John from Riverside Posted March 14, 2020 Posted March 14, 2020 2 minutes ago, aristocrat said: well if we slide ford to guard. first round right tackle. sign a nice depth guard. is there a trade available to move jon for another position of need? seriously could jon get diggs? or get close to diggs? I like Diggs as well....a draft pick would get him. I would rather keep our OL AND get Diggs. If a draft pick turned into Diggs and we drafted another WR out of this draft I feel like we would be so much further along.
T master Posted March 14, 2020 Posted March 14, 2020 I think that was a really good move good player !
aristocrat Posted March 14, 2020 Posted March 14, 2020 43 minutes ago, John from Riverside said: I like Diggs as well....a draft pick would get him. I would rather keep our OL AND get Diggs. If a draft pick turned into Diggs and we drafted another WR out of this draft I feel like we would be so much further along. if it's a straight up trade or we give jon and 4th i make that deal for diggs. beane has to find a replacement for sure but it's a deal i'd think about.
LSHMEAB Posted March 14, 2020 Posted March 14, 2020 15 hours ago, DCbillsfan said: Re-signing Spain prevents a big need in FA or the draft. Feliciano and Nysekhe are FA's next year and Long could be as well. Dawkins will be extended soon imo. I can't remember what presser it was but got the distinct impression Beane is looking to upgrade the Oline. I'm thinking OT on Day 2 of draft. What about the interior? We're obsessed with the tackles and pass pro, but nobody seems to care that they got pushed around on 3rd and short ALL SEASON. I would say that a more efficient passing game, ie improvement from Allen, would probably back the opposing D off the LOS, but I don't love the combination. It's not bad. It's just missing a mauler. Dawkins is fine. RT is a question mark with Ford, so HOPEFULLY he'll improve. Ty is a solid swing tackle and outperformed Ford last season. I think RT is a legit concern, but so is the interior. And yes, Spain filled a need. But MY PREFERENCE would have been to fill that need in free agency and acquire a better straight line blocker at LG considering the other parts. In the grand scheme of things, I suppose the offense is going to ride or die with the improvements they make at the skill positions and JA's development. But as someone who is not quite sure that will all pan out as planned, it would be cool if they could run the football.
Happy Posted March 14, 2020 Posted March 14, 2020 13 minutes ago, LSHMEAB said: What about the interior? We're obsessed with the tackles and pass pro, but nobody seems to care that they got pushed around on 3rd and short ALL SEASON. I would say that a more efficient passing game, ie improvement from Allen, would probably back the opposing D off the LOS, but I don't love the combination. It's not bad. It's just missing a mauler. Dawkins is fine. RT is a question mark with Ford, so HOPEFULLY he'll improve. Ty is a solid swing tackle and outperformed Ford last season. I think RT is a legit concern, but so is the interior. And yes, Spain filled a need. But MY PREFERENCE would have been to fill that need in free agency and acquire a better straight line blocker at LG considering the other parts. In the grand scheme of things, I suppose the offense is going to ride or die with the improvements they make at the skill positions and JA's development. But as someone who is not quite sure that will all pan out as planned, it would be cool if they could run the football. As far as being pushed around, I suspect Morse has something to do with this, especially in the 'A' gap. He seemed to be kind of tentative in firing off the line; I don't know if it is because Morse is a little on the smaller side or concussion concerns. Spain and Feliciano are bigger guys and I thought were more on the mauler side...though I could be wrong on this.
LSHMEAB Posted March 14, 2020 Posted March 14, 2020 1 minute ago, Happy Gilmore said: As far as being pushed around, I suspect Morse has something to do with this, especially in the 'A' gap. He seemed to be kind of tentative in firing off the line; I don't know if it is because Morse is a little on the smaller side or concussion concerns. Spain and Feliciano are bigger guys and I thought were more on the mauler side...though I could be wrong on this. Morse is solid and he's gonna be here, so I don't think a whole lot about the C position. (Although I agree with your assessment.) It is what it is for now. You would really think Spain would be a good straight line blocker because of his size, but he's not. Feliciano is more grit than talent. These are all good football players and I'm not trying to rain on anyone's parade. Just offering an opinion about what I'd like to see from an OL. At this point, I'm hoping they go after an RG with the skillset I prefer. We'll see how the roster looks when all the dust settles.
