NavyBillsFan Posted April 17, 2005 Share Posted April 17, 2005 Clements is gone guys....... So what can we do? Tag him? No way! If TD can pull off a trade to the Skins. I say do it. Clements will clean out his locker after the season and say bye. We will then get a 4th round pick for him a year or two later, SCREW THAT! Do the dang trade! We dont need a #9 pick, there isnt much on this draft that I would kill for. So trade the pick away.... Trade down to a 18-26 pick and try to land on of these guys... Heath Miller TE Mark Clayton or Roddy White WR Marlin Jackson cb Jammal Brown OT Also, grab another 2nd round pick with the trade.... Figure this. That would give us a 1st, 2 or 3 2nd round picks (If Henry goes to philly its for a second/Cards will be a pick swap) 1 late first and 3 second round pics sounds kind of nice to me..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2003 Posted April 17, 2005 Share Posted April 17, 2005 That sounds logical... I do it any day of the week. Nate Clements (to me) is a little overrated (boneheaded plays.ie jags game & punt returns). But I think the Bills should keep the oick and draft that stud old from Texas because that would be a huge upgrade from Posey and the Bills linebackers are getting up there in age. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d_wag Posted April 17, 2005 Share Posted April 17, 2005 Clements is gone guys....... So what can we do? Tag him? 307283[/snapback] or they could just sign him long-term and keep one of the best young players on the team around.........what a novel concept! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Posted April 17, 2005 Share Posted April 17, 2005 I'd trade him for a 2nd and third this year, and a first next year....first round holds less value this year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dwight Drane Posted April 17, 2005 Share Posted April 17, 2005 Clements is gone guys....... So what can we do? Tag him? No way! If TD can pull off a trade to the Skins. I say do it. Clements will clean out his locker after the season and say bye. We will then get a 4th round pick for him a year or two later, SCREW THAT! Do the dang trade! We dont need a #9 pick, there isnt much on this draft that I would kill for. So trade the pick away.... Trade down to a 18-26 pick and try to land on of these guys... Heath Miller TE Mark Clayton or Roddy White WR Marlin Jackson cb Jammal Brown OT Also, grab another 2nd round pick with the trade.... Figure this. That would give us a 1st, 2 or 3 2nd round picks (If Henry goes to philly its for a second/Cards will be a pick swap) 1 late first and 3 second round pics sounds kind of nice to me..... 307283[/snapback] I agree Navy. While Clements made a big jump up last year, our run Defense is what made this team, allowing our pass defense to look a little better. It took Clements 3 years to stop biting on every stop and fade thrown his way. People have stopped talking about Ty Law and Rolle, who are both still out there, and we get Kevin Thomas back at nickle who is a solid CB. With a #9, you can get the best pass rusher in the draft, which makes your secondary better, or the top OL who would be an upgrade over ANY OL we currently have. Also, Wash is dying to get rid of Rod Gardner, who would look fine as a #3 in a stretch offense with a mobile QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandon Posted April 17, 2005 Share Posted April 17, 2005 I've been against trading Nate Clements, but I'm starting to come around to the idea IF they can find a solid veteran CB to replace him with. If they could do that, such a trade would give them the opportunity to draft two or three potential upgrades offensively which are desperately needed and still have a pick left over to find a good CB prospect in R2 or 3. In other words, if they can turn a trade of Nate Clements into two or possibly three good players at LT, C, CB or TE, yeah, that's something that I'd have to consider if I were Donahoe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Tuesday Posted April 17, 2005 Share Posted April 17, 2005 or they could just sign him long-term and keep one of the best young players on the team around.........what a novel concept! 307288[/snapback] Neither novel nor prudent. If you can get 2-3 quality players for Clements - for example, a quality CB and o-linemen or d-linemen, all of whom you'd be getting for likely less than the total cost of what it would cost to sign Clements, COMBINED, you do this deal in a heartbeat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turftoe Posted April 17, 2005 Share Posted April 17, 2005 I have not seen a thing in the official press even suggesting this trade. Looks like pure speculation by some dreamy eyed bills fan. If we would have a hard time paying Clements, then how on earth does Washington afford him. They are closer to the cap than we are. Show me one REPUTABLE source please! