There should be a national dialogue in getting back to work

[Magox]

Excellent take by Zakaria.   It’s only 5 minutes.  I think it’s worth listening to

 

 

[Deranged Rhino]

43 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

What is needed right now is for the country and it’s people to pull together and not apart.

The only way that can happen is to expose and destroy the elements that have been intentionally dividing us for decades. 

[RochesterRob]

15 minutes ago, Deranged Rhino said:

The only way that can happen is to expose and destroy the elements that have been intentionally dividing us for decades. 

  And anybody that says that those elements do not exist or cannot be found here are liars or are ignorant.

[spartacus]

4 hours ago, westside2 said:

***** the CDC.  I don't trust those bastards either. Might as well wear a hair net for a mask. You'll get the same results. 

this is correct

the virus is a nano spec particle visible only by electron microscope

even the N95 mask will not stop particles in or out

 

so cloth masks are about as effective as a hairnet in stopping transmission of the virus

worse, reusable cloth masks which collect viru particles, serve as a breading ground for the virus which speeds the spread much fsate than without a mask

[Beast]

The door for the argument to stay closed is shutting fast.

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/news.yahoo.com/amphtml/health-secretary-no-spike-coronavirus-174311456.html

 

 

Edited May 17, 2020 by Beast

[B-Man]

 

ROGER KIMBALL: With Pandemic, Societal Hallucination Yields Real Misery.

 

The time is not far off when we will wake from this societal hallucination. We will then wonder why we were prevailed upon to commit collective suicide because of a disease that affected mostly the elderly and infirm and whose lethality was that of a bad flu.

 

To the enraged question “Who did this to us?” the sad but truthful answer will be, “We did it to ourselves.”

 

 

Read the whole thing.

 

 

 

 

[Boatdrinks]

22 minutes ago, spartacus said:

this is correct

the virus is a nano spec particle visible only by electron microscope

even the N95 mask will not stop particles in or out

 

so cloth masks are about as effective as a hairnet in stopping transmission of the virus

worse, reusable cloth masks which collect viru particles, serve as a breading ground for the virus which speeds the spread much fsate than without a mask

And most people find masks uncomfortable , so they inevitably touch their faces multiple times and touch the mask while adjusting it. Amazing that gloves were immediately dismissed as ineffective by the media after their flaws were pointed out.  However, Fauci’s  original take on masks was similar to the issues brought up with gloves,( right down to providing a “ false sense of security)  and he said they weren’t needed. 

[B-Man]

CHARLIE BAKER’S CORONAVIRUS STRATEGY: Fiddle, make Massachusetts wait.

 

Clueless Democrats want Gov. Charlie Baker to keep the state’s economy shuttered and they will probably get most of their wish granted when Baker unveils his coronavirus reopening plan Monday.

 

Don’t expect much out of Baker — he’s made clear he wants no part of a quick restart.

 

And Baker has purposely made any details of his plans secret, giving businesses like restaurants no head start on how they might plan to open their doors again. The confusion and consternation caused by Baker’s super-cautious reticence has made predicting what might happen a guessing game.

 

A half-dozen Democratic legislators petitioned the Republican governor last week to extend the state’s stay-at-home advisory past May 18. The Republican governor is more in line with them than the thousands of business owners clamoring for a reopening.

 

 

 

 

.

[Doc Brown]

3 hours ago, Boatdrinks said:

Not really. What is needed is to trust no one...assume everyone near you could be carrying Covid 19 and a. Wash your hands frequently b. Maintain your distance from others c.  Don’t touch your face  d. If you must cough, sneeze and can’t control it, turn away and do so into your elbow. That will help more than platitudes about “ togetherness”  etc etc. 

Together, we should all make this a priority.

[DrW]

1 hour ago, spartacus said:

 

 

so cloth masks are about as effective as a hairnet in stopping transmission of the virus

worse, reusable cloth masks which collect viru particles, serve as a breading ground for the virus which speeds the spread much fsate than without a mask

 

So, your first argument is that masks cannot stop spreading of the virus. Then you argue that the mask will collect virus particles. If the latter is true, it will stop spreading the virus.

