Scraps Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 On 4/12/2020 at 3:27 AM, FireChans said: There are 9 million other ways to treat lupus regardless. Expand Really? Can you list the first million? On 4/12/2020 at 3:31 AM, GG said: Oh, don't get him started on Prednisone. He probably also doesn't know how it's used for acute asthma. Expand Dude, you didn't even know what HCQ was used for in this country.
Chef Jim Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 On 4/12/2020 at 3:33 AM, Scraps said: Really? Can you list the first million? Dude, you didn't even know what HCQ was used for in this country. Expand Still waiting on the hoarders dude. Who’s hoarding?
FireChans Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 On 4/12/2020 at 3:33 AM, Scraps said: Really? Can you list the first million? Dude, you didn't even know what HCQ was used for in this country. Expand Methotrexate for starters. Costs about 15 bucks for a months worth or so without insurance. What was your complaint, again?
GG Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 On 4/12/2020 at 3:33 AM, Scraps said: Really? Can you list the first million? Dude, you didn't even know what HCQ was used for in this country. Expand Are you saying that HCQ isn't primarily a malaria drug? As for lupus and arthritis, is it the mainstay medication for those maladies? Are there alternative treatments? You know, unlike Albuterol.
FireChans Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 On 4/12/2020 at 3:37 AM, GG said: Are you saying that HCQ isn't primarily a malaria drug? As for lupus and arthritis, is it the mainstay medication for those maladies? Are there alternative treatments? You know, unlike Albuterol. Expand Plaquenil is first line for Lupus, but it is not the only medication used to treat lupus.
GG Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 On 4/12/2020 at 3:36 AM, FireChans said: Methotrexate for starters. Costs about 15 bucks for a months worth or so without insurance. What was your complaint, again? Expand These threads would be much shorter if he just admitted "Trump said it"
FireChans Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 (edited) On 4/12/2020 at 3:39 AM, GG said: These threads would be much shorter if he just admitted "Trump said it" Expand Right now he is googling methotrexate so he can list out all of the potential side effects and then say Trump is killing lupus patients. On 4/12/2020 at 3:32 AM, Chef Jim said: Well thanks for playing but you lose. He’s an ENGINEER!! Expand If I need to kill someone in a bridge collapse, now I know who to call. Edited April 12, 2020 by FireChans 3
Scraps Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 On 4/12/2020 at 3:36 AM, FireChans said: Methotrexate for starters. Costs about 15 bucks for a months worth or so without insurance. What was your complaint, again? Expand Well you said there were 9 million treatments for Lupus. I asked you to list the first million. You gave me 2. Regardless, many here have said the Hydroxychloroquine is the only treatment for Covid-19. Is that true?
FireChans Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 (edited) On 4/12/2020 at 3:44 AM, Scraps said: Well you said there were 9 million treatments for Lupus. I asked you to list the first million. You gave me 2. Regardless, many here have said the Hydroxychloroquine is the only treatment for Covid-19. Is that true? Expand There is no FDA approved treatment for COVID-19. HCQ is currently under investigation due to some small evidence suggesting it may be helpful. Outside of HCQ, there is nothing else besides symptomatic and supportive care. Edited April 12, 2020 by FireChans
Chef Jim Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 On 4/12/2020 at 3:44 AM, Scraps said: Regardless, many here have said the Hydroxychloroquine is the only treatment for Covid-19. Is that true? Expand Who has said this? I’d seriously like to know
Scraps Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 On 4/12/2020 at 3:46 AM, FireChans said: There is no FDA approved treatment for COVID-19. HCQ is currently under investigation due to some small evidence suggesting it may be helpful. Outside of HCQ, there is nothing else outside of symptomatic and supportive care. Expand Okay. I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt that you are a MD, even though the 9 million treatment for lupus sound like BS. My problem is that HCQ has not been proven in clinical trials. Do you disagree? My problem is that people seem to be throwing caution to the wind. Do you disagree? I don't remember the drug names but I've heard of a couple of drugs that compete with HCQ that have shown some promise against Covid-19. Trump even mentioned one of them by Pfizer in his Friday news conference. Isn't it possible that if HCQ is effective against Covid-19, competitive medicines might be effective as well? What is your problem with asking for clinical trials to prove the efficacy of any potential treatment? On 4/12/2020 at 3:51 AM, Chef Jim said: Who has said this? I’d seriously like to know Expand Doc
Chef Jim Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 On 4/12/2020 at 3:58 AM, Scraps said: Doc Expand Ok fair enough. I went back and found where he said that. But one doesn’t make many. You’ll need more to back up your many remark. Oh and before I forget.....who’s hoarding? On 4/12/2020 at 3:58 AM, Scraps said: What is your problem with asking for clinical trials to prove the efficacy of any potential treatment? Expand I can’t answer for him but my problem is......time.
FireChans Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 (edited) On 4/12/2020 at 3:58 AM, Scraps said: Okay. I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt that you are a MD, even though the 9 million treatment for lupus sound like BS. My problem is that HCQ has not been proven in clinical trials. Do you disagree? My problem is that people seem to be throwing caution to the wind. Do you disagree? I don't remember the drug names but I've heard of a couple of drugs that compete with HCQ that have shown some promise against Covid-19. Trump even mentioned one of them by Pfizer in his Friday news conference. Isn't it possible that if HCQ is effective against Covid-19, competitive medicines might be effective as well? What is your problem with asking for clinical trials to prove the efficacy of any potential treatment? Doc Expand When someone is in full on respiratory failure, on a ventilator, do you think they want to wait for a clinical trial? Edited April 12, 2020 by FireChans 1 1
Scraps Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 On 4/12/2020 at 4:12 AM, FireChans said: When someone is in full on respiratory failure, on a ventilator, do you think they want to wait for a clinical trial? Expand I'm doubting your claims of being an MD. Should they be put on a drug that could lead to heart failure?
