Karlos Williams making a comeback

[FireChans]

1 minute ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

When a team hires a 70 year old guy as EVP/GM and the first thing he does is bring in an up-and-coming young exec from the Steelers and names him Assistant GM, and talks about how he's already grooming the young guy to take over, I'd say it's fair to lump their personnel decisions together.

Do you wanna talk revisionist? Nobody in  2011 was talking about what DOUG WHALEY thought. You are giving him relevance after the fact because he was eventually made GM. 

 

Do you know a single thing about what picks our current assistant GM deserves credit for? Or are you gonna say he’s the one who picked Josh Allen in 5 years if Beane leaves and he gets promoted?

[Clemfield2622]

this article does nothing but prove Whaley right. Williams was and obviously still is an awful person. 

 

There is a reason he's been out of the league 5 years. 

[FireChans]

4 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

The Bills made the playoffs in their 3rd full year of their ownership.  After a 17-year drought.  No propaganda was needed.

Doug Whaley was extended in 2015 and fired after 2016. Not sure what you’re trying to say.

[GunnerBill]

7 minutes ago, Phil The Thrill said:

Psst....it’s because he wasn’t a very good GM.  You and @GunnerBill are the only ones who don’t believe this.  
 

Now put that framed Whaley 8x 10 picture in the trash where it belongs.

 

 

Except I have told you I don't think he was a very good GM. 

 

You don't read my posts. 

[Phil The Thrill]

Just now, Clemfield2622 said:

this article does nothing but prove Whaley right. Williams was and obviously still is an awful person. 

 

There is a reason he's been out of the league 5 years. 

I’m no Whaley fan but I will say he made the right decision with Karlos.  He didn’t take working in the NFL seriously and couldn’t perform anywhere near at the level he did as a rookie.  
 

He threw away a promising career and I think Whaley made the right call releasing Karlos, as he did the year before by releasing Fred Jackson 

[DrDawkinstein]

Just now, GunnerBill said:

 

Except I have told you I don't think he was a very good GM. 

 

You don't read my posts. 

 

It's nuts.

 

None of us are saying the dude was great. But we try to temper the hate with some real examples and say hey maybe he wasnt the worst of all time (and not responsible for a 20 year drought), and they flip out and call us "apologists" and talk like they love the smell of their own farts.

[MrEpsYtown]

12 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

 

I think its silly that he says he is one of the best running backs in the game right now. Because he isn’t actually in the game. He’s as much in the game as I am. 

[Clemfield2622]

1 minute ago, Phil The Thrill said:

I’m no Whaley fan but I will say he made the right decision with Karlos.  He didn’t take working in the NFL seriously and couldn’t perform anywhere near at the level he did as a rookie.  
 

He threw away a promising career and I think Whaley made the right call releasing Karlos, as he did the year before by releasing Fred Jackson 

 

Whaley made it pretty clear he valued talent and production above all. He would have kept Williams around if he gave 1% effort, but that was apparently too much to ask. 

[GunnerBill]

Just now, DrDawkinstein said:

 

It's nuts.

 

None of us are saying the dude was great. But we try to temper the hate with some real examples and say hey maybe he wasnt the worst of all time (and not responsible for a 20 year drought), and they flip out and call us "apologists" and talk like they love the smell of their own farts.

 

It is the invention of false narratives that I don't get. There is enough to criticise Doug Whaley for without making stuff up. 

[DrDawkinstein]

9 minutes ago, Phil The Thrill said:

This is truth.  Hence, why the term “Whaley apologist” is legit

 

Get over yourself

 

6 minutes ago, Phil The Thrill said:

I love Freddy and still have his jersey.  But Whaley made the right call.  Karlos was awesome his rookie year

But then you’d have no excuses for the bad decisions!?!?!?!?

 

No, I'll call them what they were. Ive never said he was 100% perfect. But yall talk like he was an abject failure, when he did some good things, especially given the circumstance he had to work with.

[dhg]

That will look good on a resumé

[Phil The Thrill]

4 minutes ago, FireChans said:

Do you wanna talk revisionist? Nobody in  2011 was talking about what DOUG WHALEY thought. You are giving him relevance after the fact because he was eventually made GM. 

 

Do you know a single thing about what picks our current assistant GM deserves credit for? Or are you gonna say he’s the one who picked Josh Allen in 5 years if Beane leaves and he gets promoted?

There’s a lot of truth with what the Doc is saying.  Whaley fans want to give Whaley all the credit for the Jerry Hughes deal which was a steal.  But when it comes to EJ, it was all on Buddy. 
 

Theres a theme here - any good move under the Nix/Whaley regime was all Whaley.  All the bad moves are on Buddy.

 

I think that was Dawk was saying is that Whaley likely had a lot of input on the decisions and many here did tout him as the future GM.  So you can distance Whaley from moves like EJ and give him credit for bringing players like Hughes on board.  
 

