be tanking for Lawrence or Fields, the Cardinals are making some good moves. 

 

On the other side, the Lions are terrible, the Jags are lost, the Raiders are going nowhere, the Falcons are going nowhere. 

These teams are just biding their time until their at the bottom of the NFL, cleaning house and hitting the reset button.

 

What's the point in waiting?

Edited April 24, 2020 by jrober38

[Bill from NYC]

9 minutes ago, jrober38 said:

 

I think the same applies to a few teams in the top 16 though. 

 

The Giants are adding key pieces, I mentioned I like what the Dolphins are doing, maybe Washington although I don't believe Haskins is ever going to be the guy, the Panthers look like they'll be tanking for Lawrence or Fields, the Cardinals are making some good moves. 

 

On the other side, the Lions are terrible, the Jags are lost, the Raiders are going nowhere, the Falcons are going nowhere. 

These teams are just biding their time until their at the bottom of the NFL, cleaning house and hitting the reset button.

 

What's the point in waiting?

I find it amazing that the same teams seem to just continue their senseless, losing ways.

 

These owners are rich beyond imagination. Are all of them actual billionaires? How they got to be just so wealthy when they can't see their way past these dumb, easy to correct mistakes is beyond me.

[Don Otreply]

15 minutes ago, Bill from NYC said:

I find it amazing that the same teams seem to just continue their senseless, losing ways.

 

These owners are rich beyond imagination. Are all of them actual billionaires? How they got to be just so wealthy when they can't see their way past these dumb, easy to correct mistakes is beyond me.

Most people are smart about a few things, and not so smart about everything else. I knew more than one Pratt and Whitney engineer that were very smart in their fields, but couldn’t change a flat tire on their road bikes to save their lives. It is no different for the billionaires who bought football teams I guess...

Edited April 24, 2020 by Don Otreply

[GunnerBill]

38 minutes ago, Bill from NYC said:

I find it amazing that the same teams seem to just continue their senseless, losing ways.

 

These owners are rich beyond imagination. Are all of them actual billionaires? How they got to be just so wealthy when they can't see their way past these dumb, easy to correct mistakes is beyond me.

 

Because being rich does not make you smart. 

[Mr. K]

The in-laws were all meh on the pick. I told the wife I wish someone would turn their franchise around. I was hoping to see them move back and get extra picks or players somehow. They need help everywhere but a corner at 3. Come on' Man!

[Coach Tuesday]

I'm thinking there is like a 75% chance the Bills take a DB at 54, either Chinn/Dugger or Hall/Johnson.

[Bill from NYC]

9 minutes ago, Mr. K said:

The in-laws were all meh on the pick. I told the wife I wish someone would turn their franchise around. I was hoping to see them move back and get extra picks or players somehow. They need help everywhere but a corner at 3. Come on' Man!

My GF is a huge Giant Fan and converted Crimson Tide Fan who even watches Bama games with me.

 

When it was the Giants turn to pick, I told her that they should draft Andrew Thomas (and it was fun to look smart ). She wanted Jeudy because she saw him play all season. Thomas is a beast and will protect their rookie QB. They probably could have traded back and drafted Jeudy but at least they went in the right direction. 

3 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said:

I'm thinking there is like a 75% chance the Bills take a DB at 54, either Chinn/Dugger or Hall/Johnson.

There is probably a 90% chance.

 

[GunnerBill]

I do get Bill's point on this but this is not a class littered with studs. I think there were 3 slam dunk players in this class and they went 1,2 and 3. 

 

I thought the Lions would trade down too but per Schefter a lot of interest never materialised into a firm offer. So then what do you do? They have a need at pass rusher but there was nobody there who was even nearly worth the pick. Take a left tackle? Except they have a left tackle they drafted in the first round in Taylor Decker who has played pretty well. Take Tua? Yea they could have done that I suppose but there is a very good chance that Matt Stafford is a better Quarterback than Tua for at least the next couple of years. 

 

I have sympathy with the argument. I just don't necessarily see the alternative. Now if you want to slam Detroit for a first round pick start with them passing on Ed Oliver and Brian Burns last year to draft a freaking tight end at #8. 

Edited April 24, 2020 by GunnerBill

[BuffaloHokie13]

20 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said:

I'm thinking there is like a 75% chance the Bills take a DB at 54, either Chinn/Dugger or Hall/Johnson.

I put the odds at 50% DB, 30% EDGE, 15% WR, 5% RB.

 

At DB I'm looking at Fulton, Johnson, Diggs, Dantzler, or one of the safeties

 

At Edge I'm looking for one of Gross-Matos, Baun, or Epenesa to fall

 

WR I like Hamler, Pittman, and to a lesser extent Shenault 

 

RB only if Swift, Dobbins, or Taylor falls

 

That's 17 players and doesn't include Josh Jones, Mims, Blacklock, Davidson, Higgins, Madubuike, or Gallimore.

 

So at least 2 of the players listed above will be available at 54.

