BarleyNY Posted March 23, 2020 Posted March 23, 2020 10 hours ago, BuffaloBills1998 said: But he’s only had 1 good season, that quite a lot of picks to give up on a kid with only 1 good year on his belt Sure, but he only started 2 seasons. This is what he became in his second season as a starter.
SoTier Posted March 23, 2020 Posted March 23, 2020 11 hours ago, BuffaloBills1998 said: Didn’t know Chad Pennington even had a ceiling lol. Another QB draft bust from the Jets lol Actually Pennington was not a bust. He was an excellent QB until an arm/shoulder injury short circuited his career. I think he led the Jets to the playoffs in 2002, 2004, and 2006 and then led the Fins to the playoffs in 2008 after they went 1-15 the season before. 1
AlCowlingsTaxiService Posted March 23, 2020 Posted March 23, 2020 4 hours ago, Thurman#1 said: If Pennington hadn't been injured, we'd have been speaking of him in hushed tones. The guy was terrific. Look up his 2002 season and compare it to other QBs that year. Tore his rotator cuff twice, though, and was never again able to throw the ball with enough zip to be more than fairly effective. From a "What if Pennington had never gotten hurt" article: "The numbers partially describe how great Pennington was before he got hurt. Before that fateful game in Buffalo, he had completed 65.7% of passes in his career. He had 49 touchdowns against 22 interceptions. He had a 94.7 rating. And his team had won 19 of his 30 starts. He was averaging 7.3 yards per attempt in a span where that put you in the top five in the league. When Pennington got hurt in 2004, he was completing 68.2% of his passes with 8 touchdowns, 2 interceptions, and a 99.1 rating. The Jets were 6-1 at the time. The numbers do not tell the whole story, however. It wasn't just about them. "Everybody remembers how the Patriots won three of four Super Bowls from 2001 to 2004. Not many remember what happened the one year in that stretch when they did not go all the way. The Jets came to Foxborough Week 16. The Pats, Jets, and Dolphins were in a tight race for the AFC East title. A Patriots win would have eliminated the Jets and left New England in control of its own destiny. A Jets win kept Gang Green alive and put New England in deep trouble. "Pennington lit up Bill Belichick's defense that night to the tune of 22 for 33 for 286 yards, 3 touchdowns, and no interceptions. Tom Brady was 19 for 37 with 133 yards, 1 touchdown, and 1 interception. In the middle of the Patriots dynasty, Pennington went up to Foxborough in a huge spot, outplayed Brady, and carried the Jets to a win. The next week, Pennington threw 4 touchdown passes as the Jets routed a Brett Favre led Packers team playing for the top seed in the NFC 42-17. This won the AFC East for the Jets. In the first round of the Playoffs, Pennington hit 19 of 25 for 222 yards and 3 more touchdowns as the Jets blew out Peyton Manning's Colts 41-0 before the dream season ended the next week in Oakland. "When Pennington returned from his first injury in 2004, he took the Jets on the road in the first round and hit 22 of 33 for 279 yards and 2 touchdowns as the Jets registered an overtime upset win against the Chargers. A week later against the Steelers, Pennington and the Jets took over the ball on their own 24 with the game tied 17-17 and 6:00 to go. The crowd in Pittsburgh was going nuts. Facing the number one defense in the NFL and a 15-1 team, Pennington hit passes for 22 and 17 yards to get the Jets into field goal range. Doug Brien missed the kick and then another as the Jets lost in overtime. "Far from being the limited guy with a ceiling, Pennington was a top statistical quarterback building a clutch big game resume. He looked like a guy headed for greatness." https://www.ganggreennation.com/2013/3/27/4154264/new-york-jets-what-if-wednesday-what-if-chad-pennington-hadnt-gotten Feel free to disagree, it's a fan article, but there really is very good reason to believe Pennington would have been exceptional if not injured. I've always felt this way, but until this article, I hadn't remembered that even after the second operation he was second in league MVP voting in 2008 in Miami. I knew that was a good year but I didn't remember it was that good. He was going to be a player if the rotator cuff hadn't gone. Thanx for the detailed analysis .... as I said to the OP, there is no way Pennington can be described as a bust. 1
BigBillsFan Posted March 23, 2020 Posted March 23, 2020 11 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said: By far, the greatest season a college QB has ever had. It wasn’t just a “good” season. I would do the deal if I were Miami. If I’m the Bengals, I decline though. You don’t get a shot at Burrow in most drafts. He has “it.” Stop bringing up facts. This is the best kid in the draft since Luck. Since the Bills gave up what would be 2 1sts for Josh I would give 3 for Burrows. Burrows on Miami makes them a legit team. By year 2 he'll be a top 12 player.