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d_wag Posted April 17, 2005 Share Posted April 17, 2005 Neither novel nor prudent. If you can get 2-3 quality players for Clements - for example, a quality CB and o-linemen or d-linemen, all of whom you'd be getting for likely less than the total cost of what it would cost to sign Clements, COMBINED, you do this deal in a heartbeat. 307305[/snapback] so i guess the jags are dumb for locking up a good young player in marcus stroud...... the lions are dumb for locking up a good young player in shaun rogers....... the eagles are dumb for locking up their good young corners in sheppard and brown........ i could go on, and on, and on.......but why bother? all those teams are obviously dumb because they are paying to keep their good young talent........what a bunch of suckers...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Tuesday Posted April 17, 2005 Share Posted April 17, 2005 so i guess the jags are dumb for locking up a good young player in marcus stroud...... the lions are dumb for locking up a good young player in shaun rogers....... the eagles are dumb for locking up their good young corners in sheppard and brown........ i could go on, and on, and on.......but why bother? all those teams are obviously dumb because they are paying to keep their good young talent........what a bunch of suckers...... 307310[/snapback] 1) you will go on and on, regardless of what you swear to now 2) as I've told you, the contracts for Sheppard and Brown in years 1-3 are what Nate would likely demand, COMBINED 3) teams are only "dumb" for making these moves if they had offers on the table like I'm suggesting we could have for Clements - combined with the fact that this is a CB-rich draft. If anyone here is dumb, it's the 'Skins, for dealing their top pick plus some others for Clements when they can have a good CB on the cheap in this draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d_wag Posted April 17, 2005 Share Posted April 17, 2005 1) you will go on and on, regardless of what you swear to now2) as I've told you, the contracts for Sheppard and Brown in years 1-3 are what Nate would likely demand, COMBINED 3) teams are only "dumb" for making these moves if they had offers on the table like I'm suggesting we could have for Clements - combined with the fact that this is a CB-rich draft. If anyone here is dumb, it's the 'Skins, for dealing their top pick plus some others for Clements when they can have a good CB on the cheap in this draft. 307312[/snapback] sheppard first 3 years -- 6M in salary........9M in signing bonus brown first 3 years -- 6.25M in salary..........7.5M in signing bonus you think clements will command a contract containing 12.25M in salary for the first 3 years and a bonus of at least 16.5M? just to give you an idea how dumb this sounds, champ is scheduled to earn 7.5M in salary the first 3 years of his deal...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozymandius Posted April 17, 2005 Share Posted April 17, 2005 Clements is PRO BOWL Cornerback, people... whoever we draft at #9 overall has a 50/50 chance of being a bust... such is the case with high draft picks if you look at draft history... even if he weren't a bust, it'd take a few years to develop him into a great player... We've already gone through the growing pains with Clements, and now he's entering his prime, ready to deliver at least three to four more great seasons... and we're going to f'ing give him away for a draft pick??????? Don't be such pussies. "oh no, we're going to lose him in free agency, let's panic and destroy our secondary by giving him away for unproven players in a crap draft".... as long as there's a franchise tag, we hold the cards guys... don't panic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Tuesday Posted April 17, 2005 Share Posted April 17, 2005 sheppard first 3 years -- 6M in salary........9M in signing bonusbrown first 3 years -- 6.25M in salary..........7.5M in signing bonus you think clements will command a contract containing 12.25M in salary for the first 3 years and a bonus of at least 16.5M? just to give you an idea how dumb this sounds, champ is scheduled to earn 7.5M in salary the first 3 years of his deal...... 307315[/snapback] Where are you getting these numbers? If you're just taking the total amount of each contract and dividing by the number of years, that's not going to be accurate. The Eagles are famous for signing players to long-term "backloaded" contracts with cheap prices in the first three-four years and then either renegotiating or releasing after that initial period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d_wag Posted April 17, 2005 Share Posted April 17, 2005 Where are you getting these numbers? If you're just taking the total amount of each contract and dividing by the number of years, that's not going to be accurate. The Eagles are famous for signing players to long-term "backloaded" contracts with cheap prices in the first three-four years and then either renegotiating or releasing after that initial period. 307320[/snapback] those are the actual salaries taken directly from the nflpa database........