Happy Posted March 14, 2020 Posted March 14, 2020 1 minute ago, LSHMEAB said: Morse is solid and he's gonna be here, so I don't think a whole lot about the C position. (Although I agree with your assessment.) It is what it is for now. You would really think Spain would be a good straight line blocker because of his size, but he's not. Feliciano is more grit than talent. These are all good football players and I'm not trying to rain on anyone's parade. Just offering an opinion about what I'd like to see from an OL. At this point, I'm hoping they go after an RG with the skillset I prefer. We'll see how the roster looks when all the dust settles. Feliciano is a backup center and filled in well enough during Morse's short absence, so it would be smart to hold onto him. I would guess Spain starts at LG and Morse isn't going anywhere. So we're back to the right side of the line again; either send Ford inside and hope he shines there while getting a new RT, or keep Ford at RT and get a new RG (either draft or FA). I would prefer Ford goes to RG and we bring in a new RT...we have the luxury of getting Ty Nsekhe back so that should be a big help. I agree that these guys are good football players; could the problem be Daboll's blocking scheme and/or technique he wants to use or the new o-line coach? Another thought is that last year was the first for a completely rebuilt line, so they should be improved by being back together for a second year; this is an argument for keeping things as is, including Ford at RT and Feliciano at RG. These guys are not worse than some of the Pats O-lines of the past, just that they had a great coach in Dante Scarnecchia, who made all the difference. Notice how many former Pats o-linemen didn't pan out in FA. 1
TheBeaneBandit Posted March 14, 2020 Posted March 14, 2020 23 minutes ago, Happy Gilmore said: As far as being pushed around, I suspect Morse has something to do with this, especially in the 'A' gap. He seemed to be kind of tentative in firing off the line; I don't know if it is because Morse is a little on the smaller side or concussion concerns. Spain and Feliciano are bigger guys and I thought were more on the mauler side...though I could be wrong on this. They are kinda big softies.....Spain gets in the way in pass pro but gets no push and Feliciano plays like hes got nothing to lose which I love but he's physically limited. 1
Buffalo Barbarian Posted March 14, 2020 Posted March 14, 2020 Great signing, need stability up front. 2
DCbillsfan Posted March 14, 2020 Posted March 14, 2020 8 hours ago, LSHMEAB said: What about the interior? We're obsessed with the tackles and pass pro, but nobody seems to care that they got pushed around on 3rd and short ALL SEASON. I would say that a more efficient passing game, ie improvement from Allen, would probably back the opposing D off the LOS, but I don't love the combination. It's not bad. It's just missing a mauler. Dawkins is fine. RT is a question mark with Ford, so HOPEFULLY he'll improve. Ty is a solid swing tackle and outperformed Ford last season. I think RT is a legit concern, but so is the interior. And yes, Spain filled a need. But MY PREFERENCE would have been to fill that need in free agency and acquire a better straight line blocker at LG considering the other parts. In the grand scheme of things, I suppose the offense is going to ride or die with the improvements they make at the skill positions and JA's development. But as someone who is not quite sure that will all pan out as planned, it would be cool if they could run the football. I agree with you on the interior of the line. Not sure what Beane will do there. If they get some tackle depth beyond Nysekhe, kicking Ford inside becomes a more viable option. They may also draft an interior guy in the later rounds. Plus there's free agency. I believe Beane will add another guy to OL. 1
GunnerBill Posted March 14, 2020 Posted March 14, 2020 10 hours ago, Happy Gilmore said: As far as being pushed around, I suspect Morse has something to do with this, especially in the 'A' gap. He seemed to be kind of tentative in firing off the line; I don't know if it is because Morse is a little on the smaller side or concussion concerns. Spain and Feliciano are bigger guys and I thought were more on the mauler side...though I could be wrong on this. The game Morse went out after 16 snaps (Denver) was the Bills best rushing day of the season by a huge difference (nearly 75 yards better than our next best). He definitely to my mind was a big part of the issue in terms of trying to run straight ahead on 3rd and short. Morse has lots of qualities and I am not advocating benching him or cutting him or anything like that - but he is never going to dominate in the power run game. Just isn't who he is as a player. He is a technician not a road grader.
