Jets Quinnen Williams Arrested in NY

[LeviF]

12 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Yes, and what the lawyer may mean by ""There was allegedly a technical issue with the manner in which the lawfully owned firearm was stored -- and we expect the matter to be resolved shortly." is that to my understanding, even in municipalities and states where reciprocity of permits does not exist, the National Firearm Owners Protection Act does allow the gun owner to transport a weapon he is legally authorized to own in his home state through another state or municipality provided it is unloaded and in a locked, hardsided container.

 

Again, that is to my understanding - I believe that was the point of the NFOPA law.  So what I think Williams lawyer may be alluding to is that Quinnen believes his suitcase met the provisions of the law, but the gate agent/port authority police do not (or are possibly uneducated about the impact of 1986 Federal law)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firearm_Owners_Protection_Act#"Safe_passage"_provision

 

Note that this source references "state", and not "municipal", but typically if federal law supercedes state law on a matter pertaining to interstate travel, municipalities aren't allowed to mix in either.  I think.  Where's one of our actual lawyers here?

 

 

 

The NFOPA provides a defense, it doesn't preempt prosecution like LEOSA. And again, I wouldn't leave it up to NYC to let the feds rule on this issue.  PA Police aren't likely to kindly wait while you explain why federal law gives you every right to bring your gun into their airport. 

 

And even in a defense, Williams is going to have an issue arguing that his firearm was not readily accessible. 

[Chaos]

49 minutes ago, whatdrought said:

So it sounds like NYC’s specific laws (the harshest in the country) are what’s the problem here.

The context being what it is, the facts do not seem to suggest Williams was trying to hurt anyone or plan to hurt anyone. It is also possible he is not an expert on the gun laws in NY.  (most likely, he has not been to social media law school). Ignorance of the law is not an excuse, but if this is the first offense for Williams, it seems to me it is the type of thing where he should simply end up with a warning of sorts. 

Edited March 7, 2020 by Hapless Bills Fan
snark and digression excised

[Hapless Bills Fan]

2 hours ago, LeviF91 said:

The NFOPA provides a defense, it doesn't preempt prosecution like LEOSA. And again, I wouldn't leave it up to NYC to let the feds rule on this issue.  PA Police aren't likely to kindly wait while you explain why federal law gives you every right to bring your gun into their airport. 

 

And even in a defense, Williams is going to have an issue arguing that his firearm was not readily accessible. 

 

As for that last, I would need specifics perhaps you have, but I don't.  Article said it was in a carry-on bag and he was arrested at the Delta Check-in Counter, so it seems plausible with the information presented to date that Quinnen felt the bag met the provisions of the law and was attempting to check it, and was actually arrested when he declared the gun and asked for the declarations form.  Some carry-on bags are hard-sided and can be locked.

 

I agree with you about police of any jurisdiction not being likely to kindly wait while you explain any legal matter to them but that's sort of a separate issue.  As a personal policy, I limit my conversation with law officers on duty who approach me to "good day officer" "yes sir**" "no sir**" and succinct answers to direct questions.

 

I wouldn't personally want to serve as a test case for the NYC/NYS laws myself, but that's also a separate issue. I'm still struggling to figure out their laws on bear spray.

 

** or ma'am as the case may be

 

[Saxum]

On 3/6/2020 at 9:46 AM, dneveu said:

 

I mean - he legally can't carry it in the state.  Let alone at the airport.  Huge lapse in judgement.

 

Fortunately for him it is really the NJ Jets and most days at work he does not need to go into NYC.

This should be something team should brief players on when they are signed with recommendation they rent/buy in NJ.

 

NYC in general is a bottleneck for anyone travelling along I-95 corridor and decide they need to carry firearms.

[Saxum]

19 hours ago, DCOrange said:

FWIW (I'm assuming my friend is misinformed), a friend of mine works at the airport and was there when this all went down. He says Quinnen had the gun in his checked baggage and one of the workers at the airport saw it was an athlete and illegally went through his bag and found the gun and then it turned into this.

 

I consider TSA a very quasi-legal organization.  I used to have items taken from my luggage regularly and used to carry broken stuff for thieves to take since they would often only take one valuable item.  I used to seal my luggage inside with plastic with a paper showing inventory/photo of contents.  After repeatedly filing for and get compensation from airlines the issue stopped.  Not sure if airline had investigation started and if baggage thief was caught/fired.

[Saxum]

1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

As for that last, I would need specifics perhaps you have, but I don't.  Article said it was in a carry-on bag and he was arrested at the Delta Check-in Counter, so it seems plausible with the information presented to date that Quinnen felt the bag met the provisions of the law and was attempting to check it, and was actually arrested when he declared the gun and asked for the declarations form.  Some carry-on bags are hard-sided and can be locked.

 

All items lockable need to have TSA approved locks and very few hard cases have locks which are approved by TSA which means you need to add secondary lock to it which sort of defeats purpose.  I arrived at my destination and when I tried to open my TSA approved lock it no longer worked. When I finally got bag opened by breaking lock found note inside saying TSA had inspected baggage (nothing taken this time) and evidently they broke lock when opening it and just put it back on with glue or something.