[Chef Jim]

54 minutes ago, B-Man said:

CHARLIE BAKER’S CORONAVIRUS STRATEGY: Fiddle, make Massachusetts wait.

 

Clueless Democrats want Gov. Charlie Baker to keep the state’s economy shuttered and they will probably get most of their wish granted when Baker unveils his coronavirus reopening plan Monday.

 

Don’t expect much out of Baker — he’s made clear he wants no part of a quick restart.

 

And Baker has purposely made any details of his plans secret, giving businesses like restaurants no head start on how they might plan to open their doors again. The confusion and consternation caused by Baker’s super-cautious reticence has made predicting what might happen a guessing game.

 

A half-dozen Democratic legislators petitioned the Republican governor last week to extend the state’s stay-at-home advisory past May 18. The Republican governor is more in line with them than the thousands of business owners clamoring for a reopening.

 

 

 

 

.

 

This whole keeping businesses in the dark is a B word. Sure they don’t know or have a lot of answers but how involved are the business communities involved in the decision making?

[Cinga]

1 hour ago, B-Man said:

 

ROGER KIMBALL: With Pandemic, Societal Hallucination Yields Real Misery.

 

The time is not far off when we will wake from this societal hallucination. We will then wonder why we were prevailed upon to commit collective suicide because of a disease that affected mostly the elderly and infirm and whose lethality was that of a bad flu.

 

To the enraged question “Who did this to us?” the sad but truthful answer will be, “We did it to ourselves.”

 

 

Read the whole thing.

 

 

 

 

From your article, I found this link:
https://swprs.org/studies-on-covid-19-lethality/

 

and this

 

https://swprs.org/a-swiss-doctor-on-covid-19/

 

According to data from the best-studied countries and regions, the lethality of Covid19 is on average about 0.2%, which is in the range of a severe influenza (flu) and about twenty times lower than originally assumed by the WHO.

 

Looks like a well compiled list of the things most of us have known, and discussed here. Great find!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Doc Brown]

3 minutes ago, Cinga said:

From your article, I found this link:
https://swprs.org/studies-on-covid-19-lethality/

 

and this

 

https://swprs.org/a-swiss-doctor-on-covid-19/

 

According to data from the best-studied countries and regions, the lethality of Covid19 is on average about 0.2%, which is in the range of a severe influenza (flu) and about twenty times lower than originally assumed by the WHO.

 

Looks like a well compiled list of the things most of us have known, and discussed here. Great find!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

That article is two weeks old and we've known this for quite some time that the real death rate is pry .2% to .5%.  For comparison, the H1N1 flu season of 2009 the death rate was about .02%.  The problem is 90,000 plus people have died from this within a two and a half month time period because of how contagious this thing is.  That's with social distancing and lockdown measures.  If half the US population gets this virus you're looking at around 230,000 deaths using that .2% number. 

 

You can debate about whether the measures were too extreme or not extreme enough but I wish people would stop comparing it to the damn flu.  

[plenzmd1]

4 hours ago, Deranged Rhino said:

The only way that can happen is to expose and destroy the elements that have been intentionally dividing us for decades. 

which you continue to procgimate  I may add

4 hours ago, RochesterRob said:

  And anybody that says that those elements do not exist or cannot be found here are liars or are ignorant.

proff positive @Deranged Rhino

Edited May 18, 2020 by plenzmd1

[shoshin]

11 hours ago, spartacus said:

this is correct

the virus is a nano spec particle visible only by electron microscope

even the N95 mask will not stop particles in or out

 

so cloth masks are about as effective as a hairnet in stopping transmission of the virus

worse, reusable cloth masks which collect viru particles, serve as a breading ground for the virus which speeds the spread much fsate than without a mask

More non-scientific takes that sound science-y. Masks prevent droplet transmission. You may have heard this before. 
 

And at this point you can do better than a rough cloth mask too. 

9 hours ago, Doc Brown said:

That article is two weeks old and we've known this for quite some time that the real death rate is pry .2% to .5%.  For comparison, the H1N1 flu season of 2009 the death rate was about .02%.  The problem is 90,000 plus people have died from this within a two and a half month time period because of how contagious this thing is.  That's with social distancing and lockdown measures.  If half the US population gets this virus you're looking at around 230,000 deaths using that .2% number. 