FireChans Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 On 4/12/2020 at 4:14 AM, Scraps said: I'm doubting your claims of being an MD. Should they be put on a drug that could lead to heart failure? Expand How many people in the US have died from COVID-19 in the last month? How many have died from the side effects of HCQ? Do you really want to put lupus patients on a drug that “could lead to heart failure?”
Scraps Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 On 4/12/2020 at 4:16 AM, FireChans said: How many people in the US have died from COVID-19 in the last month? How many have died from the side effects of HCQ? Do you really want to put lupus patients on a drug that “could lead to heart failure?” Expand Well, people with lupus have been prescribed this drug for a long time under a doctors supervision. I see you have avoided all my questions My problem is that HCQ has not been proven in clinical trials. Do you disagree? My problem is that people seem to be throwing caution to the wind. Do you disagree? I don't remember the drug names but I've heard of a couple of drugs that compete with HCQ that have shown some promise against Covid-19. Trump even mentioned one of them by Pfizer in his Friday news conference. Isn't it possible that if HCQ is effective against Covid-19, competitive medicines might be effective as well?ll my questions I'll keep asking these Dr FireChans. This shouldn't be difficult for a real MD, though I doubt at real MD would claim that there are 9 million treatments for lupus.
FireChans Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 (edited) On 4/12/2020 at 4:21 AM, Scraps said: Well, people with lupus have been prescribed this drug for a long time under a doctors supervision. I see you have avoided all my questions My problem is that HCQ has not been proven in clinical trials. Do you disagree? My problem is that people seem to be throwing caution to the wind. Do you disagree? I don't remember the drug names but I've heard of a couple of drugs that compete with HCQ that have shown some promise against Covid-19. Trump even mentioned one of them by Pfizer in his Friday news conference. Isn't it possible that if HCQ is effective against Covid-19, competitive medicines might be effective as well?ll my questions I'll keep asking these Dr FireChans. This shouldn't be difficult for a real MD, though I doubt at real MD would claim that there are 9 million treatments for lupus. Expand You can’t accuse me of dodging questions while you yourself are actively dodging my questions. Ideally, we would have the luxury of waiting for clinical trials to investigate efficacy, sure. Did you know that every year, thousands of Americans with treatment resistant cancer take trial medications that haven’t undergone significant study in attempt to save their lives because they don’t have 10 years to wait around? Yes, other medications may be effective. Not sure any of them have as much support as HCQ does at this time. On 4/12/2020 at 4:16 AM, FireChans said: How many people in the US have died from COVID-19 in the last month? How many have died from the side effects of HCQ? Do you really want to put lupus patients on a drug that “could lead to heart failure?” Expand Answer these now please. Edited April 12, 2020 by FireChans 1
Scraps Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 On 4/12/2020 at 4:24 AM, FireChans said: You can’t accuse me of dodging questions while you yourself are actively dodging my questions. Expand Seriously? You dodged my first question. Name the first million of the 9 million treatments for Lupus; I gave you the benefit of the doubt. Your answers havn.t been remotely close to anything any MD has said. I doubt you are an MD at all.
Azalin Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 On 4/12/2020 at 4:30 AM, Scraps said: Seriously? You dodged my first question. Name the first million of the 9 million treatments for Lupus; I gave you the benefit of the doubt. Your answers havn.t been remotely close to anything any MD has said. I doubt you are an MD at all. Expand Seriously? He used the rhetorical number "nine million" and you're trying to sound reasonable in asking him simply to name the first million? You're an ass and a troll. 2 2 1 1
FireChans Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 On 4/12/2020 at 4:30 AM, Scraps said: Seriously? You dodged my first question. Name the first million of the 9 million treatments for Lupus; I gave you the benefit of the doubt. Your answers havn.t been remotely close to anything any MD has said. I doubt you are an MD at all. Expand Lol, there’s the white flag. Everybody wants to play doctor but not everyone wants to read no heavy ass books. Listen pal, there’s a lot more to practicing medicine than googling side effects and going, “it’s not safe!!!!!!!!!!!” Every medication has a risk of side effects, including the antibiotics you take for a sinus infection. Everyday in this country, septic patients with chronic kidney disease are started on vancomycin, even though vancomycin has a significant risk of nephrotoxicity. But that risk is assumed, because you may die without that antibiotic. Everyday, cancer patients take novel immuno- and chemo-therapy drugs without proof of efficacy because they have very little hope of survival otherwise. HCQ as an example, has very low risks associated with it relatively speaking, especially in a short course. One of the most notable side effects, which is related to the eyes, takes MONTHS of therapy to occur. It’s a medication that has been around since the 50s and one that we know very well. When using it in a COVID patient, you would have a discussion about the risks and possible benefits, including the fact that it hasn’t been well studied. But like above, regardless of the lack of clinical trial data, most patient’s on death’s door would take the chance on a mostly benign drug. And ultimately, it’s shared decision making between both the patient and their physician. No one is forcing COVID patients to take HCQ. You don’t know what you’re talking about, which is okay. The easy solution is to shut the ***** up and stop trying to play doctor, because you suck at it. 1 2 1
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