Edited April 24, 2020 by BuffaloHokie13

[LeviF]

The point about DBs in the top ten is well taken.  Okudah is amazing but not someone that'll take your franchise from 4 wins to 10+.  Maybe they draft a tackle there instead, or go with Tua/Herbert and let Stafford bridge for a couple years.  There were options, though not as many as in some other years.  I was in the camp that thought Detroit should roll the dice with Tua.

 

But the old truism "it takes two to tango" applies to trading back.  Would Miami have moved up?  Who would have been trying to get to 3 or 4 that they'd be competing with if they were completely sold on Tua?  Miami won't be scared of Detroit taking a QB if they're willing to move back, and the Giants have what they think is their guy.  Who else?  The Chargers at 6?  What if they're content with either Tua or Herbert?  Even if the Chargers want to move up, Miami can still sit and preen because they have significantly more draft picks to move and they can best pretty much any offer.

 

I'm sure Detroit did their due diligence.  Once you get past that 6th or 7th pick, you get a king's ransom for 3 but I'm not sure there's any QB-needy team out there that was willing to pay the kind of assets required for Tua/Herbert, who are both have huge question marks and not exactly Manning/Luck type prospects.  And then Miami can just give whatever team might sniff at the 3rd pick the finger by one-upping their offer.

[Coach Tuesday]

As I see it the picks themselves are only half the issue.  Both Detroit and Jacksonville traded away highly skilled CBs in their primes so that they could draft uncertain replacements.  I understand the cap management reasons but neither team needed to do it that way - both could have afforded the CBs they had with some creative roster management.  What they did was tread water (or worse, if the rookies end up being busts, which Henderson at least might).  We as Bills fans have seen plenty of that kind of approach, not just at CB but at RB and other positions as well.

 

I feel like lots of teams have no real plan and decide to change out players at the same position just to look like they have a plan.  But they don't.  Marrone has no idea what he's doing and it amazes me that he still has a job, but I guess he found one of the few completely unaccountable organizations left in the NFL.  It took Coughlin starting fights with everyone to finally get him ejected there.

[GunnerBill]

8 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said:

As I see it the picks themselves are only half the issue.  Both Detroit and Jacksonville traded away highly skilled CBs in their primes so that they could draft uncertain replacements.  I understand the cap management reasons but neither team needed to do it that way - both could have afforded the CBs they had with some creative roster management.  What they did was tread water (or worse, if the rookies end up being busts, which Henderson at least might).  We as Bills fans have seen plenty of that kind of approach, not just at CB but at RB and other positions as well.

 

I feel like lots of teams have no real plan and decide to change out players at the same position just to look like they have a plan.  But they don't.  Marrone has no idea what he's doing and it amazes me that he still has a job, but I guess he found one of the few completely unaccountable organizations left in the NFL.  It took Coughlin starting fights with everyone to finally get him ejected there.

 

Yes this is certainly true. Indeed drafting Ramsey was an excellent pick as he was the best player on a team that made the AFC title game. Trading him away to spend that pick on Henderson is just flat out bad strategy.

 

Equally with the Lions trading Slay for two mid round picks. The slight distinction I make there is even if they still had Slay I am not sure what the right alternative was for that pick. Other than maybe gamble on Tua and sit him for a year or two. 

[Rico]

47 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

I do get Bill's point on this but this is not a class littered with studs. I think there were 3 slam dunk players in this class and they went 1,2 and 3. 

 

I thought the Lions would trade down too but per Schefter a lot of interest never materialised into a firm offer. So then what do you do? They have a need at pass rusher but there was nobody there who was even nearly worth the pick. Take a left tackle? Except they have a left tackle they drafted in the first round in Taylor Decker who has played pretty well. Take Tua? Yea they could have done that I suppose but there is a very good chance that Matt Stafford is a better Quarterback than Tua for at least the next couple of years. 

 

I have sympathy with the argument. I just don't necessarily see the alternative. Now if you want to slam Detroit for a first round pick start with them passing on Ed Oliver and Brian Burns last year to draft a freaking tight end at #8. 

[Coach Tuesday]

6 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Yes this is certainly true. Indeed drafting Ramsey was an excellent pick as he was the best player on a team that made the AFC title game. Trading him away to spend that pick on Henderson is just flat out bad strategy.

 

Equally with the Lions trading Slay for two mid round picks. The slight distinction I make there is even if they still had Slay I am not sure what the right alternative was for that pick. Other than maybe gamble on Tua and sit him for a year or two. 

Re the Lions, I don’t know what the exact right strategy was but using a Top 5 pick on replacing a good player with a slightly cheaper player at the same position can’t be it.

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

2 hours ago, Bill from NYC said:

I am a huge fan of Tua but either way, taking a chance on a qb who might be great does make sense.  The owner will make a TON of money if Tua pans out too so yeah, I can relate to the move but a corner at #3? Yikes!

We don’t know about Tua for sure. But josh has far surpassed what most thought of him on draft day too. It’s a crap shoot, but you gotta take the heat calculated risk you can.