There should be a national dialogue in getting back to work

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

15 minutes ago, Artful Dodger said:

 

Last time I looked, Austria was in Europe. 

 

...I have a call into Joe Biden to verify.....you may be wrong...he NEVER is...............

[Magox]

8 minutes ago, Artful Dodger said:

 

Last time I looked, Austria was in Europe. 

I misread what you wrote.

 

I was looking at Austria and they have one of the lowest Confirmation infection rates of all of Europe.   So it’s logical to assume that they haven’t developed any sort of herd immunity.

 

Places like Spain, Italy, France, Belgium, New York and other population zones would have considerably higher infection rates.

 

Even in Germany in a small town where their outbreak started there was antibody testing that took place and discovered 15% infection rate.  And Germany has been one of the countries with the lowest infection rates.

 

In regards to opening up, it wouldn’t be a full throttle approach but more of a staggered phasing in based off of geography. 
 

Also another fascinating test case is to see what is happening in Sweden.  They have had a more surgical approach to the social distancing and for weeks now there have been grim predictions regarding what they thought they would go through.  It still hasn’t happened yet.  That could change but they are faring considerably better than most of Europe.

 

 

[Artful Dodger]

1 minute ago, Magox said:

In regards to opening up, it wouldn’t be a full throttle approach but more of a staggered phasing in based off of geography. 

 

Also another fascinating test case is to see what is happening in Sweden.  They have had a more surgical approach to the social distancing and for weeks now there have been grim predictions regarding what they thought they would go through.  It still hasn’t happened yet.  That could change but they are faring considerably better than most of Europe.

 

 

 

I actually agree with you.  If people are going to die anyway, we might has well have a working economy.   We can't all sit around for an entire next year waiting for a vaccine to be developed.   So once we've got enough masks and ventilators and hospital beds, then people should gradually get back to work and practice social distancing as much as possible, recognizing that some people are going to get sick and some will die.  But once you've  had the virus and survived, you've got immunity, and then you can resume living a normal life.

 

I just don't understand why so many people celebrate a plateauing in the number of cases as some kind of major victory.   If you can't leave your home, it's not much of a victory.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

30 minutes ago, Magox said:

I misread what you wrote.

 

I was looking at Austria and they have one of the lowest Confirmation infection rates of all of Europe.   So it’s logical to assume that they haven’t developed any sort of herd immunity.

 

Places like Spain, Italy, France, Belgium, New York and other population zones would have considerably higher infection rates.

 

Even in Germany in a small town where their outbreak started there was antibody testing that took place and discovered 15% infection rate.  And Germany has been one of the countries with the lowest infection rates.

 

In regards to opening up, it wouldn’t be a full throttle approach but more of a staggered phasing in based off of geography. 
 

Also another fascinating test case is to see what is happening in Sweden.  They have had a more surgical approach to the social distancing and for weeks now there have been grim predictions regarding what they thought they would go through.  It still hasn’t happened yet.  That could change but they are faring considerably better than most of Europe.

 

 

 

...certainly understand what you are saying, but FWIW I see more complexity to an individual state's decision, especially if you consider Interstate commerce......does a state SOLEY reopen within the confines of its own borders?.....OR....do they review the situations of neighboring states and allow/disallow those who may not qualify?.....we are a Rochester NY based contractor with operations in PA and NJ.....we are an essential business under NYS guidelines, continuing to operate , but had to shut down PA and NJ operations because there are no such exclusion declarations.....thus we are at the mercy of decisions on a state by state basis......

[Foxx]

31 minutes ago, Artful Dodger said:

 

I actually agree with you.  If people are going to die anyway, we might has well have a working economy.   We can't all sit around for an entire next year waiting for a vaccine to be developed.   So once we've got enough masks and ventilators and hospital beds, then people should gradually get back to work and practice social distancing as much as possible, recognizing that some people are going to get sick and some will die.  But once you've  had the virus and survived, you've got immunity, and then you can resume living a normal life.

 

I just don't understand why so many people celebrate a plateauing in the number of cases as some kind of major victory.   If you can't leave your home, it's not much of a victory.

until it mutates enough to make the vaccine impotent..

[RochesterRob]

9 minutes ago, Foxx said:

until it mutates enough to make the vaccine impotent..

  I believe the release by China was deliberate and meant to cause harm so no doubt the next virus is at some stage of development in their lab and perhaps ready to be released. 

[Magox]

19 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

...certainly understand what you are saying, but FWIW I see more complexity to an individual state's decision, especially if you consider Interstate commerce......does a state SOLEY reopen within the confines of its own borders?.....OR....do they review the situations of neighboring states and allow/disallow those who may not qualify?.....we are a Rochester NY based contractor with operations in PA and NJ.....we are an essential business under NYS guidelines, continuing to operate , but had to shut down PA and NJ operations because there are no such exclusion declarations.....thus we are at the mercy of decisions on a state by state basis......

I think each state will have to get specific about how they go about this.   Restricting State by state travel I don’t see in the cards, at least now.  They may do some mandatory quarantining from one state to another in certain circumstances but I think that is as far as it will go at least initially.

 

 

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

1 minute ago, Magox said:

I think each state will have to get specific about how they go about this.   Restricting State by state travel I don’t see in the cards, at least now.  They may do some mandatory quarantining from one state to another in certain circumstances but I think that is as far as it will go at least initially.

 

 

 

...have to respectfully disagree...many states already have incoming travel bans/mandatory 14 day quarantine restrictions for folks from NY or NJ as examples......as states slowly reopen, I just do not see those restrictions being lifted anytime soon............

