Covid-19 discussion and humor thread [Was: CDC says don't touch your face to avoid Covid19...Vets to the rescue!

[May Day 10]

I have to say, my anxiety level on all this peaked about 3 days ago and has receded to pre-3/11 levels (that Wednesday was when I started to freak out, well before my friends and family).

 

Part of it (maybe a large part) is I know 3-5 people who currently have it.  Only 1 of them counts toward the 30,000 or whoever has it in the US (and Erie County).  They are for the most part very fine and just recuperating at home.  A little bit of familiarity makes it less scary and is a reminder that this is not a doomsday virus.  I feel like the hospitalization and mortality rate are likely a lot lesser than what we have been conditioned to accept.  Other than celebrities and politicians, the people who are getting tested are those with severe symptoms for the most part.  

 

Now I understand everything that goes into a desperate need to flatten the curve and how we need to curb the load on medical facilities.  Also the fact that it is a serious ailment in many patients.  

 

We are going to be under lockdown and things will get weird (and probably a bit crazy/frightening over the next 2 weeks).  But it will pass.  Lots of minds are working towards treatments, testing etc.  The economy will be there for us on the back side of it.  

 

[Foxx]

Oregon has now issued a, 'stay at home' order.

Edited March 23, 2020 by Foxx

[Sundancer]

 

I'll take any ray of sunshine. 

 

Question for you or anyone who might know. What is the mass availability of some of these? 

 

Let's assume just here in the US of A (ignoring the worldwide cases), we are soon at a rate of tens of thousands of people needing treatment a day, over a course of days, is there anything on hand to meet that demand? Assuming the answer is "no" as I assume it will be, do you have insight into when it would be available to keep up with such demand? I've looked online about the malaria meds and those can come fast but not in huge quantities for several weeks. These I imagine would take more time but I am not sure. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

27 minutes ago, Sundancer said:

 

I'll take any ray of sunshine. 

 

Question for you or anyone who might know. What is the mass availability of some of these? 

 

Let's assume just here in the US of A (ignoring the worldwide cases), we are soon at a rate of tens of thousands of people needing treatment a day, over a course of days, is there anything on hand to meet that demand? Assuming the answer is "no" as I assume it will be, do you have insight into when it would be available to keep up with such demand? I've looked online about the malaria meds and those can come fast but not in huge quantities for several weeks. These I imagine would take more time but I am not sure. 

 

Chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine are common antimalarials.  Hydroxychloroquine is also used to treat inflammatory diseases such as Lupus.  These are relatively inexpensive drugs, manufactured by several companies in multiple locations - more abroad than in US but 2 plants here (I think).  Production could ramp up fairly quickly, but in "drug terms" fairly quickly means ~ a month.  Assuming the supply chain is good (ie that raw materials are available - unknown)

 

If it turns out to be part of the magic bullet, azythromycin is also a generic antibiotic now, and production (given supply chain) could be ramped up fairly quickly.

 

Tens of thousands?  That will be a stretch, even for these common drugs - it could be done, but it would require basically a coordinated National effort to repurpose drug manufacturing lines, open up shuttered plants, etc etc etc. - for drug companies, it would mean shuttering high-profit lines to turn out critical, low-profit drugs.  We've done things like this before with polio vaccine, penicillin etc but it requires careful planning and direction at the national level to ensure other needed drugs don't go short.

 

Some of the other drugs being looked at (Remdesivir) are experimental - there's a Phase III manufacturing process for it, which means it could be transferred to a number of appropriate plants if there isn't someone currently producing it.  But that would take longer, purely from the get equipment-install equipment-validate equipment- etc dance that safe pharmaceutical manufacture requires.

 

There are a couple drugs being looked at in Chinese clinical trials I just don't know much about - Favipirovir (or Favilavir) - it's an influenza drug manufactured in Japan, and has undergone Phase III trials here, but I don't think it was ever approved because of unacceptable incidence of birth defects.  It's an approved medicine in China and Japan, and it's a small molecule, so manufacture should transfer but this would take longer - it's not just red tape, it's a matter of making sure the right equipment is in the right sequence and performing up to spec.  I believe there's a petition underway to make it available on a "compassionate use" basis in the US. 

 

 

 

[Gray Beard]

1 minute ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine are common antimalarials.  Hydroxychloroquine is also used to treat inflammatory diseases such as Lupus.  These are relatively inexpensive drugs, manufactured by several companies in multiple locations - more abroad than in US but 2 plants here (I think).  Production could ramp up fairly quickly, but in "drug terms" fairly quickly means ~ a month.  Assuming the supply chain is good (ie that raw materials are available - unknown)

 

If it turns out to be part of the magic bullet, azythromycin is also a generic antibiotic now, and production (given supply chain) could be ramped up fairly quickly.