Happy Posted March 14, 2020 Posted March 14, 2020 55 minutes ago, GunnerBill said: The game Morse went out after 16 snaps (Denver) was the Bills best rushing day of the season by a huge difference (nearly 75 yards better than our next best). He definitely to my mind was a big part of the issue in terms of trying to run straight ahead on 3rd and short. Morse has lots of qualities and I am not advocating benching him or cutting him or anything like that - but he is never going to dominate in the power run game. Just isn't who he is as a player. He is a technician not a road grader. If this is the case, the guards need to pick up what Morse is not suited to do. I don't know if Feliciano and Spain are not capable of this or if the blocking scheme does not allow for a power run game, which would be silly in short yardage situations. 1
billsfan89 Posted March 14, 2020 Posted March 14, 2020 1 hour ago, Happy Gilmore said: If this is the case, the guards need to pick up what Morse is not suited to do. I don't know if Feliciano and Spain are not capable of this or if the blocking scheme does not allow for a power run game, which would be silly in short yardage situations. This team had games where the O-line took over and closed out games. In particular the 4 minute offense against a stout Titans team ran down their throats with Gore to close out the clock.
ColoradoBills Posted March 14, 2020 Posted March 14, 2020 Bills got 10 OL signed so far. 6 decent inside guys so I see another camp body UDFA type for sure. Only 4 OTs with Dawkins and Nsekhe on their last year of contract. Ford and Salako (camp body and I don't even think he is still PS eligible this year). A lot more RT/Swing Tackle competition needs to be signed. Beane for sure has seen this and will be looking at FA and Draft to fill it. I am so looking forward to see what moves are going to be done to address this. I would not 100% lock Nsekhe in at swing. Ford will get a good long shot at proving he can be a RT irregardless of what some might think.
GunnerBill Posted March 14, 2020 Posted March 14, 2020 1 hour ago, billsfan89 said: This team had games where the O-line took over and closed out games. In particular the 4 minute offense against a stout Titans team ran down their throats with Gore to close out the clock. Also a game in which Morse had gone out injured prior to that point FWIW. 1
njbuff Posted March 14, 2020 Posted March 14, 2020 Cody Ford does have the talent to be a big time RT. There is no doubt about that. We forget that he was a rookie in 2019. This is what McBeane is banking on with the re-signing of Spain. He took his lumps, but he also flattened people in 2019. We shall see.
John from Riverside Posted March 14, 2020 Posted March 14, 2020 5 minutes ago, njbuff said: Cody Ford does have the talent to be a big time RT. There is no doubt about that. We forget that he was a rookie in 2019. This is what McBeane is banking on with the re-signing of Spain. He took his lumps, but he also flattened people in 2019. We shall see. Agreed but also I think it is agreed that Cody needs to be much better in pass protection and that is coming from someone that loved the pick
njbuff Posted March 14, 2020 Posted March 14, 2020 6 minutes ago, John from Riverside said: Agreed but also I think it is agreed that Cody needs to be much better in pass protection and that is coming from someone that loved the pick They think he will, otherwise they don't re-sign Spain.
billsfan89 Posted March 15, 2020 Posted March 15, 2020 5 hours ago, GunnerBill said: Also a game in which Morse had gone out injured prior to that point FWIW. The Titans line was also banged up and other starters were out, I wouldn't put it as a knock on Mitch.
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