Article: McDermott Concerned about PSE Dysfunction

[Mr. WEO]

1 minute ago, FireChans said:

I mean, the Covington Catholic student sued 3 orgs for defamation and CNN gave him a nice tidy settlement. 

 

Maybe journalism has always been this crappy, but the amount of quick “breaking news” stories and then quiet retractions is breathtaking. At a certain point, these transgressions pile up, and if you don’t start becoming skeptical, you’re an idiot.

 

 

One should always be skeptical in these times. 

 

I'm not on twitter, but there are endless ways to ingest and digest info out there.

[BillsVet]

1 hour ago, May Day 10 said:

It appears fine now.  But I do remember Terry holding a stopwatch and a clipboard "helping" evaluate quarterbacks.  We have had a daughter dating a fringe tight end.  Who knows if a family member ends up with a position in the organization who buts heads with McDermott?  You could get a Linda Bogdan situation real easy.  Once McDermott gets enough personal capital where he could write his own ticket, and doesnt need the Bills, it could be possible.  It seems like unicorns and rainbows now, but hands-on owners typically desire subservient execs at some point.  The story I heard from credible people that LaFontaine's resignation was due to disagreements with Kim Pegula that boiled over.  

I just want a guy like Kraft who sits in the press box, claps, writes checks, and accepts trophies and praise.

 

Oh I don't doubt that scenario. 

 

There's already plenty of nepotism over in PSE already and if that drifted over to OBD I cannot see McD accepting that.  He's a very strong personality and was given the proverbial keys to the kingdom upon being hired.  I'd hope the Pegs' stay out of his way so long as the team is winning.

 

For all the flak that Kraft takes (and he's got his detriments) I'd want that for this franchise as well.  Especially if the leadership group the Pegs' have hired at OBD prove themselves and start winning in the playoffs.

 

And I'll reiterate a point I've been making: that to my knowledge the Pegula's have not once hired qualified people to oversee their teams at the time of purchase.  With the Bills, they found McD who brought in Beane, albeit 2+ years and many bad decisions after the sale.  They steadied that ship, but I sense some people in the Sabres organization are hindering progress...along with bad hockey management hires.  

 

And BTW, where is Terry in all of this? 

 

 

[Lurker]

1 minute ago, bbb said:

 

I am still having a hard time how somebody goes from Return on investment - to punched in the gut.  

 

Last post here, as it now seems like people just want to piss on each others shoes:

 

    "Pegula, current and former employees say, explained that return on investment included maintaining the family’s lifestyle."

 

Maybe your gut wasn't punched, but perhaps some of the PSE employees had the air knocked out of their's...     

 

 

"Rah. Rah. One Buffalo!  We're all in this together!   Now get back to work while I head back to Florida..."

[oldmanfan]

2 minutes ago, BillsVet said:

 

Oh I don't doubt that scenario. 

 

There's already plenty of nepotism over in PSE already and if that drifted over to OBD I cannot see McD accepting that.  He's a very strong personality and was given the proverbial keys to the kingdom upon being hired.  I'd hope the Pegs' stay out of his way so long as the team is winning.

 

For all the flak that Kraft takes (and he's got his detriments) I'd want that for this franchise as well.  Especially if the leadership group the Pegs' have hired at OBD prove themselves and start winning in the playoffs.

 

And I'll reiterate a point I've been making: that to my knowledge the Pegula's have not once hired qualified people to oversee their teams at the time of purchase.  With the Bills, they found McD who brought in Beane, albeit 2+ years and many bad decisions after the sale.  They steadied that ship, but I sense some people in the Sabres organization are hindering progress...along with bad hockey management hires.  

 

And BTW, where is Terry in all of this? 

 

 

The people that should be overseeing the teams are the GM and HC.  Whiffed on Ryan but then got it right.  Hired guys with good resumes for the Sabres that didn’t live up to expectations.  I don’t see any evidence he’s trampling on McD and if anything with the Sabres he gave guys more time than he should have.

[njbuff]

9 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

Ask Trump--he boasts about the press conference ratings.

 

He's free to use twitter.  The guy struggles to put more than 5 words together without telling a lie.  Don't need a "media filter" to figure this out.

 

Trump hating thread is that way >>>>>>>>>>>

[TroutDog]

Wow, I leave for a few hours and this thread flew WAY off the rails! ? 

[oldmanfan]

1 minute ago, Lurker said:

 

Last post here, as it now seems like people just want to piss on each others shoes:

 

    "Pegula, current and former employees say, explained that return on investment included maintaining the family’s lifestyle."

 

Maybe your gut wasn't punched, but perhaps some of the PSE employees had the air knocked out of their's...     