It doesn’t work that way...
 

 

[FireChans]

5 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

It's nuts.

 

None of us are saying the dude was great. But we try to temper the hate with some real examples and say hey maybe he wasnt the worst of all time (and not responsible for a 20 year drought), and they flip out and call us "apologists" and talk like they love the smell of their own farts.

Because you give credit for things that Whaley didn’t do in an effort to prop him 

 

3 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

It is the invention of false narratives that I don't get. There is enough to criticise Doug Whaley for without making stuff up. 

I’d say giving Whaley credit for picking Dareus, Gilmore, Searcy, Glenn, AW and Bradham is leaning heavily on “making stuff up.”

 

Whaley wasn’t the worst GM of all time. He was just another kinda crappy one. He did some good things. He had some really solid picks for contributors. He never drafted a ProBowler, he stopped attempting to find a QB, and ultimately, he was a terrible leader who couldn’t get along with any of his HC’s (who also deserve blame). 

Edited April 9, 2020 by FireChans

[Phil The Thrill]

8 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

It's nuts.

 

None of us are saying the dude was great. But we try to temper the hate with some real examples and say hey maybe he wasnt the worst of all time (and not responsible for a 20 year drought), and they flip out and call us "apologists" and talk like they love the smell of their own farts.

I just think you have to be fair.  Many of the comments from @C.Biscuit97 seem to trash the current administration and pine for Doug Whaley.  Many times these comments are just not accurate.

 

This is what gets me - propping up fake accomplishment of Whaley to trash the current administration who has been way more successful than Whaley ever was

Edited April 9, 2020 by Phil The Thrill

[GunnerBill]

1 minute ago, FireChans said:

I’d say giving Whaley credit for picking Dareus, Gilmore, Searcy, Glenn, AW and Bradham is leaning heavily on “making stuff up.”

 

Whaley wasn’t the worst GM of all time. He was just another kinda crappy one. He did some good things. He had some really solid picks for contributors. He never drafted a ProBowler, he stopped attempting to find a QB, and ultimately, he was a terrible leader who couldn’t get along with any of his HC’s (who also deserve blame). 

 

I agree. The Doug Whaley drafts were 2013-2016. 

 

I agree with the rest of your post too. 

[Phil The Thrill]

2 minutes ago, FireChans said:

Because you give credit for things that Whaley didn’t do in an effort to prop him 

 

I’d say giving Whaley credit for picking Dareus, Gilmore, Searcy, Glenn, AW and Bradham is leaning heavily on “making stuff up.”

 

Whaley wasn’t the worst GM of all time. He was just another kinda crappy one. He did some good things. He had some really solid picks for contributors. He never drafted a ProBowler, he stopped attempting to find a QB, and ultimately, he was a terrible leader who couldn’t get along with any of his HC’s (who also deserve blame). 

I would put his work on par with the job Buddy Nix did here - below average 

[chris heff]

25 minutes ago, Call_Of_Ktulu said:

I’ve always ranked Russ Brandon as the number 1 reason. Whaley made up a big enough piece of that ***** sandwich to be considered major. No other team wanted him after he was released tells you everything that you need to know.

None of the people being pointed at are the reason for the drought. With all deference to the man, the fault lies with Ralph Wilson. He and he alone is responsible for the parade of incompetence at One Bills Drive.

[Florida Bills Fanatic]

3 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Ah, this boards logic.  Whaley gets no credit for good moves. Only the bad ones.  

Whaley was a train wreck from day one.  He didn't miss on every move but he missed on enough to show everyone in the league that he was not a capable GM.  He had apparently functioned well in lesser positions in personnel departments but was unfortunately promoted to a level for which he was incapable or unprepared or both. He was not a bad guy, in fact he had a reputation for being a very good person. I believe he felt a desperate need to turn things around fast and took some gambles that didn't pay off.  On more than one occasion, he apparently disregarded advice from the scouting department and made moves on some players that turned out poorly.  I think he felt that he had better skill at evaluating players than long term scouts that had been part of Buffalo's long standing struggles.  I for one am happy to move on and not dwell on past failures.  I think Karlos Williams should look in a mirror to find the guy to criticize and leave Doug Whaley alone.

[Clemfield2622]

Can we steer this thread back to talking about what a piece of crap Karlos Williams is?

Edited April 9, 2020 by Clemfield2622

[Phil The Thrill]

7 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

Get over yourself

 

 

No, I'll call them what they were. Ive never said he was 100% perfect. But yall talk like he was an abject failure, when he did some good things, especially given the circumstance he had to work with.

I’ve him credit for some of the things he did with free agent signings.  But ultimately I think he was just as bad as Buddy Nix whose teams put up a worse record than the Marv/Jauron years.