Josh Allen "Prove it" Season In Year 3

[GunnerBill]

3 minutes ago, whorlnut said:

Well, the Titans disagree with you. So there’s that...

 

Miami disagreed with me as well. Until they didn't. 

 

I actually think the Titans contract with him was pretty smart and have said that given where they were. If he repeats last year they are a championship contender and if he doesn't well they can draft a QB next year use Tannehill as a bridge and then get out after 2021 without too much pain. 

 

I just don't think he will repeat last year.

 

EDIT: for what it is worth I think Josh is on a similar level to Tannehill now. He only becomes Tannehill if he improves no further which I think is possible but not likely. 

Edited April 3, 2020 by GunnerBill

[BigBillsFan]

  

7 minutes ago, whorlnut said:

IMO it’s lazy analysis to say Allen is overall inaccurate.

 

It's not lazy when its an historical problem. The numbers are what they are. If you watch him play he clearly can be accurate and in rhythm, but there are times he clearly isn't accurate. One thing is for certain and that is he very rarely hits anyone in stride, usually they are in zones.

 

The one game where he proved he could hit people in stride consistently was the Dallas game. He had some unbelievable throws that made me say "Ok he can be elite."

 

The truth is he needs to prove his accuracy. The 2nd half of the season are clear signs of inconsistency. He can do it. Maybe he's just young and growing. I hope so because as a player he's the most likeable QB I've ever seen in the league.

 

17 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

EDIT: for what it is worth I think Josh is on a similar level to Tannehill now. He only becomes Tannehill if he improves no further which I think is possible but not likely. 

 

Now? Not even close. There is nothing that even remotely indicates that, only subjective conjecture. If the argument is W/L I refer you to Sanchez, Mark; Tebow, Tim;  King, Shaun; Grossman, Rex or Trubisky, Mitch. Tannehill is at least in a top 10 argument right now, and I can't imagine how that's true for Allen. Allen is a developmental QB who is improving and the team is winning despite the offensive output. Tannehill was the biggest change to their turn-around.

[C.Biscuit97]

36 minutes ago, whorlnut said:

That’s fine. Whatever I guess. But you would have to admit that Allen was playing with subpar talent at Wyoming and was expected to somehow come away with dominant stats. Listen...you are skeptical. I get that. I’m more open minded to seeing the big picture. You’re just gonna have to respect that as well. 

But he was also playing against subpar talent.  Also his college rb is on the Falcons.  And I would expect the number 7 overall pick to dominate the MWC.  Put it this way, how many top 10 pick qbs who became good nfl qbs weren’t dominate college players. 
 

again, I hate being skeptical.  I used to be the ultimate homer but I got burned too many times.  Allen does seem real good things.  He also does some really dumb things too. But on paper, he has a lot of talent around him.  Let’s see him prove it.

5 minutes ago, BigBillsFan said:

  

 

It's not lazy when its an historical problem. The numbers are what they are. If you watch him play he clearly can be accurate and in rhythm, but there are times he clearly isn't accurate. One thing is for certain and that is he very rarely hits anyone in stride, usually they are in zones.

 

The one game where he proved he could hit people in stride consistently was the Dallas game. He had some unbelievable throws that made me say "Ok he can be elite."

 

The truth is he needs to prove his accuracy. The 2nd half of the season are clear signs of inconsistency. He can do it. Maybe he's just young and growing. I hope so because as a player he's the most likeable QB I've ever seen in the league.

 

 

Now? Not even close. There is nothing that even remotely indicates that, only subjective conjecture. If the argument is W/L I refer you to Sanchez, Mark; Tebow, Tim;  King, Shaun; Grossman, Rex or Trubisky, Mitch. Tannehill is at least in a top 10 argument right now, and I can't imagine how that's true for Allen. Allen is a developmental QB who is improving and the team is winning despite the offensive output. Tannehill was the biggest change to their turn-around.

Eh, Tannehill isn’t that good.  He was back to being Ryan Tannehill.  Henry carries that team on his back. Tannehill was along for the ride.  I mean he’s not bad.  But very rarely is he the reason you won. I would hate if my team settled on Tannehill.  He is the definition  of meh. 