[LeviF]

27 minutes ago, Limeaid said:

 

Fortunately for him it is really the NJ Jets and most days at work he does not need to go into NYC.

This should be something team should brief players on when they are signed with recommendation they rent/buy in NJ.

 

NYC in general is a bottleneck for anyone travelling along I-95 corridor and decide they need to carry firearms.

 

He can't carry in NJ either. 

[Saxum]

Just now, LeviF91 said:

He can't carry in NJ either. 

At least he has better chance of licencing it there.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

 

19 hours ago, MILFHUNTER#518 said:

Except if you are connecting through a NYC area airport.

 

My brother is the ops manager for AA @ LaGuardia, he said this happens on a WEEKLY basis there. People travelling from southern states, or from the mid west on business, and their flights get diverted into the NYC area (weather, aircraft malfunction, etc). Once the plane lands, NYPD is there at the gate to arrest you (your weapons are declared to TSA, so they see the gun on the paperwork when it lands and docks at the gate). The Queens county DA hits you with felony weapons charges which carry 2 yrs in prison, and a $10,000 fine. At a minimum you will have to pay the fine (not to mention exorbitant legal bills), avoiding jail time only if you have no priors.

 

The messed up thing is most of these people intentionally tried to avoid connecting in NYC, and circumstances beyond their control forced them to be there against their will. 

 

Like Sherpa said, this would not make sense with regard to a gun being legally carried onto a plane (air marshal or other specially authorized individuals). 

I don't think NYPD is arresting any Federal LEO or air marshals.  Anyone else has no business carrying a weapon on the plane regardless of where they're to or from and should be arrested; carry of a firearm on a plane by a citizen is not approved by the TSA no matter what the law may be at the origin or departure location.

 

 

[Mr. WEO]

The details are confusing.  First it says that he was busted "as he was trying to board" a flight.  Then is says he was busted at the "Delta check-in counter" and that the gun was in a "carry on".

 

First, unless he was checking a bag, he wouldn't need to go to the "check in counter".  Second, even if he did, how would they know there was a gun in his carry on, unless he volunteered that info?   It would have been seen going through security obviously.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

52 minutes ago, Limeaid said:

 

I consider TSA a very quasi-legal organization.  I used to have items taken from my luggage regularly and used to carry broken stuff for thieves to take since they would often only take one valuable item.  I used to seal my luggage inside with plastic with a paper showing inventory/photo of contents.  After repeatedly filing for and get compensation from airlines the issue stopped.  Not sure if airline had investigation started and if baggage thief was caught/fired.

 

 

...TSA is so effed up......here is my Cliff Notes "Great Belt Buckle Caper"......my then 14 year old daughter and her friend traveling with us on vacation bought belt buckles at an Orlando Flea Market, which they should have packed in their luggage versus carry ons.....the "TSA Tough Guy (probably a former McDonald's Drive Thru Executive)" accused them of attempting to board plane with "weapons" because he judged they resembled "brass knuckles", thus confiscated....his female co-worker looked me in the eye, rolled hers and shook her head.......WTF?...they pulled me aside for name, rank, serial number & photos as the overseeing parent....TSA called the parents of my daughter's friend to warn them.....wrote a letter to empty suit Chertoff.....they spent THOUSANDS on reports, pictures, etc.......

[Mr. WEO]

2 hours ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

 

...TSA is so effed up......here is my Cliff Notes "Great Belt Buckle Caper"......my then 14 year old daughter and her friend traveling with us on vacation bought belt buckles at an Orlando Flea Market, which they should have packed in their luggage versus carry ons.....the "TSA Tough Guy (probably a former McDonald's Drive Thru Executive)" accused them of attempting to board plane with "weapons" because he judged they resembled "brass knuckles", thus confiscated....his female co-worker looked me in the eye, rolled hers and shook her head.......WTF?...they pulled me aside for name, rank, serial number & photos as the overseeing parent....TSA called the parents of my daughter's friend to warn them.....wrote a letter to empty suit Chertoff.....they spent THOUSANDS on reports, pictures, etc.......

 

I was singled out for a "groin anomaly". (I kid you not).   After the X-ray, I had to be pulled aside where the dude got very comfortable running up my inseam.  He explained that due to "a groin anomaly" he had to do a more "involved and thorough" palpation.

 

ThIs seemed strange to me.  So when I got the the gate I googled "groin anomaly" and found some news articles about a scam at airports where a TSA screener, usually a woman , would identify a guy who she thought one of her male colleagues (who was so inclined) would enjoy patting down.  She would call over "male security check" and the dudes would go to town.

 

Right after that I got Pre Check.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

2 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

I was singled out for a "groin anomaly". (I kid you not).   After the X-ray, I had to be pulled aside where the dude got very comfortable running up my inseam.  He explained that due to "a groin anomaly" he had to do a more "involved and thorough" palpation.

 

ThIs seemed strange to me.  So when I got the the gate I googled "groin anomaly" and found some news articles about a scam at airports where a TSA screener, usually a woman , would identify a guy who she thought one of her male colleagues (who was so inclined) would enjoy patting down.  She would call over "male security check" and the dudes would go to town.