 

 

"Rah. Rah. One Buffalo!  We're all in this together!   Now get back to work while I head back to Florida..."

Yeah I’d agree that’s not a great way to put it. I think it’s an inherently understood thing; I’m sure Cowboys employees know Jerry wants to support Jerry’s lifestyle.  But if it’s brought up during other cost cutting than poor form.

[Doc]

Is morale at anyone's job anything but low right now?

[Mango]

4 hours ago, Warren Zevon said:

 

Not too peeved about the chart either but people aren't interpreting anything the chart doesn't blatantly say. Return on Investment--> fund lifestyle. It's a stupid slide to show to your employees.

 

This is a weird slide and obviously never should have been included in any presentation at any level. If one of the Pegula's presented or signed off on them, shame on them. It sort of reads "Win Games---Turn the business over to my kids/Generational wealth---Don't make me sell my yacht". I am honestly not sure how else you read it. The title of the effing slide is "Pegula Family Goals (PSE)". Based on the content, it definitely does not read as "PSE is a family". This is tone deaf to say the least...

[oldmanfan]

2 minutes ago, Doc said:

Is morale at anyone's job anything but low right now?

Bingo

[Mango]

4 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

Exactly.  I think PSE was struggling before the current crisis.  Keeping leasing tenants in their commercial properties seemed difficult.  And the hotel  business is shaky in Buffalo.  I don't think oil prices have anything to do with their current predicament.

 

You are free to dispute the facts and quotes in the article.  Why don't you do so, so that we can all conclude as you have that it's "a bad article"? 

 

 

 

You are correct. He dipped out of the OG industry nearly a decade ago. I am sure he has some investments, but he cashed out to the tune of nearly 5 BILLION dollars. He is currently over leveraged his worth because he has done a bad job of managing his investments in sports and hospitality. I would not be surprised if he were relatively cash poor (or as cash poor as a billionaire can be). The whole thing is a bit wild, kind of like a mega millions winner who declares bankrupts after blowing through 200M.

 

The Bills will be fine, but if he does not figure it out, I would not be surprised to see him move on from the harborcenter, the sabres, PSE management group, etc.   

 

https://www.forbes.com/profile/terrence-pegula/#12385c013cc7

[Doc]

10 minutes ago, Mango said:

You are correct. He dipped out of the OG industry nearly a decade ago. I am sure he has some investments, but he cashed out to the tune of nearly 5 BILLION dollars. He is currently over leveraged his worth because he has done a bad job of managing his investments in sports and hospitality. I would not be surprised if he were relatively cash poor (or as cash poor as a billionaire can be). The whole thing is a bit wild, kind of like a mega millions winner who declares bankrupts after blowing through 200M.

 

The Bills will be fine, but if he does not figure it out, I would not be surprised to see him move on from the harborcenter, the sabres, PSE management group, etc.   

 

https://www.forbes.com/profile/terrence-pegula/#12385c013cc7

 

Actually it was $6.45B.  And as far as I know, his sports teams are all bought and paid for (to the tune of about $1.6B).  I doubt he's cash poor.

[May Day 10]

It really wouldnt have been that hard to run the Sabres well.  They inherited a team with a locked in waiting list for season tickets and perpetual sellouts and all the good will in the world.

 

 

It is remarkable what they have done to the franchise.  remarkable.  And not defensible.  

[FireChans]

1 minute ago, Mango said:

 

You are correct. He dipped out of the OG industry nearly a decade ago. I am sure he has some investments, but he cashed out to the tune of nearly 5 BILLION dollars. He is currently over leveraged his worth because he has done a bad job of managing his investments in sports and hospitality. I would not be surprised if he were relatively cash poor (or as cash poor as a billionaire can be). The whole thing is a bit wild, kind of like a mega millions winner who declares bankrupts after blowing through 200M.

 

The Bills will be fine, but if he does not figure it out, I would not be surprised to see him move on from the harborcenter, the sabres, PSE management group, etc.   

 

https://www.forbes.com/profile/terrence-pegula/#12385c013cc7

Doubt they’ve seen any ROI in the DT buffalo revival. It’s still a ghost town, even at that restaurant.

[Mr. WEO]

39 minutes ago, njbuff said:

 

Trump hating thread is that way >>>>>>>>>>>

 

Was just answering a question

[Mango]

11 minutes ago, FireChans said:

Doubt they’ve seen any ROI in the DT buffalo revival. It’s still a ghost town, even at that restaurant.

 

Don't get me started on the Buffalo Renaissance not being a real thing. It is just something people keep regurgitating until everybody believes it is true. Buffalo has not grown by almost any measure. Increasing level of kids in poverty every year. House house income  is stagnant. Household income in comparison to the national average is actually getting worse. And as a result everybody that is screaming RENAISSANCE is actually causing  one of the largest spikes in the country in terms of % increase in cost of living. 