42 minutes ago, whorlnut said:

Boom. Well said and spot on. Allen played with future salesmen at Wyoming. Last year was literally his first year of his life with good talent around him. And guess what?  He improved. Hmmmm...

Well, the Titans disagree with you. So there’s that...

Again, his college rb is on the Falcons and his head coach was Carson Wentz college coach.  How many college coaches have had top 10 pick qbs in 3 years?

 

and are you saying the Titans are a smart team?  

[GunnerBill]

21 minutes ago, BigBillsFan said:

 

 

Now? Not even close. There is nothing that even remotely indicates that, only subjective conjecture. If the argument is W/L I refer you to Sanchez, Mark; Tebow, Tim;  King, Shaun; Grossman, Rex or Trubisky, Mitch. Tannehill is at least in a top 10 argument right now, and I can't imagine how that's true for Allen. Allen is a developmental QB who is improving and the team is winning despite the offensive output. Tannehill was the biggest change to their turn-around.

 

He played at a top 10 level last year. Sure. I am a fan of the method that once a guy is in his 5th year or beyond you should throw out his best year. And throw out his worst year. What you are left with is who he is. And Tannehill is a below average starting Quarterback. 

[BigBillsFan]

16 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

He played at a top 10 level last year. Sure. I am a fan of the method that once a guy is in his 5th year or beyond you should throw out his best year. And throw out his worst year. What you are left with is who he is. And Tannehill is a below average starting Quarterback. 

 

I don't want to argue, I want you just to explain why he's a top 10 QB in the league. I just want to see what I'm missing in my analysis of him. Thank you.

[GunnerBill]

2 minutes ago, BigBillsFan said:

 

I don't want to argue, I want you just to explain why he's a top 10 QB in the league. I just want to see what I'm missing in my analysis of him. Thank you.

 

Why who is a top 10 QB in the league? I don't believe either of them are. You said Tannehill has an argument for top 10. I say unless you only look at 2019 he doesn't have even a squeak of an argument and it is much more likely he reverts to the mean than maintains his 2019 performance. Tannehill is a below average starting Quarterback. 

[BigBillsFan]

31 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Why who is a top 10 QB in the league? I don't believe either of them are. You said Tannehill has an argument for top 10. I say unless you only look at 2019 he doesn't have even a squeak of an argument and it is much more likely he reverts to the mean than maintains his 2019 performance. Tannehill is a below average starting Quarterback. 

 

Misunderstood you and yes I agree.

[Shaw66]

1 hour ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Tannehill is not the answer. If Allen only becomes Tannehill we are in trouble. 

I don't think Tannehill has maxed out yet.   Not nearly.   I see a guy with a lot of talent and brains, a guy who played in a horribly dysfunctional franchise and now has been set free.   I wasn't at all surprised that he took the job from Mariota.   

 

But yes, I agree, the 2019 version Tannehill isn't enough, and if Allen gets only to that level, he's not the guy you want.   You may live with him, because like Flacco, he's good enough to win it all when things fall just right.   What you want is a guy who makes you threat to win a lot, and Tannehill isn't that yet.   

[GunnerBill]

3 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

I don't think Tannehill has maxed out yet.   Not nearly.   I see a guy with a lot of talent and brains, a guy who played in a horribly dysfunctional franchise and now has been set free.   I wasn't at all surprised that he took the job from Mariota.   

 

But yes, I agree, the 2019 version Tannehill isn't enough, and if Allen gets only to that level, he's not the guy you want.   You may live with him, because like Flacco, he's good enough to win it all when things fall just right.   What you want is a guy who makes you threat to win a lot, and Tannehill isn't that yet.   

 

I disagree with more about Tannehill than I have ever disagreed with you about Allen. Talent and brains? I see neither. 

[Shaw66]

2 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Miami disagreed with me as well. Until they didn't. 

 

I actually think the Titans contract with him was pretty smart and have said that given where they were. If he repeats last year they are a championship contender and if he doesn't well they can draft a QB next year use Tannehill as a bridge and then get out after 2021 without too much pain. 

 

I just don't think he will repeat last year.