 

Tens of thousands?  That will be a stretch, even for these common drugs - it could be done, but it would require basically a coordinated National effort to repurpose drug manufacturing lines, open up shuttered plants, etc etc etc. - for drug companies, it would mean shuttering high-profit lines to turn out critical, low-profit drugs.  We've done things like this before with polio vaccine, penicillin etc but it requires careful planning and direction at the national level to ensure other needed drugs don't go short.

 

Some of the other drugs being looked at (Remdesivir) are experimental - there's a Phase III manufacturing process for it, which means it could be transferred to a number of appropriate plants if there isn't someone currently producing it.

 

There are a couple drugs being looked at in Chinese clinical trials I just don't know much about - Favipirovir (or Favilavir) - it's an influenza drug manufactured in Japan, and has undergone Phase III trials here, but I don't think it was ever approved because of unacceptable incidence of birth defects.  It's an approved medicine in China and Japan, and it's a small molecule, so manufacture should transfer but this would take longer - it's not just red tape, it's a matter of making sure the right equipment is in the right sequence and performing up to spec.  I believe there's a petition underway to make it available on a "compassionate use" basis in the US. 

 

 

 

Thank you for all you are doing.  
 

I’m about to turn 63 and I really, really, really don’t want to get this.  I tried to slog through your references, and I found the discussions of ACE Inhibitors fascinating. I take lisinopril for blood pressure, which wasn’t specifically mentioned, but if I get sick it may be of interest.  They keep saying hypertension is a big risk factor for negative outcomes.  My hypertension is controlled pretty well with medication.  I wonder how that affects hypertension as a risk factor.

[Steptide]

I have to vent a little. I just found out that I have to work next week. Right now is a slow time of year and we don't really do much, but as soon as April hits, it's all out chaos. I cannot believe they're making us work and not sure how they got around this mandate, as we are absolutely not essential. It angers me because all they care about is money, they couldnt care less about employee safety 

[ALF]

2020 Tokyo Olympics Will Be Postponed Due to Coronavirus, Says IOC's Dick Pound

 

The 2020 Summer Olympics in Tokyo will be postponed because of the coronavirus pandemic, likely until 2021, International Olympic Committee member Dick Pound told Christine Brennan of USA Today.

 

"On the basis of the information the IOC has, postponement has been decided," Pound said. "The parameters going forward have not been determined, but the Games are not going to start on July 24, that much I know."

 

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2881956-2020-tokyo-olympics-will-be-postponed-due-to-coronavirus-says-iocs-dick-pound?utm_source=cnn.com&utm_campaign=editorial&utm_medium=referral

[Sundancer]

 

30 minutes ago, Steptide said:

I have to vent a little. I just found out that I have to work next week. Right now is a slow time of year and we don't really do much, but as soon as April hits, it's all out chaos. I cannot believe they're making us work and not sure how they got around this mandate, as we are absolutely not essential. It angers me because all they care about is money, they couldnt care less about employee safety 

 

Lots of people would be pretty happy to be working right now (unless they are doctors or nurses). What do you do? 

[Steptide]

3 minutes ago, Sundancer said:

 

 

Lots of people would be pretty happy to be working right now (unless they are doctors or nurses). What do you do? 

Landscaping/lawncare. Don't get me wrong, I don't mind working and getting a paycheck. I actually worry more about going from place to place. I'm still relatively young (39) but my mom is in her 70s with cancer and that makes a little nervous. It is what it is, but this is purely greed on my employers part 

[BillsFan4]

@Hapless Bills Fan re:our conversation before.

 

 

from the Associated Press. reliable source IMO.

 

Edited to insert link to actual story:
https://apnews.com/5dd6b30e03542b435e2716e3e3a483e4

 

[Edit: From discussion with AP sportswriter John Wawrow, AP's standard is that something must be verified by two primary sources before publication (primary meaning "I heard it said", not "I heard a guy who knows a guy who heard it"]

[BillsFan4]

 

?‍♂️

 

Edit - interview with the woman who took the drug:

 

https://twitter.com/vaughnhillyard/status/1242253997005664257?s=21

 

Edited March 24, 2020 by BillsFan4

[K-9]

1 minute ago, BillsFan4 said:

 

?‍♂️

People are F ing crazy. Not that we didn’t know that, but Christ!

 

On another note, I get the distinct impression that administration and its advisers have determined that the virus has done enough damage to the economy as the “cure has become worse than the problem.” I don’t think the virus agrees, but whatever. We are in deep crap, regardless. 

[Augie]

1 hour ago, Steptide said:

I have to vent a little. I just found out that I have to work next week. Right now is a slow time of year and we don't really do much, but as soon as April hits, it's all out chaos. I cannot believe they're making us work and not sure how they got around this mandate, as we are absolutely not essential. It angers me because all they care about is money, they couldnt care less about employee safety 

 

I totally get it and I feel for you. Glad you are outdoors and, at least where I am, it’s pretty quiet out there.  We are basically in hide at home mode other than groceries, and even that I’ve cut way back on trips. 