 

But to your point. The city gave TPegs a huge tax abatement and drastically undervalued the property that the Harbor Center is on when they sold it. From a former Erie County Budget Director, "The city will NEVER make that money back" 

It is absolutely wild...This is not the thread for that though. 

Edited April 21, 2020 by Mango

[FireChans]

1 minute ago, Mango said:

 

Don't get me started on the Buffalo Renaissance not being a real thing. It is just something people keep regurgitating until everybody believes it is true. Buffalo has not grown by almost any measure. Increasing level of kids in poverty every year. House house income  is stagnant. Household income in comparison to the national average is actually getting worse. And as a result everybody that is screaming RENAISSANCE is actually causing  one of the largest spikes in the country in terms of % increase in cost of living. 

It is absolutely wild...This is not the thread for that though. 

Sure it is. This thread is about PSE. The failure of their Buffalo revival is part of it. That giant One Buffalo restaurant with 2 people in it for lunch is part of it. How much money do you think they have pissed down the drain for that?

[BillsVet]

1 hour ago, oldmanfan said:

The people that should be overseeing the teams are the GM and HC.  Whiffed on Ryan but then got it right.  Hired guys with good resumes for the Sabres that didn’t live up to expectations.  I don’t see any evidence he’s trampling on McD and if anything with the Sabres he gave guys more time than he should have.

 

In theory yes, those are who should be managing the team side of the houses.  In reality, it can go sideways when big egos get in the room, especially owners, and they want power and control over their investment.  It's a toy to them and who's going to tell them they cannot play with that?  

 

The Pegula's have been a dumpster fire since purchasing the Sabres 9 years ago.  You can process their moves however you want, but having (EDIT: several) senior executives (Regier, Black, LaFontaine, Murray, Brandon, and Botterill) along with 6 HC's in that span indicate there's been a major problem there.  Not to mention the other hires who've been let go.  

 

I think some people at PSE have gotten a little big for their britches and aren't willing to acknowledge they're in over their head.  If the report is correct the Sabres are losing money, how does one reconcile that with the team operating in the biggest US hockey market?  The only reason would be bad management and people running that show.  

 

 

Edited April 21, 2020 by BillsVet

[4_kidd_4]

716 is a terrible restaurant. Just throwing my $0.02 in.

[oldmanfan]

17 minutes ago, BillsVet said:

 

In theory yes, those are who should be managing the team side of the houses.  In reality, it can go sideways when big egos get in the room, especially owners, and they want power and control over their investment.  It's a toy to them and who's going to tell them they cannot play with that?  

 

The Pegula's have been a dumpster fire since purchasing the Sabres 9 years ago.  You can process their moves however you want, but having (EDIT: several) senior executives (Regier, Black, LaFontaine, Murray, Brandon, and Botterill) along with 6 HC's in that span indicate there's been a major problem there.  Not to mention the other hires who've been let go.  

 

I think some people at PSE have gotten a little big for their britches and aren't willing to acknowledge they're in over their head.  If the report is correct the Sabres are losing money, how does one reconcile that with the team operating in the biggest US hockey market?  The only reason would be bad management and people running that show.  

 

 

I don’t see any evidence that Terry’s ego is what ails the Sabres.  I see nothing to suggest that he’s a Danny Snyder type owner that’s meddling in things.  He’s had GMs in Regier and Murray, and now possibly Botterill that didn’t work out and neither did the HCs they hired.  If anything he gave some of these guys like Regier too long a time.

 

Picking senior execs in sports is a tricky thing, especially the HC.  The Maras were dumb till they picked Parcells, Ralph until Marc, Kraft until Belichick.  Terry has to get it right, no question.  He seems to have done so with the Bills but hasn’t yet with the Sabres.  

 

As as far as losing money with the Sabres, as you say it is an if that’s true thing.  No denying he’s spent $$ on the product; how many times have people complained about bloated contracts to marginal players?  He’s spent to get a farm system built with Cinci and Rochester feeding in, enhanced facilities and such.

 

You say people at PSE are in over their heads?  Maybe - who exactly?  Kim?  I think they should have a top business guy handling PSE but the last one they had in Brandon we all know what happened.  Did that make them gun shy?  Are there factions in the front office  that are trying to fight against the owners?  Yes Terry and Kim could be better at what they do but I’ve lived long enough to know there’s another side to the story that Graham wants to sell.

 

And if we want to get into hidden agendas and conspiracies, maybe the two sources saying McD is concerned have their own anti McD agenda and are spreading things to try and force McD out.