 

EDIT: for what it is worth I think Josh is on a similar level to Tannehill now. He only becomes Tannehill if he improves no further which I think is possible but not likely. 

This is a very objective take on who they are.  I agree.   You have less confidence than I that Tannehill will improve, but that's just anyone's guess.  

 

I've been sure for a year or more that Allen is going far beyond the current Tannehill.   I'm less sure Tannehill will.  

[Shaw66]

3 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

 Talent and brains? I see neither. 

That's interesting.   I think Tannehill is an okay-sized athlete with excellent athletic skills.   Quickness, speed, decent size, good arm.   Yeah, maybe he can't take the beating that the 6'5" 240 pounders, but he's more than tough enough to play.  Kind of how I remember Trent Green or Bob Griese.   

 

Brains is just a hunch I have based on watching his on-field decision making.   He seems to get the game.   

 

But I'll readily plead guilty to not knowing enough about him; I'm just talking about my impressions of the guy.  

[John from Riverside]

2 hours ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

They just traded a 26 year old player with this production.  His former coaches were the ones saying this.  I think it is incredibly naive to think he wasn’t a problem for the Vikings.

 

that said, it’s not like he has issues off the field and is Antonio Brown, who the Bills almost acquired.  But it’s clear with the AB and Diggs moves, the Bills are taking calculated risks on talented players with some attitude issues.  Hopefully, it works out.

"Come to Buffalo to become the best version of yourself"

[Billl]

56 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I disagree with more about Tannehill than I have ever disagreed with you about Allen. Talent and brains? I see neither. 

Tannehill is one of the most underrated QBs ever.  That isn’t to say he’s great, but most people seem to think he sucks.  He’s never sucked.  If you put him in a good position, he can do some things.  He’s diet Alex Smith.

[GunnerBill]

1 minute ago, Billl said:

Tannehill is one of the most underrated QBs ever.  That isn’t to say he’s great, but most people seem to think he sucks.  He’s never sucked.  If you put him in a good position, he can do some things.  He’s diet Alex Smith.

 

Nah. I ain't buying it. 

 

I actually think he is the worst kind of awful. Because he will keep tempting you that there is something there that just isn't. 

Edited April 3, 2020 by GunnerBill

[Gugny]

31 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Nah. I ain't buying it. 

 

I actually think he is the worst kind of awful. Because he will keep tempting you that there is something there that just isn't. 

 

For years I said that I wished Miami never figured out that Matt Moore was the best QB on their roster.  They never did.

[GunnerBill]

3 minutes ago, Gugny said:

 

For years I said that I wished Miami never figured out that Matt Moore was the best QB on their roster.  They never did.

 

Agreed. 

[C.Biscuit97]

39 minutes ago, Billl said:

Tannehill is one of the most underrated QBs ever.  That isn’t to say he’s great, but most people seem to think he sucks.  He’s never sucked.  If you put him in a good position, he can do some things.  He’s diet Alex Smith.

There is not a qb that the bills played that I feared less than Tannehill.  He’s serviceable but he isn’t elevating you.  And his wife is super overrated (not ugly by any means but very, very overrated).

[Warcodered]

 

[Billl]

1 hour ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

There is not a qb that the bills played that I feared less than Tannehill.  He’s serviceable but he isn’t elevating you.  And his wife is super overrated (not ugly by any means but very, very overrated).

Nobody feared Alex Smith, either.  He won a ton of games when he finally had some talent around him, though.  Miami is a trash organization where a game manager QB isn’t enough because the roster and coaching are always inferior.  Tennessee has a pretty good roster and pretty good coaching, so he turned them into a pretty good team.

 

Wife is def overrated.

[Phil The Thrill]

On 3/23/2020 at 1:31 PM, longtimebillsfan said:

I am a Josh Allen fan.  I believe that he has the physical gifts to be a generational quarterback.  I also am aware of his weaknesses.

 

Now that Josh has one of the best trio starting wide receivers in the league, what does he have to do to show that he is the Bills franchise quarterback?

This is part of the reason why I liked the Diggs trade.  The Bills weren’t going to be on Jerry Juedy or CeeeeDeeee Lamb.  Even if they did,

rookie WR’s sometimes take time to develop.  
 

No excuses with Diggs