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RVJ Posted April 17, 2005 Share Posted April 17, 2005 Clements is PRO BOWL Cornerback, people... whoever we draft at #9 overall has a 50/50 chance of being a bust... such is the case with high draft picks if you look at draft history... even if he weren't a bust, it'd take a few years to develop him into a great player... We've already gone through the growing pains with Clements, and now he's entering his prime, ready to deliver at least three to four more great seasons... and we're going to f'ing give him away for a draft pick??????? Don't be such pussies. "oh no, we're going to lose him in free agency, let's panic and destroy our secondary by giving him away for unproven players in a crap draft".... as long as there's a franchise tag, we hold the cards guys... don't panic 307317[/snapback] Thats what the raiders did.(franchise) 10.5 million for Woodsen for one year guaranteed money. Next year it will be even more if we franchise Nate. Now the Raiders are desperatley trying to trade him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted April 17, 2005 Share Posted April 17, 2005 Thats what the raiders did.(franchise) 10.5 million for Woodsen for one year guaranteed money. Next year it will be even more if we franchise Nate.Now the Raiders are desperatley trying to trade him. 307322[/snapback] Woodson's deal is slightly different because he's been franchised two consecutive seasons. The actual franchise tender for CBs is about a million lower. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted April 17, 2005 Share Posted April 17, 2005 This is probably the one draft where you really DON'T want a high 1st round pick. From what I read, teams are begging the Bills to make a deal. I know TD does not want to pay "round one" money to a "round two" talent player. If TD does make a deal, look for a 2nd round pick this year, and maybe a 2nd in 2006. PTR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rico Posted April 17, 2005 Share Posted April 17, 2005 Clements is PRO BOWL Cornerback, people... whoever we draft at #9 overall has a 50/50 chance of being a bust... such is the case with high draft picks if you look at draft history... even if he weren't a bust, it'd take a few years to develop him into a great player... We've already gone through the growing pains with Clements, and now he's entering his prime, ready to deliver at least three to four more great seasons... and we're going to f'ing give him away for a draft pick??????? Don't be such pussies. "oh no, we're going to lose him in free agency, let's panic and destroy our secondary by giving him away for unproven players in a crap draft".... as long as there's a franchise tag, we hold the cards guys... don't panic 307317[/snapback] Agree 100%. Just pay him, TD!Dead cap space be damned, I'd much rather see Mike Williams get dumped now if it meant getting the $$$ to Nate that he deserves. MW can be replaced much easier than Nate can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fla Bills Fan Posted April 17, 2005 Share Posted April 17, 2005 Clements is PRO BOWL Cornerback, people... whoever we draft at #9 overall has a 50/50 chance of being a bust... such is the case with high draft picks if you look at draft history... even if he weren't a bust, it'd take a few years to develop him into a great player... We've already gone through the growing pains with Clements, and now he's entering his prime, ready to deliver at least three to four more great seasons... and we're going to f'ing give him away for a draft pick??????? Don't be such pussies. "oh no, we're going to lose him in free agency, let's panic and destroy our secondary by giving him away for unproven players in a crap draft".... as long as there's a franchise tag, we hold the cards guys... don't panic 307317[/snapback] I totally agree with you. Unless Nate has made it known to TD he does not want to resign, I say keep him. If he says now he wants to stay,and later wants way too much money we franchise or transition him & get at least a #1 (probably not a #9 in the draft). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BF_in_Indiana Posted April 17, 2005 Share Posted April 17, 2005 The one thing that the "don't trade Clements" crowd is overlooking is the fact that he is going to demand like 9 million per or whatever Winfield and others have gotten. We CANNOT afford that. We have a good secondary even if you take him out of it. I think we could trade away that 9th pick and pick up 2 extra picks plus whatever we get for Henry. If we have like 6 picks in rounds 1-3 there is a good chance we hit on 1, 2, or 3 of them. This team isn't far away and if we can nail down a few top flight players in the draft we are a legit contender even without Clements. I like Nate, but I think you have to look at being cost effective, and paying him that kind of money next year is not that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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