[Magox]

12 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

...have to respectfully disagree...many states already have incoming travel bans/mandatory 14 day quarantine restrictions for folks from NY or NJ as examples......as states slowly reopen, I just do not see those restrictions being lifted anytime soon............

That’s what I was saying.  Maybe I didn’t communicate that as well as I could have.  That the mandatory quarantining could be what states do but not actual travel restrictions.  At least not now.

[Foxx]

23 minutes ago, Magox said:

I think each state will have to get specific about how they go about this.   Restricting State by state travel I don’t see in the cards, at least now.  They may do some mandatory quarantining from one state to another in certain circumstances but I think that is as far as it will go at least initially.

 

 

 

 

remind anyone of anything in the past?

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

6 minutes ago, Magox said:

That’s what I was saying.  Maybe I didn’t communicate that as well as I could have.  That the mandatory quarantining could be what states do but not actual travel restrictions.  At least not now.

 

 

....got it............but banning Easter church services in a church parking lot while parishioners stay in their cars is ludicrous......how many people cling to faith as their ONLY hope or salvation?....yet preyed upon by the scums like Osteen, Reverend Ike, TD Jacobs, Rev Creflo, et al?......saw a piece on Texas Metal about "Reverend Romero" and his stable of multiple exotic cars.......THAT swamp is DEEP.....nothing like milking the down trodden...

[Chef Jim]

25 minutes ago, Foxx said:

 

 

remind anyone of anything in the past?

So only people in uniform are essential?   Last I looked people at the grocery store typically don’t wear uniforms. 

[GG]

1 hour ago, Magox said:

I misread what you wrote.

 

I was looking at Austria and they have one of the lowest Confirmation infection rates of all of Europe.   So it’s logical to assume that they haven’t developed any sort of herd immunity.

 

Places like Spain, Italy, France, Belgium, New York and other population zones would have considerably higher infection rates.

 

Even in Germany in a small town where their outbreak started there was antibody testing that took place and discovered 15% infection rate.  And Germany has been one of the countries with the lowest infection rates.

 

In regards to opening up, it wouldn’t be a full throttle approach but more of a staggered phasing in based off of geography. 
 

Also another fascinating test case is to see what is happening in Sweden.  They have had a more surgical approach to the social distancing and for weeks now there have been grim predictions regarding what they thought they would go through.  It still hasn’t happened yet.  That could change but they are faring considerably better than most of Europe.

 

 

 

Climate, culture & custom.

[Magox]

3 minutes ago, GG said:

 

Climate, culture & custom.

It certainly plays a large role.  

[Chef Jim]

32 minutes ago, Foxx said:

 

 

remind anyone of anything in the past?

 

[shoshin]

2 hours ago, Magox said:

 

One major problem with your faulty take.

 

Australia is in the Southern Hemisphere, not only is it in the Southern Hemisphere but it’s way down south.  And not only is it way down south but their population centers are on the southern side.

 

Why do you think this is important?

 

Let me give you a hint, the Southern Hemisphere are not in their flu seasons.  More heat and humidity.  Recorded Infection rates in the Southern Hemisphere are Over 10,000% less than the Northern Hemisphere.
 

You aren’t even comparing apples to oranges but rather apples to turnips 

 

 

 

 

 

The only solution when you take this tone  and look this bad on the internet is seppuku. I wish you an honorable death. 
 

2 hours ago, Magox said:

I

 

In regards to opening up, it wouldn’t be a full throttle approach but more of a staggered phasing in based off of geography. 
 

Also another fascinating test case is to see what is happening in Sweden.  They have had a more surgical approach to the social distancing and for weeks now there have been grim predictions regarding what they thought they would go through.  It still hasn’t happened yet.  That could change but they are faring considerably better than most of Europe.

 

 

Sweden is culturally an anomaly. I will find the number but some incredibly high number of people Live alone there. Plus they have only 3 population centers of note, and a highly educated and compliant with sensible distancing rules population. There will be cultures to emulate coming out of this. Sweden is one to watch. 

 

12 minutes ago, GG said:

 

Climate, culture & custom.

 But I still wonder at India. Sure it’s hot there now as they enter their warm season but they have 1.4 billion people living in each other’s laps. 

Edited April 12, 2020 by shoshin

[ALF]

1 hour ago, RochesterRob said:

  I believe the release by China was deliberate and meant to cause harm so no doubt the next virus is at some stage of development in their lab and perhaps ready to be released. 

 

If China wanted to harm the world it would make more sense to release it far from China.

The one theory was someone from the lab there sold test animals to that market.

[Chef Jim]

1 minute ago, ALF said:

 

If China wanted to harm the world it would make more sense to release it far from China.

The one theory was someone from the lab there sold test animals to that market.

I’m not a conspiracy nut and I don’t believe China release this on purpose but if they did I would not doubt they would take out a few of their own to protect their innocence.  Collateral damage. 

[RochesterRob]

3 minutes ago, ALF said:

 

If China wanted to harm the world it would make more sense to release it far from China.

The one theory was someone from the lab there sold test animals to that market.

  Which they did by releasing into select portions of their population that travel outside of their country among other methods.  Guest workers into Italy and so forth.  Not hard to do for a country that most likely extensively tracks its citizens. 

 

 

 

 

[Foxx]

20 minutes ago, Chef Jim said:

 

i was thinkin' more along the lines of governments historically manipulating their citizens to turn their neighbors in. this is not conspiracy stuff either, it is generally considered proven fact.

Edited April 12, 2020 by Foxx