 

Right after that I got Pre Check.

 

...I now have it as well...my late aunt and uncle, both in their mid 80's at the time, were traveling from Virginia to Roch-Cha-Cha for a family reunion...they were stripped searched BOTH ways......only thing Iccan think that would have triggered it was his really bad Clairol dye job......it was pretty terrifying...........

[Saxum]

5 hours ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

 

...TSA is so effed up......here is my Cliff Notes "Great Belt Buckle Caper"......my then 14 year old daughter and her friend traveling with us on vacation bought belt buckles at an Orlando Flea Market, which they should have packed in their luggage versus carry ons.....the "TSA Tough Guy (probably a former McDonald's Drive Thru Executive)" accused them of attempting to board plane with "weapons" because he judged they resembled "brass knuckles", thus confiscated....his female co-worker looked me in the eye, rolled hers and shook her head.......WTF?...they pulled me aside for name, rank, serial number & photos as the overseeing parent....TSA called the parents of my daughter's friend to warn them.....wrote a letter to empty suit Chertoff.....they spent THOUSANDS on reports, pictures, etc.......

 

And I have worked jobs where I saw costs for those reports, pictures, etc as "expenses".  It is amazing what markups company put to milk money out of government agencies.

 

Julius Levinson:
You didn't think they actually spent ten thousand dollars for a hammer and thirty thousand for a toilet seat, did you?

[Mr. WEO]

20 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

...I now have it as well...my late aunt and uncle, both in their mid 80's at the time, were traveling from Virginia to Roch-Cha-Cha for a family reunion...they were stripped searched BOTH ways......only thing Iccan think that would have triggered it was his really bad Clairol dye job......it was pretty terrifying...........

 

 

yeah it's crazy.  These are the least educated individuals in the chain between you and your plane....and they LOVE lording over the masses, rich or poor.   Shouting, berating, slow rolling the luggage x-ray belt.  harassing the elderly.  They cannot hide their contempt for the travelers in front of them.  Huge power trip. It's an upside down system.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

4 minutes ago, Limeaid said:

 

And I have worked jobs where I saw costs for those reports, pictures, etc as "expenses".  It is amazing what markups company put to milk money out of government agencies.

 

Julius Levinson:
You didn't think they actually spent ten thousand dollars for a hammer and thirty thousand for a toilet seat, did you?

 

 

..my daughter was uncontrollably crying to the point of hyperventilating........I could feel my rage getting to the boiling over point........they hauled me off to a private room for interrogation.....

1 minute ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

yeah it's crazy.  These are the least educated individuals in the chain between you and your plane....and they LOVE lording over the masses, rich or poor.   Shouting, berating, slow rolling the luggage x-ray belt.  harassing the elderly.  They cannot hide their contempt for the travelers in front of them.  Huge power trip. It's an upside down system.

 

....yup....and for most of them, it's a quantum leap from making biggie fries.......their Barney Fife badge is pretty weighty..............

[MILFHUNTER#518]

1 minute ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

 

Like Sherpa said, this would not make sense with regard to a gun being legally carried onto a plane (air marshal or other specially authorized individuals). 

I don't think NYPD is arresting any Federal LEO or air marshals.  Anyone else has no business carrying a weapon on the plane regardless of where they're to or from and should be arrested; concealed carry by a citizen is not approved by the TSA no matter what the law may be at the origin or departure location.

 

 

Agreed on the first paragraph. The people that are being pinched are not carrying in the cabin, but have it checked in with TSA and stowed in their luggage and happen (through ignorance or circumstance) to go through the check in counter or terminal at LGA. 

 

My brother and I were talking last night, and he said alot of these folks are government officials at the state level and think since they are elected they can just carry anywhere. A couple of years ago a texas state official was busted with a gun in his check in bag. He thought since he was a state official he could transport it anywhere. 

 

The city laws suck. They are UNCONSTITUTIONAL.  City laws should not trump federal laws, especially if they are in regard to constitutional amendments. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

2 hours ago, MILFHUNTER#518 said:

Agreed on the first paragraph. The people that are being pinched are not carrying in the cabin, but have it checked in with TSA and stowed in their luggage and happen (through ignorance or circumstance) to go through the check in counter or terminal at LGA. 

 

My brother and I were talking last night, and he said alot of these folks are government officials at the state level and think since they are elected they can just carry anywhere. A couple of years ago a texas state official was busted with a gun in his check in bag. He thought since he was a state official he could transport it anywhere. 

 

The city laws suck. They are UNCONSTITUTIONAL.  City laws should not trump federal laws, especially if they are in regard to constitutional amendments. 

 

I don't think we should get into that last here.  Beyond the football relevance...good topic for the PPP

 

Regarding the Texas State Official, though, friend of mine told about driving from Champaign, IL to Houston for his first job after he graduated with an advanced engineering degree.   "When I crossed the Texas border, they stopped my car and searched it for firearms.....Fortunately, I had some, so they let me in!!!!"