MrSarcasm Posted March 23, 2020 Posted March 23, 2020 12 hours ago, MJS said: They'd better hope he isn't the 2nd coming of Marino. Marino couldn't win a Superbowl. Same with Kelly and I'd take the second coming of either. 2
FireChans Posted March 23, 2020 Posted March 23, 2020 33 minutes ago, BigBillsFan said: Stop bringing up facts. This is the best kid in the draft since Luck. Since the Bills gave up what would be 2 1sts for Josh I would give 3 for Burrows. Burrows on Miami makes them a legit team. By year 2 he'll be a top 12 player. Best prospect since Luck is just absolutely not true. And I love Burrow. What an absolute idiotic season by the Dolphins though. They could have just lost more games and had the #1 pick, and kept their talented players, or traded them for picks as well. 1
foreboding Posted March 23, 2020 Posted March 23, 2020 13 hours ago, GETTOTHE50 said: Pennington has very respectable play. Very accurate and threw a nice ball with anticipation. He had one of the weaker arms in the nfl, but the injuries did him in more than anything. For sure. Poor ole glass chad could play when healthy. 11 hours ago, Billl said: I’m a fan of his, but he’s also going to turn 24 next season. The last 2 MVPs were younger when they won the award than Burrow is today. What would Lamar Jackson or Pat Mahomes have looked like playing QB for LSU this season? I’m guessing pretty good. He’s a great prospect, but he’s not a slam dunk. This is an interesting take, never thought about it like this.
BuffaloBills1998 Posted March 23, 2020 Author Posted March 23, 2020 12 hours ago, MJS said: They'd better hope he isn't the 2nd coming of Marino. Marino couldn't win a Superbowl. Well to be fair neither could Kelly, and he had a much talented team around him than Marino had in Miami
jimmy10 Posted March 23, 2020 Posted March 23, 2020 Any meat to this yet, or is it still just some dude’s mock draft + an item on BleacherReport (the Wikipedia of sports news)?
Mango Posted March 23, 2020 Posted March 23, 2020 9 hours ago, GETTOTHE50 said: i couldn’t tell the difference tbh ? I mean before he busted his shoulder and had surgery that didn't take he had a 2:1 TD/INT ratio and 8.2 A/Y per attempt. He had one good year in Miami years later but immediately dropped to about 6-7 A/Y after the failed surgery. Pennington was a smart and accurate QB, who's major flaw was arm strength, an issue that did not exist until he blew his shoulder out early in his career. 2
BigBillsFan Posted March 23, 2020 Posted March 23, 2020 29 minutes ago, FireChans said: Best prospect since Luck is just absolutely not true. And I love Burrow. What an absolute idiotic season by the Dolphins though. They could have just lost more games and had the #1 pick, and kept their talented players, or traded them for picks as well. Who would you rate above Burrow absolutely? I can't think of one person this caliber since Luck. I agree with you on tanking they should have kept "The Chosen" to see if they had anything with him or flunked the season and got the pick they wanted. It was a win-win.
Doc Posted March 23, 2020 Posted March 23, 2020 9 hours ago, Estro said: 3 Things about this rumor: 1. The Bengals aren't trading the pick. 2. Why the hell did the Dolphins choose to play Fitz and actually win games??? If they had played Rosen the #1 pick was likely theirs. How dumb to tank and not even do it correctly. 3. Joe Burrow is the real deal & I want him no where near the AFC East, so I'm thankful for pts. 1 & 2 above 2. What's worse is they started-off the season with Fitz as the starter and then inserted Rosen midway through the 2nd game of the season against the Cheaters and then went back to Fitz. Screwed them out of not only getting the first overall but seeing if Rosen had any chance of developing, as Fitz is nothing but a journeyman. 9 hours ago, TallskiWallski83 said: if im cincy theres nothing you could offer me to trade the pick. Burrows had the best season of any college QB in history. You take your swing on a guy like that and if he misses (which anyone with a football IQ highly highly doubts)..so be it. Yep. You take him and no one can criticize you if he busts.
