TroutDog Posted April 7, 2020 Posted April 7, 2020 1 hour ago, billsfan_34 said: Thats why its a prove it deal- he may be had in the 7-10 mil range. I think it will be tough seeing we need an upgrade at the 2 QB spot. There is plenty of options out there plus we have to leave room for draft picks and retaining our own. That was my point: he WANTS a large deal but will not get it and the Bills aren’t, in all probability, going to sign him. If we wanted a young run stopper in the $7-10m range, we would have kept Shaq. We have plenty of cap available for our draft picks so I’m not sure what you meant there.
BuffaloBills1998 Posted April 7, 2020 Posted April 7, 2020 6 hours ago, TroutDog said: That was my point: he WANTS a large deal but will not get it and the Bills aren’t, in all probability, going to sign him. If we wanted a young run stopper in the $7-10m range, we would have kept Shaq. We have plenty of cap available for our draft picks so I’m not sure what you meant there. In some ways I wish we would’ve kept Shaq, but I feel we got better players than him in Free agency. I think Shaq might take a step back or two in Miami cause their running a 3-4, Lawson struggled mightily in the 3-4 1
MJS Posted April 7, 2020 Posted April 7, 2020 9 hours ago, billsfan_34 said: Thats why its a prove it deal- he may be had in the 7-10 mil range. I think it will be tough seeing we need an upgrade at the 2 QB spot. There is plenty of options out there plus we have to leave room for draft picks and retaining our own. You're thinking Clowney will sign for 7 to 10 million? That's less than Shaq got, and hest much better than Shaq. He's not as good as he thinks, but he's better than that. I predict he'll sign a 2 year 14 million per year deal somewhere.
Aussie Joe Posted April 7, 2020 Posted April 7, 2020 Hope he signs elsewhere soon because he isn’t coming to Buffalo...
billsfan_34 Posted April 7, 2020 Posted April 7, 2020 4 hours ago, MJS said: You're thinking Clowney will sign for 7 to 10 million? That's less than Shaq got, and hest much better than Shaq. He's not as good as he thinks, but he's better than that. I predict he'll sign a 2 year 14 million per year deal somewhere. Yes, I do think that. There isn’t many teams with a ton of cap space left for a short term prove it deal. It will be interesting to see what he gets and re- hash this conversation ? 12 hours ago, TroutDog said: That was my point: he WANTS a large deal but will not get it and the Bills aren’t, in all probability, going to sign him. If we wanted a young run stopper in the $7-10m range, we would have kept Shaq. We have plenty of cap available for our draft picks so I’m not sure what you meant there. Yes, plenty for our picks- and hopefully some of the remainder to get a true number 2 QB. 1
thebandit27 Posted April 7, 2020 Posted April 7, 2020 15 hours ago, LABILLBACKER said: I think you meant to say brains infected with covid value Murphy. Maybe we can pull Kelsay out of retirement while we're at it..... Kelsay had 32.5 sacks in 10 seasons; Murphy has 24.0 in 5 seasons.
Lurker Posted April 7, 2020 Posted April 7, 2020 2 minutes ago, thebandit27 said: Kelsay had 32.5 sacks in 10 seasons; Murphy has 24.0 in 5 seasons. Apples to pears. There are more pass rush opportunities for DEs today than when Kelsay played...
gordong Posted April 7, 2020 Posted April 7, 2020 7 minutes ago, thebandit27 said: Kelsay had 32.5 sacks in 10 seasons; Murphy has 24.0 in 5 seasons. Kelsey was also a much better all around DE than Murphy....
thebandit27 Posted April 7, 2020 Posted April 7, 2020 8 minutes ago, Lurker said: Apples to pears. There are more pass rush opportunities for DEs today than when Kelsay played... 5 minutes ago, gordong said: Kelsey was also a much better all around DE than Murphy.... I don’t agree with either of these statements
MJS Posted April 7, 2020 Posted April 7, 2020 16 minutes ago, Lurker said: Apples to pears. There are more pass rush opportunities for DEs today than when Kelsay played... Based on what? QB's get the ball out quicker and don't drop back as far today. They also play more from shotgun. Those things make it harder for pass rushers. 1
4merper4mer Posted April 7, 2020 Posted April 7, 2020 11 minutes ago, thebandit27 said: I don’t agree with either of these statements What? You don't agree that the answer to everything, including the Covid virus, is simply cutting Murphy? 1
Beast Posted April 7, 2020 Posted April 7, 2020 29 minutes ago, thebandit27 said: I don’t agree with either of these statements Neither do I. At all. 22 minutes ago, MJS said: Based on what? QB's get the ball out quicker and don't drop back as far today. They also play more from shotgun. Those things make it harder for pass rushers. Right. And I'd be willing to bet good money that Kelsay saw a greater percentage of snaps than Murphy.
thenorthremembers Posted April 7, 2020 Posted April 7, 2020 23 hours ago, NewEra said: If the browns sign Clowney, sure. Not sure why we wouldn’t just sign Clowney ourselves, instead of signing the guy that the browns wanted to replace with Clowney. I never understood the Vernon love tbh, but he’d be a nice rotational guy. I think Jerry and Addison are better pass rushers, but I’m all for spending any additional money on pass rush or OL upgrades I think Vernon is just on the backside of his career and he is declining the closer he gets to 30. I'd prefer to sign him at this point because I think Clowney is grossly overrated at the level of pay he looking for. You have to make sure the money you put into a player matches the output you get from him. In that sense Addison really is the best value out of the four players being discussed here.