 

You can debate about whether the measures were too extreme or not extreme enough but I wish people would stop comparing it to the damn flu.  

And...it puts more people in the hospital for a longer time. But besides that, it’s the flu. 

Edited May 18, 2020 by shoshin

[shoshin]

I hear you're reopening in WNY starting Friday.

 

That's great!

 

(Jealous...heading into week 9 here but I'll be at the Jersey Shore this weekend so things will be looking up.)

Edited May 18, 2020 by shoshin

[Cinga]

Good article asking if we took this entire thing too far.

 

https://townhall.com/columnists/kevinmccullough/2020/05/17/why-the-lockdown-lost-n2568954?utm_content=buffer865bc&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer&fbclid=IwAR2Xup5eqd1KMtGEl_aXfi6xB_6hpL0pmbYB8UxAqwGrMQOpAGyhLy9aNEI

 

Quote

 

Lab coats in ivory towers—who never treated a single patient – went to Congress and lectured senators. While at least one of them—who is an actual physician, who not only contracted COVID-19 but once recovered—volunteered at his local hospital.

Speaking of doctors and gaslighting... Who thought it was a genius move to start ignoring thousands of physicians treating COVID-19 patients? Who thought it was better to take the opinion of a lab coat who flip-flopped on the treatments he admitted he would use if he were practicing?

 

 

[spartacus]

1 hour ago, shoshin said:

More non-scientific takes that sound science-y. Masks prevent droplet transmission. You may have heard this before. 
 

And at this point you can do better than a rough cloth mask too. 

And...it puts more people in the hospital for a longer time. But besides that, it’s the flu. 

 

the "science" and physics are that COVID -19 particles average .06 to .14 microns in size.

the N-95 mask filters to .3 microns

the basic laws of physics dictate that a filter with .3 micron stopping power will not, and can not, stop particles half that size.

 

it does not matter how masks are the nationwide narrative,  the laws of physics do not cease to exist just for this "pandemic"

 Masks can not stop the transmission of COVID-19 particles

 

especially cloth masks which have far less stopping power than N-95 marks, are ill fitting and touched all the time 

Worse is that due to the ill fitting nature of most masks, the particles go around as much as through the mask.

 

consider this:

1. if masks were so fool-proof, why would you need to keep 6 ft of distance?

2. if you could control the transmission by physical means like masks, why no big push for gloves?

 

 

 

 

 

[BillStime]

15 minutes ago, spartacus said:

 

the "science" and physics are that COVID -19 particles average .06 to .14 microns in size.

the N-95 mask filters to .3 microns

the basic laws of physics dictate that a filter with .3 micron stopping power will not, and can not, stop particles half that size.

 

it does not matter how masks are the nationwide narrative,  the laws of physics do not cease to exist just for this "pandemic"

 Masks can not stop the transmission of COVID-19 particles

 

especially cloth masks which have far less stopping power than N-95 marks, are ill fitting and touched all the time 

Worse is that due to the ill fitting nature of most masks, the particles go around as much as through the mask.

 

consider this:

1. if masks were so fool-proof, why would you need to keep 6 ft of distance?

2. if you could control the transmission by physical means like masks, why no big push for gloves?

 

 

 

 

 

I was really going back n forth on what to do? My state has a law that says I must wear a mask in public.

 

Any store or doctors office that is currently open will not let me in without wearing a mask.

 

A f’it - I just heard what I needed to hear - a post on FB validation my privilege - I’m not wearing a mask!

 

#MAGgots!

 

 

[Chef Jim]

30 minutes ago, BillStime said:

I was really going back n forth on what to do? My state has a law that says I must wear a mask in public.

 

Any store or doctors office that is currently open will not let me in without wearing a mask.

 

A f’it - I just heard what I needed to hear - a post on FB validation my privilege - I’m not wearing a mask!

 

#MAGgots!

 

 

And you’ll do whatever some government entity tells you to having little or no idea where they are getting their information from.  And what was this process that your state used to create this new “law”?  
 

World’s biggest game of Simon Says.