billsfan89 Posted March 12, 2020 Posted March 12, 2020 3 hours ago, Phil The Thrill said: Charles Clay should be on the list. By the numbers you can argue he was as productive as he was in Miami, but did he really ever make a big difference in games? Maybe in Miami where he couldn’t catch a pass in the endzone. Seriously though, this was a poor return on bad deal made by a terrible GM that hindered this team cap-wise for years. Clay was a top 10 tight end for 2 or 3 seasons depending on what measure you go by. He was just dramatically overpaid as his TE salary was top 5 in the league for the first 3 years of his contract and then top 7 in the last year of his contract and gave the team a 4.5 million dollar dead cap hit last season. I think Clay and Star kind of fit the same mold of player who was productive enough to garner a starting position but never justified their high salary. The team hasn't had too many high profile free agent busts since 2015. Clay and Star are your worst examples but they were both starters for several years performing a role that was of value. I think Vonta Davis is probably the team's worst signing as he returned 0 value on his deal and embarrassed the team.
CSBill Posted March 12, 2020 Posted March 12, 2020 On 3/10/2020 at 7:56 PM, Dopey said: If star is the worst, we're doing damn well. Don't understand the hate. Harrison gets hurt, we bring in a rookie, jordan, peko, corey. Star is the only stable interior player we've had the last 2 years. On a top 5 defense to boot. i can agree
LSHMEAB Posted March 13, 2020 Posted March 13, 2020 11 hours ago, Seoulofstone said: I suppose it's ok to want more, but I think what McDermott and Frazier have achieved is far more impressive. For me what you're describing is the LA Rams. Dante Fowler, Clay Matthews, and of course the very special Aaron Donald. Cory Littleton, Jalen Ramsey. Great players coached by Wade Phillips. They ranked 17th. Would you swap personnel with LA? Would you swap statistics with that team in order to live out your more attacking scheme? I'm certain LA would swap the outcomes. San Francisco is the blueprint, not the Rams.
Seoulofstone Posted March 13, 2020 Posted March 13, 2020 14 hours ago, LSHMEAB said: San Francisco is the blueprint, not the Rams. That's not a blue print that's a perfect storm of high first round picks across the DLine. Where the niners win on scheme is offense. I get wanting it, but you have to be an abysmal team for several years to construct a team like that. Let's see if they can sustain over time before we give the niners too much credit.
Phil The Thrill Posted March 13, 2020 Posted March 13, 2020 On 3/12/2020 at 1:31 PM, billsfan89 said: Clay was a top 10 tight end for 2 or 3 seasons depending on what measure you go by. He was just dramatically overpaid as his TE salary was top 5 in the league for the first 3 years of his contract and then top 7 in the last year of his contract and gave the team a 4.5 million dollar dead cap hit last season. I think Clay and Star kind of fit the same mold of player who was productive enough to garner a starting position but never justified their high salary. The team hasn't had too many high profile free agent busts since 2015. Clay and Star are your worst examples but they were both starters for several years performing a role that was of value. I think Vonta Davis is probably the team's worst signing as he returned 0 value on his deal and embarrassed the team. That’s why I said, if you look at Clay’s production you can argue he put up similar numbers as he did in Miami. But when you add context, I don’t remember him having that great of impact on the team. His cap hit also really killed the team. Overall a very bad signing
LSHMEAB Posted March 14, 2020 Posted March 14, 2020 11 hours ago, Seoulofstone said: That's not a blue print that's a perfect storm of high first round picks across the DLine. Where the niners win on scheme is offense. I get wanting it, but you have to be an abysmal team for several years to construct a team like that. Let's see if they can sustain over time before we give the niners too much credit. We're talking about defensive preference. I think McDermott is an excellent defensive coach, but I'd prefer to see him take a more aggressive approach in terms of getting to the QB and creating turnovers. They weren't particularly good in either area last season, although the defense as a whole WAS very good. Probably has quite a bit to do with personnel also, which is why adding a stud edge is so important. You don't see Baker Mayfield march down the field with a clean pocket for a game winning TD or Desean Watson erasing a 16 point 3rd QTR deficit if you're applying adequate pressure on the QB. Nobody in the world would say the defense isn't very, very good, but that element would make them elite. And you're quibbling WRT SF. You mentioned the Rams only because they're a team with pass rushers who weren't particularly good last season. It was a convenient scapegoat considering SF had the most dominant defense in the league almost exclusively because of the pass rush. Get after the QB. Get a stud who can get after the QB. It's pretty simple.
Mountain Man Posted March 14, 2020 Posted March 14, 2020 I thought Marcel Louis-Jacques was a better journalist than to churn out the tired old narrative about Star.
Buffalo Barbarian Posted March 14, 2020 Posted March 14, 2020 On 3/10/2020 at 7:37 PM, ChevyVanMiller said: Agree or disagree? AFC East Buffalo Bills Best free-agent signing: S Jordan Poyer. You also could make an argument for fellow safety Micah Hyde, but the production Buffalo has gotten from Poyer far exceeds the bargain contract he signed in 2017 (four years, $12.5 million). Together with Hyde, Poyer has changed the identity of the Bills' defense. Worst free-agent signing: DT Star Lotulelei. Both general manager Brandon Beane and head coach Sean McDermott will insist Lotulelei is more valuable than he gets credit for -- and they're probably right. But they also essentially admitted their error in giving him a five-year, $50 million contract in 2018 by restructuring his deal this offseason. Lotulelei is a space-eater who makes life easier for his teammates, but that alone is probably not worth $10 million per year. -- Marcel Louis-Jacques nope. Best - Jordan Phillips Worst - i lasted half a game , Vontae Davis. On 3/10/2020 at 7:45 PM, Augie said: KB was even worse, we gave up #3 a pick, right? Biggest mistake of this regime so far I think, but it happens. I won’t harp on one single move. . Benjamin is probably worse because he was here longer but Davis quitting mid game was unconscionable.
DabillsDaBillsDaBills Posted March 14, 2020 Posted March 14, 2020 I'll agree with Poyer as best and Lotulelei as worst. Lotulelei isn't a terrible player, but we gave him a pretty large contract that he hasn't come close to earning. HM worst: Vontae Davis. It's embarrassing that he retired at half time of a game. However, the Bills had only given him a 1 year deal, and were able to re-coup almost his entire salary. Charles Clay. Copy paste the Lotulelei comment. Bit of a toss up really which one is worse. Star has 3 years to go on his contract, if he manages to finish that without being cut Clay might pass him as worst.
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