Reader Posted April 7, 2020 Posted April 7, 2020 1 hour ago, thebandit27 said: I don’t agree with either of these statements I'd say Kelsay was the better run defender. He was good for a solo run stop at the line of scrimmage about once a game or every other game. His pass-rush running around everyone is what gave most posters here fits.
Virgil Posted April 7, 2020 Posted April 7, 2020 The more time passes, the more signing him makes sense to me. If he really will take a 15 mil deal plus incentives, I see it as a win win for us with our current window. We have the money and if he can’t put the numbers up in this defense and in this division, he has no one to blame but himself. I see it as mutually beneficial 8
NewEra Posted April 7, 2020 Posted April 7, 2020 32 minutes ago, thenorthremembers said: I think Vernon is just on the backside of his career and he is declining the closer he gets to 30. I'd prefer to sign him at this point because I think Clowney is grossly overrated at the level of pay he looking for. You have to make sure the money you put into a player matches the output you get from him. In that sense Addison really is the best value out of the four players being discussed here. For one season, you ABSOLUTELY DO NOT have to make sure that the players output matches his pay. It’s one season. There are no long term ramifications. It’ll all be over next year. Ask KC how they feel about paying sammy watkins. They paid him a multi year deal and didn’t get the output to match his pay.....until it did and they won a SB
thenorthremembers Posted April 7, 2020 Posted April 7, 2020 25 minutes ago, NewEra said: For one season, you ABSOLUTELY DO NOT have to make sure that the players output matches his pay. It’s one season. There are no long term ramifications. It’ll all be over next year. Ask KC how they feel about paying sammy watkins. They paid him a multi year deal and didn’t get the output to match his pay.....until it did and they won a SB If you have enough cap space you dont. But paying someone a one year deal definitely impacts your team the year after. If the Bills pay someone 17 million for one year and get jack in output then they dont recoup the money, they lose what would be roll over cap for the next season. On the Watkins point you're surmising Watkins' output in the playoffs and superbowl was a prime factor in them being champions? I'd argue, even with his big AFC Championship performance, Kelce, Hill and Damien Williams were bigger factors in the Chiefs being champions. If paying Clowney gets the Bills over the top for a championship I am all for it. But I look at his history and he hasn't been able to do that for any other team he has played for and those teams had better quarterbacks to start with.
njbuff Posted April 7, 2020 Posted April 7, 2020 1 hour ago, Virgil said: The more time passes, the more signing him makes sense to me. If he really will take a 15 mil deal plus incentives, I see it as a win win for us with our current window. We have the money and if he can’t put the numbers up in this defense and in this division, he has no one to blame but himself. I see it as mutually beneficial There are several teams that fall into this category. My question for the Bills is................ Does signing Clowney and cutting Murphy outweigh the option of just keeping Murphy and go with what you got? Interesting indeed.
NewEra Posted April 7, 2020 Posted April 7, 2020 5 minutes ago, thenorthremembers said: If you have enough cap space you dont. But paying someone a one year deal definitely impacts your team the year after. If the Bills pay someone 17 million for one year and get jack in output then they dont recoup the money, they lose what would be roll over cap for the next season. On the Watkins point you're surmising Watkins' output in the playoffs and superbowl was a prime factor in them being champions? I'd argue, even with his big AFC Championship performance, Kelce, Hill and Damien Williams were bigger factors in the Chiefs being champions. If paying Clowney gets the Bills over the top for a championship I am all for it. But I look at his history and he hasn't been able to do that for any other team he has played for and those teams had better quarterbacks to start with. They won the super bowl. He played very well in the playoffs. They won the super bowl. Everyone has their opinion on the matter, the the fact is, the chiefs didn’t overpay for sammy. They paid him for one reason. To help them win a super bowl. He did just that. It doesn’t matter that Kelce, hill and williams were bigger factors in winning a super bowl. If the bills win the super bowl, there’s a good chance that some of our current defensive players would have a bigger impact than Clowney. As long as he plays his 1/11 like McD asks. 1
stinky finger Posted April 7, 2020 Posted April 7, 2020 7 hours ago, thebandit27 said: Kelsay had 32.5 sacks in 10 seasons; Murphy has 24.0 in 5 seasons. Murphy doesn't own a lunch pail, so.....
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