 

We have a landscape company that does our entire HOA. I never get close to the crews, we all just nod and smile. My small front yard had some stuff die on us. Tomorrow a designer is coming by to talk about some changes to front and rear yards. It is completely understood that we will NOT be even remotely close to each other. I’d maybe more concerned with the people you work with, if any, touching stuff, coughing, etc. 

 

Good luck to you and your mom!  Hope this is behind us all soon! 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

12 minutes ago, K-9 said:

People are F ing crazy. Not that we didn’t know that, but Christ!

 

On another note, I get the distinct impression that administration and its advisers have determined that the virus has done enough damage to the economy as the “cure has become worse than the problem.” I don’t think the virus agrees, but whatever. We are in deep crap, regardless. 

 

I would just to say once again: We are NOT in "deep crap", regardless. 

 

In this country, we have an uncontained outbreak of an epidemic disease.  We know how to contain this.  There are books on how to contain this.  Scientists who worked at the US CDC wrote many of those books.

 

With regard to this specific disease, we have have the example of other countries in front of us - democracies - on how they contained this.

 

We are not in deep crap, regardless.  But if we fail to take known, proven successful, public health measures to contain this - if we continue to take half measures, don't develop, announce, and execute a coherent national plan, THEN indeed, we will be in deep crap.

 

6 hours ago, Foxx said:

MA and MI just mandated stay at home orders for their states.

 

Finally.

 

[Foxx]

26 minutes ago, BillsFan4 said:

 

?‍♂️

[K-9]

8 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I would just to say once again: We are NOT in "deep crap", regardless. 

 

In this country, we have an uncontained outbreak of an epidemic disease.  We know how to contain this.  There are books on how to contain this.  Scientists who worked at the US CDC wrote many of those books.

 

With regard to this specific disease, we have have the example of other countries in front of us - democracies - on how they contained this.

 

We are not in deep crap, regardless.  But if we fail to take known, proven successful, public health measures to contain this - if we continue to take half measures, don't develop, announce, and execute a coherent national plan, THEN indeed, we will be in deep crap.

 

 

Finally.

 

You misinterpret my source of the crap. So on that note, if the feds determine that the “cure has become worse than the problem” as they’ve flat out said and decide that people need to get back to work sooner than is deemed safe, I’d say we are in deep crap because that means that the public health measures will no longer be the priority. 
 

Making the cure less of the problem doesn’t even meet a half measure. 

[May Day 10]

possible glimmer of hope in Italy?

 

https://thehill.com/policy/healthcare/public-global-health/489062-new-coronavirus-cases-drop-in-italy-for-second-day

 

[Lurker]

47 minutes ago, K-9 said:

On another note, I get the distinct impression that administration and its advisers have determined that the virus has done enough damage to the economy as the “cure has become worse than the problem.” I don’t think the virus agrees, but whatever. We are in deep crap, regardless. 

 

I tend to agree with you.   

 

The Fed has finally done what Trump wanted--open the liquidity spigot full blast--and fiscal stimulus is just a few days away.   Both should be good for the financial markets, especially the risk backstops being put in place for major corporations and industries.

 

 So, risk on, baby...drive the MF stock market back up!      So what if a few million old people won't get to see it...

[Hapless Bills Fan]

29 minutes ago, Lurker said:

 

I tend to agree with you.   

 

The Fed has finally done what Trump wanted--open the liquidity spigot full blast--and fiscal stimulus is just a few days away.   Both should be good for the financial markets, especially the risk backstops being put in place for major corporations and industries.

 

 So, risk on, baby...drive the MF stock market back up!      So what if a few million old people won't get to see it...

 

I would just like to note that reportedly 40% of those hospitalized with severe covid-19 disease and even critical, are age 20-49

And if the hospital systems collapse because they are overloaded, and because inadequately protected HCW are too sick to work, that 40% won't live either

 

And if inadequately protected doctors and nurses die of covid-19, it will cripple our health care system for a generation

 

Carry on...

 

I personally don't think that the markets will respond to anything until there is a coherent national plan to contain the pandemic.  But I am not a financial analyst, and that is entirely an unqualified personal opinion.

 

 

 

54 minutes ago, K-9 said:

You misinterpret my source of the crap. So on that note, if the feds determine that the “cure has become worse than the problem” as they’ve flat out said and decide that people need to get back to work sooner than is deemed safe, I’d say we are in deep crap because that means that the public health measures will no longer be the priority. 
 

Making the cure less of the problem doesn’t even meet a half measure. 

 

Thank you for explaining, you're right, I did misinterpret

[John in Jax]

I saw the 70+ year old Lt Governor of Texas (Dan Patrick....no, not the sports radio talk guy) tonight on TV, and he made a real good case for not having "the cure be more devastating than the disease." He feels that if we let the mass "shelter in place" orders remain in effect for too long, the American way of life as we all know it, may be forever changed in a very negative way.