Ridgewaycynic2013 Posted March 23, 2020 Posted March 23, 2020 6 hours ago, Thurman#1 said: “When Pennington returned from his first injury in 2004, he took the Jets on the road in the first round and hit 22 of 33 for 279 yards and 2 touchdowns as the Jets registered an overtime upset win against the Chargers. Another under 300 yards passing game failure. ? *?
BuffaloBills1998 Posted March 23, 2020 Author Posted March 23, 2020 13 hours ago, MJS said: They'd better hope he isn't the 2nd coming of Marino. Marino couldn't win a Superbowl. Also it’s not Marino’s fault he didn’t get a Super Bowl, that blame should be shifted toward more to Shula and Johnson’s department lol. Shula was too loyal to his assistants like Olivadotti and never gave Marino a 1,000 yard rusher to help take some of the pressure off of him. Same thing with Johnson who clearly sabotaged Marino’s final years with Miami by giving him no running game and cutting/trading his weapons away like Irving Fryer and replacing him with below average talent like Chris chambers and Orande Gadsden. I guarantee you put Marino with the Levy Bills teams and we at least have 4-5 Lombardi trophies
MrEpsYtown Posted March 23, 2020 Posted March 23, 2020 On the Pennington discussion, he was drafted 18th overall. Burrow is going 1 and you are passing on a generational talent like Chase Young to take him. So I think its different. To me this is like taking Sam Bradford over Suh and McCoy. Remember that Bradford threw 50 TD passes for that loaded Sooners team as a Sophomore. I think Burrow will be good, I just don’t know that he is that much of an upgrade over Dalton that I would pass on Young, or 3 first rounders. But I think it comes down to how much you like Burrow.
DCOrange Posted March 23, 2020 Posted March 23, 2020 40 minutes ago, BigBillsFan said: Who would you rate above Burrow absolutely? I can't think of one person this caliber since Luck. I agree with you on tanking they should have kept "The Chosen" to see if they had anything with him or flunked the season and got the pick they wanted. It was a win-win. Just over the past 4 years, Mahomes is the only QB I had rated higher than Burrow. I have the same grade on Burrow as I did Lamar Jackson. I think a pretty good case could be made for Jameis and Mariota as well but I wasn't grading QBs back then.
GunnerBill Posted March 23, 2020 Posted March 23, 2020 1 hour ago, MrEpsYtown said: On the Pennington discussion, he was drafted 18th overall. Burrow is going 1 and you are passing on a generational talent like Chase Young to take him. So I think its different. To me this is like taking Sam Bradford over Suh and McCoy. Remember that Bradford threw 50 TD passes for that loaded Sooners team as a Sophomore. I think Burrow will be good, I just don’t know that he is that much of an upgrade over Dalton that I would pass on Young, or 3 first rounders. But I think it comes down to how much you like Burrow. Yea I think Burrow can come in and be a slight upgrade on Andy Dalton basically day 1. That is a pretty high floor. The question is where is the ceiling. Is it Carson Palmer? Or is it Aaron Rodgers? Or is it somewhere between. I have him below 3 guys since I have been grading - Watson, Darnold and Rosen. 1
Saxum Posted March 23, 2020 Posted March 23, 2020 15 hours ago, BuffaloBills1998 said: That’s ridiculous, I wouldn’t give 3 first round picks for burrows unless I knew for certain that he was the second coming. To give up that much they better hope and be certain that Burrows is the second coming of Marino lol. I think Burrows will be good but idk if he’s gonna be that good. I hope he is 2nd coming of Marino. Bills always got the best of him and his fakes were terrible resulting in RBs getting worn down.
Saxum Posted March 23, 2020 Posted March 23, 2020 14 hours ago, BeastMaster said: Cincy will never do it because the owner is too cheap to pay 3 first round picks That does not mean Bungles would not take picks and use them to trade for players / more picks / future picks making a perfect storm for next year when they get 1st round pick again!
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